Of Magic and Muskets...

[Electricall]

I'd prefer if guns play as big a role in PE as they do in Torment and BG2. I'm no fan of them and I really do prefer that classic high fantasy feel, with swords and sorcery being the main elements.

 

Guns don't really add much to make the experience more immersive or interesting imo. They're simple and boring.

Edited October 31, 2012 by Electricall

[Monte Carlo]

Hey thanks for missing the point. This thread isn't about your preference as guns are in. It's about how they are managed now we know they are in.

[Nomine Vacans]

Guns don't really add much to make the experience more immersive or interesting imo. They're simple and boring.

By which you mean "unfamiliar to me and different from what I used to see in other games"?

 

As medieval as chainmail and men wearing tights.

Not tights! Hoses! 100% manly!

[Sensuki]

 

Edit: Also, relevant:

 

 

I campaigned for a Holy Hand Grenade in my sig for a week. God bombs ... gunpowder ... it's the perfect opportunity for that pop culture reference.

 

I think a good Crafting System would probably solve the issues with overpowered magic items. Give guns certain enchantment slots and limit what you can imbue them with.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

To return to the subject - Let there be many guns. Let them be crazy and OTT, in the manner of Warhammer or Arcanum, only with magic as the primary reason, not SCIENCE! . Give me a musket that shoots lightning. Give me a flintlock pistol that reloads itself. Give me a holy arquebus, that can only be wielded by the pure of heart, that smites the foe with sacred fire, who being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it. Verily.

 

The lore we have seen so far has some kind of fantastic nuke being used to take out St. Waidwen - So let us wield such power on a smaller scale.

 

Also, give me an elephant gun. There shall be an elephant gun. I brook no argument. If for some unfathomable reason it does not exist within the game, it shall be modded in.

[FlintlockJazz]

To return to the subject - Let there be many guns. Let them be crazy and OTT, in the manner of Warhammer or Arcanum, only with magic as the primary reason, not SCIENCE! . Give me a musket that shoots lightning. Give me a flintlock pistol that reloads itself. Give me a holy arquebus, that can only be wielded by the pure of heart, that smites the foe with sacred fire, who being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it. Verily.

 

The lore we have seen so far has some kind of fantastic nuke being used to take out St. Waidwen - So let us wield such power on a smaller scale.

 

Also, give me an elephant gun. There shall be an elephant gun. I brook no argument. If for some unfathomable reason it does not exist within the game, it shall be modded in.

 

Sir, I like the cut of your jib sir! And I'm not just saying that because of your username and it's reference to the importance of tea from the planet Didcot...

[Juneau]

A weapon that is built to look and act like a gun but is used to focus magical energies rather than pull a trigger to fire a projectile you cast a spell and channel it into a gun.

 

Think any form of casting with your hands to create a ball of energy that you then propel but instead the magical crystal of zagamuffin which is inside of the gun feeds on your magical powers - charges and then unleashes when it reaches a certain power level.

 

Magical Gun!

[kabaliero]

i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this

 

 

but oh well..

 

 

vote for crossbows

 

somewhere..

[curryinahurry]

i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this i don't like guns in this

 

 

but oh well..

 

 

vote for crossbows

 

somewhere..

 

Then create your own thread about why you don't like firearms and stop whining on this thread.

 

On Topic: I would prefer guns themselves to be non-enchanted, but I would like ammo to be crafted that is specific to certain types of foes:

 

Salt rounds against ghosts

Holy Rounds against undead

Silver rounds against lycanthropes

Cursed rounds against divine champions

Iron rounds against fey or witches

etc.

 

To be interesting, they should not be loot or purchased, only crafted through recipies, and not instakills...but provide a weakening effect.

 

Also, I'm no expert on wheel-lock weapons, but I wonder what the rate of catastrophic failure is with these weapons and how that will be implemeted in-game

[Monte Carlo]

 

All kinds of awesome!

 

Jaunty highwayman's hat mit goggles, Lamallar-style Samurai armour, chaps, large calibre hand-cannons, rapier and (gasps) boobies.

[HungryHungryOuroboros]

Considering guns are largely used for mage-hunting, it seems like magic-users might be somewhat iffy vis-a-vis enchanting firearms.

[Monte Carlo]

Sorry for the image size but I liked this soooo much I had to post it.

 

[Hormalakh]

We only know about mages being killed by guns. Sometimes.

 

18th century Italian flintlock pistol. Very cool looking.

Maybe magic can make bullets "explode" into many pieces (like a shotgun shell) right before it hits the enemy.

 

 

Firearms appeared in Europe in the 14th century, but there is little evidence that they immediately began replacing the existing projectile weapons then in use. The inaccuracy of these early guns, and the noise and the smoke they produced, would have made them less successful than bows or crossbows as hunting weapons.

Improvements in gun making gradually made them more effective, however, their use in hunting, until the end of the 17th century at least was restricted to birds at rest. Shooting at flying birds required an effective ignition system, and by around 1700 flintlock guns designed to shoot birds on the wing had been developed.

The flintlock did have a problem though, the puff of smoke from its priming powder often gave the birds enough warning so as to avoid being hit. It wasn’t until the invention of percussion ignition by the Scottish clergyman Alexander Forsyth in the 19th century, that there was major breakthrough in smokeless ignition. The principle of which is still used today in modern small arms cartridges.

http://www.royalarmo...allery-firearms

 

Make magical guns that are "muffled", show no smoke. This would require magic since silencers didn't exist. It would be quite the deadly weapon for an assassin/thief class. The silenced wheel-lock.

 

This makes me think: Magic severely stagnates technical innovation. Why create a bullet cartridge, if you can just use magic to silence the gun or stop the smoke? Heck, why even create guns in the first place? You've got fireball!

Edited October 31, 2012 by Hormalakh

[kabaliero]

dude, until it fits the forum rules, i'monna do, like, what-ever i like;

'fraid u can't really do anythin' about it, except being unnecessarily rude

 

 

and that

is hilarious

 

reminds me of not liking guns in this

but oh well

[FlintlockJazz]

We only know about mages being killed by guns. Sometimes.

 

18th century Italian flintlock pistol. Very cool looking.

Maybe magic can make bullets "explode" into many pieces (like a shotgun shell) right before it hits the enemy.

 

 

Firearms appeared in Europe in the 14th century, but there is little evidence that they immediately began replacing the existing projectile weapons then in use. The inaccuracy of these early guns, and the noise and the smoke they produced, would have made them less successful than bows or crossbows as hunting weapons.

Improvements in gun making gradually made them more effective, however, their use in hunting, until the end of the 17th century at least was restricted to birds at rest. Shooting at flying birds required an effective ignition system, and by around 1700 flintlock guns designed to shoot birds on the wing had been developed.

The flintlock did have a problem though, the puff of smoke from its priming powder often gave the birds enough warning so as to avoid being hit. It wasn’t until the invention of percussion ignition by the Scottish clergyman Alexander Forsyth in the 19th century, that there was major breakthrough in smokeless ignition. The principle of which is still used today in modern small arms cartridges.

http://www.royalarmo...allery-firearms

 

Make magical guns that are "muffled", show no smoke. This would require magic since silencers didn't exist. It would be quite the deadly weapon for an assassin/thief class. The silenced wheel-lock.

 

This makes me think: Magic severely stagnates technical innovation. Why create a bullet cartridge, if you can just use magic to silence the gun or stop the smoke? Heck, why even create guns in the first place? You've got fireball!

 

Thank you for an awesomely informative post!

[kabaliero]

oh and speakin' of magic vs technology in this particular case

i'm inclined to think that one does not exclude the other

 

so merging of those two might have a dangerously vast impact on the inventional world progress

if successfuly put together, there would be magic computers + internet by the time of, say, 18th century

(300-400 years approx, after the invention of first.. varied.. relatively sophisticated tech devices)

 

ever cared for a sparkly iphone? crystall ball-free

Edited October 31, 2012 by kabaliero

[Corvus Metus]

Guns work great in fantasy, IMO.

 

Two of my favorite fantasy settings (Warhammer and Ravenloft) make extensive use of guns.

 

I wouldn't even mind seeing a repeating gun, a rare prototype giving as "field" testing. Don't think it completely beats believability if the setting has magical swords with flaming blades.

[Hormalakh]

I'm not denying guns being a thing. I like them and want to see them. I just posted my thoughts as I saw fit.

[JFSOCC]

The army museum in Delft here in the Netherlands has an exquisite collection of 17th century guns, and they are all quite beautiful, worked with ivory and mother of pearl, inlaid with different kinds of wood.

They have part of their collection online: http://www.collectie...on/i006253.html

 

Do browse their collection if you can, the first page doesn't have the best examples.

 

Edit: http://afbeeldingen.collectie.legermuseum.nl/wwwopac.exe?thumbnail=\\buffel\images$\\PM\images\D012\018870.jpg

small example.

Edited October 31, 2012 by JFSOCC

[Brannart]

I'd really rather there not be firearms in the game, just doesn't go well with medieval games, but oh well.. =)

 

I think one of the English Knights said something similar before the Battle of Castillon.

[Tsuga C]

 

All kinds of awesome!

 

Jaunty highwayman's hat mit goggles, Lamallar-style Samurai armour, chaps, large calibre hand-cannons, rapier and (gasps) boobies.

 

All kinds of insipid, truth be told. This is a clear case of trying too hard for the "kewl". Samurai & b00bies & pirates, oh my!

 

The work of that artist has never really struck an appealing chord with me. Ever notice how nearly all of the "bad guys" he draws are portrayed as having just bitten into a lemon rind (especially the undead) and have narrow, yellowed teeth?

[Delterius]

I'd really rather there not be firearms in the game, just doesn't go well with medieval games, but oh well.. =)

 

Good thing this isn't a medieval game.

 

And, yes, I'm being pedantic but to make a point.

[Keldorn]

I'm really interested in how guns will turn out in Project: Eternity. Since I do not really like steampunk stuff, I think it would be great if they will create these weapons to have magical influences or proportions. It'd make sense, also, since all the IE games implement magical weapons, including summoned weapons. But guns -- they can be much cooler magically enhanced than just a bright glow around their edges. Such as this one Monte Carlo posted, I think it's a great example:

 

You know this one makes sense!

 

[Wulfic]

I hate enchanted weapons. It's actually pretty dumb to run around with a flaming sword or a axe that if u throw it it always returns. I would go for realism here. http://www.glenbow.o...ry/firearms.cfm this site shows many early 16th century guns. I would take my ideas from here instead from the 17th century because the difference is tremendous

Edited November 1, 2012 by Wulfic

[Hormalakh]

From all the guns I've seen from the 14th century onward, the one thing I know that has to be different from contemporary guns is the exquisite detail put into each gun. I would assume that these things were not mass-produced; guns were hard-crafted and decorated with great care. I expect that unless the PE universe has a mass-production factory for these and other weapons, great detail and care must go into making these weapons look beautiful, even if it means just in the item description box in your inventory.

Edited November 1, 2012 by Hormalakh