New stretch goals for companions and wilderness areas?

[ReyVagabond]

Yes I would like more stretch goals, but only if not clashes with the game schedule.

 

It could be cool, to have some kind of expansion, after the game lunches, or a living world, where game updates are implemented around each month. With new classes and so on, maybe moding tools, etc.

A player base funded game needs to keep that mind set and build on that so we can keep the game growing.

[rjshae]

MONK CLASS QUEST!!

 

<Throws money wildly at developers>

 

<Flees the scene giggling like a maniac>

 

Picturing the class quest for a society of flaggelants....

[Oiciec]

Hi there.

My thoughts:

 

1. first of all - more of everything BUT ONLY if it wont colide with schedule and game balance eg wilderness are ok but the game is not hack`n`slash style so rather not as a simple place to grind exp on monsters... unless its Mega Dungeon or those will have a background story/will start quest/will be a part of some plot etc

 

2. i know that people are dying, but having a chance to make a real gem amongst games should be worth more then schedule: i dont mind if release date ll be pushed to spring/summer 2015 /wasteland 2 anyone?/ but i would like to recive finished & polished product /case of the witcher part one and enchanced edition/. even if it ll cost me not having a chance to see it. i still have a daughter who should play it for me

 

there is a company in the same industry informing clients that they ll play their new game "when its done"; i know that kickstarter has its own rules but do not be harsh about terms or we will have to wait for enchanced edition. its really huge project and if something is more complicated you have a fair chance to screw it at some point. i would be glad to pass this step even with further release date

 

3. class quests would be a nice addition; would like to see them in game in similiar fashion as they were in world of warcraft at level 50 - nice story with some mobs to kill and places to visit - but let them be much longer so we will have a chance to replay the game only to find out what has happened to FunGrinder and his monk ;

Ideal situation is when you can unlock specific things only playing specific class but i know it ll be extremly complicated to implement; note that i m not saying they should make different game for every class - just 3-5 extras for each should do

 

4. Mega Dungeon was mentioned in another http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64798-some-new-stretch-goals-thoughts-mega-dungeon/ - i ll not allow anyone to take any challenge/strategy part away from me. But i can think of it as a base for 1-2 class quests eg only 1 monster on lev 2 is able to drop a polished stone which is a key to solve a puzzle, hold by druids in xxxx and that starts a mission allowing you after some trials to join their sacred circle; in the end you can be a part of some ceremonies and such, unavailable for any other character; of course you have to try to figure it out by yourself and you can also fail in your trials so druids can turn their backs... and if so i would like those trials to be more about judging, finding some solutions then "kill 8 centaurs and come back for reward" style... again: unless it will be an option: convince centaurs to stop or kill them and hide their bodies so all others ll think they left area... and again: i want to have a chance that 1 party member might got drunk in tavern /during rest/ and when you woke up there will be bunch of guards and a druid to ask you about your recent actions...

heh dreamed here a litle

 

as a conclusion: game is not done yet and i doubt they had run out of ideas how to fill it with good stuff, but they might think about expansion pack

and to be honest i would be glad to see huge things /companions, large class chains/ in expansion, some smaller content - new/more detailed areas to explore, some wilderness as "less" occupying for the team and less important for the story even now unless it wont -> ad 1.

the more = the merrier

 

and here - for all forum readers and Obsidian employees - have a great time with families and friends during Xmas and all the best for upcoming New Year!

 

Regards

[neo6874]

 

MONK CLASS QUEST!!

 

<Throws money wildly at developers>

 

<Flees the scene giggling like a maniac>

 

Picturing the class quest for a society of flaggelants....

 

 

I'm picturing this --- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgYEuJ5u1K0

 

or perhaps, the quest is actually to find the Holy Hand Grenade

[rjshae]

A highly synchron-ouched ritual....

[Guerrand]

I will take all the content I can get my hands on!  I would like to see encounters that feel random.  Remember in BG 1 when no one actually read guides and if you found someone while wandering in the woods it felt like chance?  How about it actually being like that?  Maybe on certain days an encounter could happen in one wilderness area, and on other days it would happen in a different wilderness area?  I would pay $$$ for a "wilderness encounter pack".

[Wicelo]

There is something I don't understand, they say that wilderness and adding more companions is time consuming, but how can it be since it's a 2D game we would expect the map making to be faster and easier to perform than a 3d environment. Also in their pcworld interview they say : "This game is going to be pretty darned big, but Baldur’s Gate II is huge.". Does it mean that Pillars of eternity will be smaller than Baldur's Gate 2 ?

[Hassat Hunter]

Read update... 66 I think it was. Where they lay down how a 3x3 area would take 16-man days of time to create.

It's not that easy to create maps.

 

Also companions are time consuming since... well, writing? Kinda obvious there.

[Stun]

Also in their pcworld interview they say : "This game is going to be pretty darned big, but Baldur’s Gate II is huge.". Does it mean that Pillars of eternity will be smaller than Baldur's Gate 2 ?

That's how I read it. But really, he's not saying anything here. BG2 is freakishly massive. With the exception of maybe the Elder Scrolls, all games are going to be smaller than BG2.

 

Me, I just want good density. I'll take 2 wilderness areas filled with lots of stuff to do in them, vs. 4 wilderness areas where there's nothing to do but walk around, look at the scenery and maybe engage in a couple of fights.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Stun

[Wicelo]

 

Also in their pcworld interview they say : "This game is going to be pretty darned big, but Baldur’s Gate II is huge.". Does it mean that Pillars of eternity will be smaller than Baldur's Gate 2 ?

That's how I read it. But really, he's not saying anything here. BG2 is freakishly massive. With the exception of maybe the Elder Scrolls, all games are going to be smaller than BG2

 

 

 

Well that's sad because BG2 wilderness and high level of quality is what it makes it a memorable game. I was hoping that with the increase of technologies and use of 2D we could make something bigger nowadays. What would it take, 10millions instead of 4 ?

[Stun]

Indeed. In fact, logic would dictate that creating a game like BG2 would actually be much cheaper today than what it cost to make it in 1999-2000 (which was about $5-6 million IIRC)

 

But my gut is telling me that Obsidian might be focussing their resources a bit differently. There might end up being more content in Eternity than in BG2 even if it ends up being a smaller game. For example, take a look at the companions in BG2. All of them were memorable, sure, but they were still kinda... empty. I mean, aside from Romances dialogues and the occasional one-liner interjections during major quests, therre was nothing to them. I'm betting the companons in Eternity are going to be far more fleshed out.

 

Another similar example is the stronghold, and the crafting. BG2 had several Strongholds. Again, they were memorable, but relatively speaking there wasn't much to them. But we know for a fact that while Eternity will only have 1 stronghold, it's going to be far more massive, content-wise, than the ones in BG2. Ditto with Crafting. BG2 didn't even have crafting. It just had artifact pieces that could be put together at Cromwell's forge. But Eternity's crafting is going to be quite a bit more engaging and fleshed out.

 

There's Value in that kind of stuff. The problem is that when people talk about "game size", the measurement they use is 1) # of areas; 2) # of quests 3) the scope of the story. They don't usually factor in the *density* of everything.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Stun

[Abel]

It's true Stun, even if i have no such high expectations. More fleshed out? I guess, more fleshed out at such a point? not sure.

 

@Wicelo: I would add that Baldur's gate 2 used and reused environments and textures, and sprites... massively (Blind eye caves? interiors? Illithid's caves? Sewers? etc). The areas were not very fleshed out too. I you want to see a IE game with so astounding areas that i take it for for a reference today, then try Icewind Dale 1. The Severed hand, as an example, is so beautiful and detailed (each time i'm stuned and i keep 30 minutes detailing the objects and textures on the scenery)... Baldur's gate 2 was far from this result...

 

I guess PoE is more IWD1 like than BG2 like (according to the impressive trailer).

 

 

EDIT: Oh, and like someone said: try to read Update 66 (I guess). Very informative...

 

EDIT 2: It's UPDATE 67...

Edited December 23, 2013 by Abel

[ggnorekthx]

Interesting read.  I voted "Yes," although like many others I'd prefer more concrete details with regards to delayed release date, how much money would be required, etc.

 

I'm not as concerned by the timing as some people here.  Although it may seem like a "Oh no!  We're running low on funds!" type thing, I'm guessing they actually just don't want to pay out whatever ridiculous % Kickstarter would want for another campaign there and waited until they had the Backer Portal up so we could just give the money directly to them.

[Heartsib]

Tentative yes, but, like others, I'd like to know how this would impact the current commitments first -- the schedule, the expansion pack, etc.

[talharbash]

What is worrying is that the money has clearly either dried up or is beginning to dry up

[rjshae]

 

 

Also in their pcworld interview they say : "This game is going to be pretty darned big, but Baldur’s Gate II is huge.". Does it mean that Pillars of eternity will be smaller than Baldur's Gate 2 ?

That's how I read it. But really, he's not saying anything here. BG2 is freakishly massive. With the exception of maybe the Elder Scrolls, all games are going to be smaller than BG2

 

Well that's sad because BG2 wilderness and high level of quality is what it makes it a memorable game. I was hoping that with the increase of technologies and use of 2D we could make something bigger nowadays. What would it take, 10millions instead of 4 ?

 

BG2 was also a sequel. The question for me is whether this game will be as large as BG. If PoE is successful, then perhaps PoE 2 will be comparable to BG2 in scope.

[Labadal]

What is worrying is that the money has clearly either dried up or is beginning to dry up

 

I think Obsidian has seen what has happened in some previous kickstarter projects and learned from their mistakes. I'm 100% sure that if they ran out of money, they'd be honest about it.

[mwinding]

I voted yes, especially for wilderness areas.

 

I've been replaying bg2 and although the game is massive, many times it doesn't feel that way. And I think the problem is that world feels small because every area is linked to a quest. If you want to get to Umar Hills, you just go directly there. You don't have to explore and travel through several wilderness areas to get there like in bg1. I think this ends up making the world feel much smaller even if activities/quests are densely packed into the game. I really hope this doesn't happen to PE!

[Arka]

I've voted Yes.

This is a bit surprise, and the first I've tought is if you are running out of money and if that can affect de development... but, the reason why I've kickstarted your game is the fact I trust you guys, I think you're going to make the game I've dreamed during the last years... so, let's do it if you think this is going to make the game bigger and deeper.

[Heartsib]

 

What is worrying is that the money has clearly either dried up or is beginning to dry up

 

 

Possibly, but the impression I got was that these are requests that have come up a lot, but aren't really reflected in Obsidian's game build so far. It seems more an acknowledgement that these things can be added, but aren't within the current budget.

[forgottenlor]

Indeed. In fact, logic would dictate that creating a game like BG2 would actually be much cheaper today than what it cost to make it in 1999-2000 (which was about $5-6 million IIRC)

 

But my gut is telling me that Obsidian might be focussing their resources a bit differently. There might end up being more content in Eternity than in BG2 even if it ends up being a smaller game. For example, take a look at the companions in BG2. All of them were memorable, sure, but they were still kinda... empty. I mean, aside from Romances dialogues and the occasional one-liner interjections during major quests, therre was nothing to them. I'm betting the companons in Eternity are going to be far more fleshed out.

 

Another similar example is the stronghold, and the crafting. BG2 had several Strongholds. Again, they were memorable, but relatively speaking there wasn't much to them. But we know for a fact that while Eternity will only have 1 stronghold, it's going to be far more massive, content-wise, than the ones in BG2. Ditto with Crafting. BG2 didn't even have crafting. It just had artifact pieces that could be put together at Cromwell's forge. But Eternity's crafting is going to be quite a bit more engaging and fleshed out.

 

There's Value in that kind of stuff. The problem is that when people talk about "game size", the measurement they use is 1) # of areas; 2) # of quests 3) the scope of the story. They don't usually factor in the *density* of everything.

Why would you think that? One of the main costs in making a computer game is paying out salaries for labour and those costs have increased with inflation. In fact I expect a computer programmer would make close to double what he would have made 15 years ago.

Edited December 25, 2013 by forgottenlor

[forgottenlor]

 

What is worrying is that the money has clearly either dried up or is beginning to dry up

 

 

Possibly, but the impression I got was that these are requests that have come up a lot, but aren't really reflected in Obsidian's game build so far. It seems more an acknowledgement that these things can be added, but aren't within the current budget.

 

Indeed. There was a long thread with people expressing dissapointment with having "only" 8 companions.

[Stun]

Why would you think that? One of the main costs in making a computer game is paying out salaries for labour and those costs have increased with inflation. In fact I expect a computer programmer would make close to double what he would have made 15 years ago.

The technology has advanced dramatically. The tools that Developers have to work with today are far more efficient and can do a lot more in a lot less time than what Bioware and Black Isle had to work with in 1999-2001. This leads to less man hours for every task, as well as less tasks outright. There's also the experience factor, and the fact that there's zero middle men to pay off (no publisher, no D&D licensing, no WotC licencing.) etc.

 

Adjusting for the cost of inflation is, obviously, a factor, but a mitigated one due to much of the above.

Edited December 25, 2013 by Stun

[AndreaColombo]

It's a well-known fact by now that it takes Avellone 2-3 months to write a party NPC "at his speediest" from an interview, and he's going to be moving to that Tides of whatever out of this project, so who would be writing the companions? My expectations are at PS:T level, and Avellone wrote all of those characters; if someone else ends up writing the additional ones, I'm even less interested... Hmm.

 

If your expectations are "PS:T level", I take it Planescape: Torment is among your favorite games ... which makes it rather surprising for me that you would not be interested in Torment: Tides of Numenera (as the fact that you refer to it as "Tides of whatever" seems to suggest).

 

Chris Avellone has already been doing work for it, by the way, providing feedback and creative advice on all concept and plot documents; other than that, he will only be writing one joinable NPC for that game. Chances are he can probably spare the time to write a few more for Pillars of Eternity, if they're portraying them as an option for more stretch goals (provided that writing NPCs for Pillars of Eternity is exclusively Chris's job, that is).

[Reever]

I wouldn't say "no" to more content, I guess, but I'm not sure how much/if I'd upgrade my pledge.

And doesn't PE have enough content as is?

 

Hello, by the way, I'm new here, just registered my pledge