Clichés you WANT to see in Project Eternity

[SophosTheWise]

Hello guys

 

There is a thread about clichés we don't want to see in Project Eternity. In this thread it was more or less established, that not all clichés are necessarily bad (because they help us with the identification of the world among other reasons). So, we've talked a lot about what clichés we hate - why not about the things we love?

 

For me:

 

- If there are Landsknechts, make them those typical raping, binge-drinking, morally disturbed, loud and insulting Landsknechts.

- Wizards of all sorts are OBLIGED to wearing those classy pointy wizard hats instead of those boring robes-with-hoods.

- Drinking dwarves with beards. Drinking needs no explanation. As for beards: I was so damn confused and irritated to see beardless dwarves in Dragon Age: Origins. Scottish accent wanted but optional.

- Clever, witty, gold-hoarding dragons.

- THE bard like Dandelion from The Witcher 2 or every other smooth talker in a good ol' D&D session.

 

Let's hear yours!

Edited November 5, 2012 by SophosTheWise

[HeedlessHorseman]

I've always been partial to the absent-minded professorish wizard.

[SophosTheWise]

I've always been partial to the absent-minded professorish wizard.

 

Well, or the Rincewind-type!

[LordCrash]

- If there are Landsknechts, make them those typical raping, binge-drinking, morally disturbed, loud and insulting Landsknechts.

- Drinking dwarves with beards. Drinking needs no explanation. As for beards: I was so damn confused and irritated to see beardless dwarves in Dragon Age: Origins. Scottish accent wanted but optional.

- Clever, witty, gold-hoarding dragons.

- THE bard like Dandelion from The Witcher 2 or every other smooth talker in a good ol' D&D session.

I sign all of these proposals but I would like to see Dragons as shapeshifter as in the Witcher novels in addition.

 

Other things I could think of:

- a dark quarter in a big city with prostitutes who can help your party or bait it (or a brothel)

- arrogant, peasant despising nobles with a liability to luxury and excesses (hanging around in the brothel above....)

- humans who despise elves (openly or in secret) for their long life and their arrogance

- elves who despise humans (openly or in secret) for their short life and their thoughtlessness and brutality

- slippery merchants who want to cheat everybody

[Death Machine Miyagi]

Well, I know it sounds a bit cliche, but I would like for my character to be raised in a small village by a mysterious foster parent shortly before that village is attacked and destroyed by unknown evil forces. I will then be informed by an eccentric wizard with a long flowing grey beard and a wizard robe and hat that I am the Chosen One destined to face and defeat an evil that has awakened after being sealed away 10,000 years ago and is dedicated to destroying the entire world. I will face this villain and his legion of orcs accompanied by an ale-swigging bearded Scottish dwarf who hates elves and uses an axe and a warhammer, a 500 year old pointy-eared Elven ranger who is both a master bowman and at one with nature even as he laments the slow disappearance of his people, a wild and wacky gnome who adds a touch of comic relief with his wild and wacky antics, and perhaps a quiet but intimidating anti-hero who will slowly reveal his dark past to me over the course of our adventures. My main character should be strongly pushed towards using a sword, in preparation for a super-powerful magical sword that will be given to me during the course of the story which is the only thing that can defeat the Evil One, and during the story the shocking revelation that the Evil One is actually my father will be unveiled at a dramatically appropriate time. Later, after fighting my way through the fortress of the Evil One and defeating him, I will hesitate to strike the killing blow despite murdering tens of thousands of his minions previously, because if I kill him I will be just like him. I will spare him, and as I turn around and walk away he'll try to attack me again and so I'll kill him in self-defense anyway.

 

Then the Ewoks and I shall dance!

 

 

EDIT: Paragraphs are for sissies.

Edited November 5, 2012 by Death Machine Miyagi

[mcmanusaur]

I'd like there to be only one available romance option in Project Eternity, and for that individual to be revealed as my character's long-lost sibling at a dramatically appropriate time.

[LordCrash]

I'd like there to be only one available romance option in Project Eternity, and for that individual to be revealed as my character's long-lost sibling at a dramatically appropriate time.

Stop trolling, that's not a fantasy cliché at all.

[AGX-17]

- Clever, witty, gold-hoarding dragons.

 

Uh, since when was that a cliche? Gold hoarding, yes. Witty? No.

 

I'd like there to be only one available romance option in Project Eternity, and for that individual to be revealed as my character's long-lost sibling at a dramatically appropriate time.

 

Don't you mean inappropriate? Also how is this a cliche? I've yet to play a game where the romantic interest was the protagonist's sibling, and I have played a lot of Japanese games.

Edited November 5, 2012 by AGX-17

[Death Machine Miyagi]

Ahh, but I kid.

 

Let's see...I like the cliche of the nobody rising to becoming a powerhouse of destruction over the course of the game. Gives you a good sense of accomplishment when you start from nothing.

 

Really, a lot of cliches I can think of are the sorts of things that almost go unmentioned because they're so obvious: areas specifically designed for different power levels, mages having a lot of power but being fairly fragile, and so forth. They work fine and should be kept.

[mcmanusaur]

Star Wars, noobs. This thread isn't titled "fantasy cliches", just "cliches", and anything in Star Wars practically becomes a cliche.

[LordCrash]

No, it doesn't. And there wasn't even a real romance between Luke and Leia in SW (though Han thought so), so this whole thing is pointless.

Edited November 5, 2012 by LordCrash

[Death Machine Miyagi]

No, it doesn't. And there wasn't even a real romance between Luke and Leia in SW (though Han thought so), so this whole thing is pointless.

 

She did kiss him in a fairly non-sisterly way.

[TRX850]

Sewers. With a shady faction using it for their base of operations.

 

I can handle that cliché.

[SophosTheWise]

Sewers. With a shady faction using it for their base of operations.

 

I can handle that cliché.

 

Or mole-people that got driven into the sewers for whatever reason.

[Death Machine Miyagi]

The ancient civilization that was once advanced and powerful but suffered some terrible cataclysm that caused it to disappear seems almost a staple. I would hope they do something new with it, but once-great civilizations are not merely a fantasy cliche, as the Roman Empire would suggest. Perfectly fine.

 

Really, almost any cliche is alright as long as the writers put a bit of thought and distinctiveness into it rather than just regurgitating it from countless usages in the past.

[TRX850]

Characters like Deekin from NWN/HotU were interesting too. Not sure how much of a cliche that is though.

 

There was also Korax the ghoul from BG1. Although you could NPC him around for only a short time.

[Drakxii]

Wise old dude that helps you threw the first bit of the game and then dies in a traumatic way.

 

Also a wise cracking short thief, that doesn't get that stealing is stealing and is wrong.

[TRX850]

Piecemeal weapons like the Flail of Ages from BG2 that you self-assemble from scattered parts.

 

[rjshae]

• Snotty nobles that hold a handkerchief to their face as you approach and bid you begone because you're beneath their notice.
  
• A shifty-looking black market dealer standing in a shady, back corner area of the slums.
  
• Grumpy dwarves who like nothing better than drinking you under the table then bashing enemies with a battle axe.
  
• Bored, barely helpful guards who would rather have joined the army.
  
• Insane fanatics preaching at a street corner and actually being listened to seriously by a group of locals.
  

[SophosTheWise]

• Insane fanatics preaching at a street corner and actually being listened to seriously by a group of locals.
  

 

 

YES!

[SinoSamba]

Piecemeal weapons like the Flail of Ages from BG2 that you self-assemble from scattered parts.

 

 

^ This. That's my fave weapon from BG2, my cleric loved it

[Jaesun]

Myrkul's Dialogue. OH GAWD ITZ HEVAN! (Just as great as The Master's was but even better).

[Tauron]

chainmail bikinis or MageTower!

[jezz555]

Honestly none I can really think of. Not to say that everything in PE has to be original, but most cliches are bad, and I would prefer PE surprise me with something that hasn't been done before.

[SophosTheWise]

Honestly none I can really think of. Not to say that everything in PE has to be original, but most cliches are bad, and I would prefer PE surprise me with something that hasn't been done before.

 

To quote myself from this thread:

 

Well, I think we should never forget that clichées are a big part of storytelling. At least that's what I've learned from my journalistics lectures. Clichées work because they are very strong images and most of those clichés move in an area (storytellingwise), in frames as we call them.

So many conflicts in modern storytelling work because there's an archetype for many different conflict situations and characters. Good examples for frames are Robin Hood or David vs. Goliath. Clichées give us something to hold on, to orient ourselves in "known waters" so we know what's going on. Real exoticism only works for a few parts, maybe to create the mystery (and even then the exoticism is kind of a clichée).

In media linguistics there's also a thing called priming - so different terms are being primed in a setting, so we can distinguish and understand - for example the word thread has many meanings. If we are in a forum it's clear we talk about a "topic" and not a thread used for sewing. Of course that's a bit abstract but this is actually how it works en détail. I may be wrong - this is only first and second semester stuff of journalistic storytelling, so don't sue me if I'm not entirely correct

 

Maybe an easier way to explain this, is in a LARP setting. In LARPs (at least in Europe) are many people who play overly exotic characters from an even more exotic race and ultra-complicated storys. Those characters never stick with you. The most successful characters I've seen in LARPs are the easiest ones. Maybe a simple peasant, or a normal (well, normal...) Landsknecht. They were not cliché charaters at all, but they played in a certain frame that made it easy to comprehend this character.