On loot, and what you think of it for Project Eternity.

[Korlathar]

Pretty much what the title says, and the polls say; what would you say would be the best system or even combination of systems you'd like in Project Eternity? Would you like it if everything the characters you fight against are lootable, entirely randomized loot, what? Personally, I enjoy a combination of them; what you see is what you get, and being able to take what would otherwise be vendor trash items -- like Golden Idols or plates -- and giving them to NPCs that will give you a slight discount in return, or even open up new items to purchase, giving the player a wide variety of options. Sadly, this is not the case in most RPGs, but you know, I'm not terribly picky about it. Still love the 'you get what the character is wearing.' the best out of the options, but this being a poll, I also wanted to know what you all think, and would enjoy in Project Eternity on a personal, as well as a 'fun' level, and whatnot.

[IndiraLightfoot]

This is an interesting issue! I opted for a combination in the first question, sorta like in NWN 2. Some of the things enemies are wearing/wielding can be looted and then there are some stuff planted loot on them as well as some that are randomly generated.

The other question I really think is harder, so I'll try to explain what I want instead:

-Not too much loot, it goes for all kinds of categories

-But yes please, to a great variety of loot. Many CRPGs actually have failed in this department. Obsidian, go nuts here!

-The idea of trinkets that vendors and others may have use for/interest in is good. One good thing about DA O was gifts for NPCs, I reckon

-Add varied valuables: several kinds of coins, as well as levels of coins, gems, jewellery, barter items, valuables of all sorts

-Nothing should be treated as "vendor trash" - no grey items, filters, god no!

-Some loot can be unique, but seemingly banal: a broken drumstick, a rusty musical box, a flask of tears, and if you keep them they may come in handy later in some obscure way - it must not be main quest, rather weird side quests or just fun marginal twists to the story

[Greensleeve]

I enjoy being able to loot what I see on enemies I kill. I understand that can unbalance the game if opponents have vastly better gear than you that you're still expected to kill, but... I hate seeing someone in a full plate, kill him and find out I can't take it. It's right there! Arcanum did this pretty well.

 

On the other hand, I'd want somewhat randomized loot in containers. I don't want to be able to play through the game a few times and always find the same stuff in each container. That said, some items should be fixed. Some items should always be found where they are, no matter what. Baldur's Gate was a bit annoying on this point, as I always know where I get certain items.

 

As for vendor trash... I like the idea of valuable items with fun little descriptions, like Gold Idols, or paintings, that serve no real use. Maybe give you a discount, maybe just a source of money. On the other hand, I don't want a load of useless things just to have things. There's no point in cluttering up the inventory with crap items that I just want to off-load. There needs to be a balance. I also like Indira's idea of seemingly banal items that are very useful, or just fun, at a later point in the game if you hang on to them.

[Sensuki]

Baldur's Gate 1 style please (and the difference between Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 for me is)

 

Fixed item placement but random minor treasure on trash mobs

No random magical item drops (looking at you Icewind Dale 2)

No convenience item stacks (magical arrows and healing potions were EVERYWHERE in BG2)

Every man and his dog shouldn't have heaps of magic items (In BG1 named enemies sometimes had one (or rarely, two)).

Secret Treasure in tiny holes on the map like Ankheg Armor & Ring of Wizardry, non-highlightable.

Edited October 9, 2012 by Sensuki

[max8472]

Here I'm for realism. Everything NPCs/enemies equip is loot.

[general_azure]

Not quite sure on what to pick here... random loot is fine for me, but only for minor stuff on characters or containers. No golden parade armor in some broken barrel behind the inn please. Wysiwyg is a must imho, if the item is too powerful for player use I want to salvage parts and scraps from the remains at least.

"Trash" is neat both in the glittering but otherwise useless form (all those fancy gems in BG), as well as all the crap you got in arcanum and could possibly use in some obscure crafting project. Wouldn't grey them out though, leave it up to the player to decide whether that lump of coal is worthwhile keeping around.

[Jaesun]

Meaningful well placed random loot wold be wonderful. What need to go away is finding diamond's in trees and Gauntlets of Ogre Power in the dock area of Baldur's Gate. That was terribly done.

[Sensuki]

The Gauntlets of Weapon Expertise were for a quest, there was a woman in a nearby house who left her bracers in one of the crates from a ship or something.

 

I loved the little secret holes in stuff though. Diamond in a tree, Ring of Wizardry buried in the dirt, yes please.

[rjshae]

I'd be happy with a looting system that had filters; show all goods :: show goods above a certain value/mass :: show only the most valuable goods :: show unique items :: show goods of specific types, &c.

 

But mostly I'd like a looting system that isn't tediously repetitive. (Discussed elsewhere in another thread.)

[LadyCrimson]

I've never understood games that had tons of "rusty half-broken iron sword" type items that do less damage than even a "regular," plain, basic sword...that no one was ever going to use in the first place. Why bother. It's just clutter on the ground.

 

In games like PE, I prefer loot that is at least somewhat randomized. Certain enemies/quest things having special gear is fine...as are hidden, secret stashes etc... but to repeat myself, on replays, I don't want to know that a chest in this one pub bedroom will always contain a sapphire and 20 gold. So at the least there should be a list of possible things that can be in common/everyday chests and enemy drops that the game randomly chooses from, so it'll feel a bit varied.

 

I have no desire to loot someone's 5copper nose ring, unless it's a Nose Charm of Flu Immunity.

[Hassat Hunter]

I've chosen random loot of a list, and other.

Why?

 

I prefer it with fixed items where appropriate. And randomnised otherwised. Though not truly random, as that could lead to weird stuff like all random loot games show (chickens with halberds anyone?). It would definitely add to the replayability.

What you see is what you get is just too much. Not every enemy killed needs items picked from, that would just lead to major inventory clutter. And why would I want to carry around 25 1gp boots? So yeah, it's better just to keep it to the minimum.

 

Which would be my same opinion for "vendor loot". Funny since there wasn't a 'none'. It should atleast have some description. And preferably actually be used for something, like a sidequest. You can always buy it back. Well, unless a vendor got killed or kidnapped or something, but that would be OE's issue .

[Osvir]

What Loot Systems Do You Like?

 

 

A What you see is what you get; whatever the character is wearing is entirely lootable.

 

B A combination of random loot, generated loot, or 'what you see is what you get' loot.

 

C Everything the character had on them, from the shoes to their nose ring, you can plunder.

 

 

Vendor Trash: What do You Like Best?

 

D Greyed out items that have a history/description, can be used as crafting/enchanting materials, or sold as vendor trash.

 

 

Why these?

 

A & C, For realism

B, For variety

 

D, really most important. I choose the Junk Items with fun little descriptions first, but realized that this could fulfill that purpose as well and be used in crafting which I reckon is going to be a pretty big part of the game.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Osvir

[Ignatius]

Fighting a tough enemy with an amazing robe/armor/sword/boots/etc and being on the receiving end of it's power before acquiring it yourself is probably one of the most satisfying moments of the IE games. So hopefully there's a lot of that.

[Archmage Silver]

I'd like to see a combination of static loot placement (Baldur's Gate) and semi-random loot generation (Icewind Dale). The semi-random loot generation would simply generate an item from a premade limited loot list, which would be set by hand to avoid generating overpowered or illogical items for the location in question. A combination of the two would result in the best experience in my opinion. This would be especially true for a second playthrough with players knowing where the really good stuff is (static), but still maintaining an element of surprise in regards to some items (semi-random).

[Sensuki]

See I prefer the static item option in this style of game, because in the pool of random items there's going to be one that suits your character/party for that playthrough. In Icewind Dale 2 I either save-scummed or swapped out the item for the one I wanted in Dalekeeper. That is a power-gaming offense though.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Sensuki

[Hormalakh]

I think one way to rethink the whole "you should be able to pick up every dead person's armor and weapon" is that either it is fairly random or when you've killed the enemy their armor might be retrievable but it's so badly damaged (you did just kill the guy wearing it) that you have to spend money to repair it before you can use it. So in early-game you won't be able to get that plate armor from the guard just because you killed him because the repair costs are too prohibitive. However, later on you can repair the armor but at that point you've already got the plate armor and weight becomes prohibitive.

[Carlo]

My bottom line is that a loot system should be realistic enough to provide logical rewards, but not slavishly so to the point that its mechanics become burdensome or bog the game down. Some randomness is also nice to see for variety's sake, both in general and with special cases. I've recalled a few times when a particular loot drop has given a class-specific or otherwise tailored item depending on the main character, which makes it more meaningful.

 

In my own mods (NWN/NWN2) I have mostly gone the realistic route and have NPCs drop everything they're carrying, since I'm aiming for a high realism/immersion factor. However, I also do not design mods that have hordes of monsters or enemy NPCs to be faced in combat, so that kind of model is manageable. When faced with lots of lower-level or more generic enemies, a random selection from a selected loot table probably makes more sense in terms of accumulation and can also effectively model things like equipment being destroyed or otherwise lost in combat.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Carlo