Bomb and shooting in Norway

[Gorth]

I heard Norwegian prisons are really chic. He sure will have a "hell" of a time there.

Unless he's declared insane, in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward. The equivalent of a life sentence.

[Morgoth]

in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward.

Must be horrible. Getting gently talked to by beautiful female psychiatrists the whole day "But you're special! You can change if you just want! Do you want a massage to feel better?".

[Flouride]

I heard Norwegian prisons are really chic. He sure will have a "hell" of a time there.

Unless he's declared insane, in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward. The equivalent of a life sentence.

 

No way they are letting him out ever. It's pretty easy to bury him in some psych ward for the rest of his days when his prison time is over.

 

Morgoth, I'm pretty sure the guy will find himself in solitaire confinment. So yeah, that might be hell for some people. I just hope they don't give him any luxuries such as tv and/or computer with internet. If he would be among rest of the prison population he wouldn't last very long.

[Gorth]

in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward.

Must be horrible. Getting gently talked to by beautiful female psychiatrists the whole day "But you're special! You can change if you just want! Do you want a massage to feel better?".

Heh, if that's what you imagine what a ward looks like

 

I've seen them with chemical castration/pacification, straight jackets and padded walls (and nurses that makes Ilse, the camp guard seem gentle by comparison).

[Nepenthe]

in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward.

Must be horrible. Getting gently talked to by beautiful female psychiatrists the whole day "But you're special! You can change if you just want! Do you want a massage to feel better?".

Heh, if that's what you imagine what a ward looks like

 

I've seen them with chemical castration/pacification, straight jackets and padded walls (and nurses that makes Ilse, the camp guard seem gentle by comparison).

+The nurses I have seen have been largely male and built like the proverbial brick **** houses. The largest man I have ever seen in my life worked as a guard at one of the two Finnish asylums that treat criminal patients (Niuvanniemi, for those following on your maps at home). Interesting if Norway really doesn't carry even the option for an "indefinite" life sentence for premeditated murder, they might want to revisit that a bit.

 

p.s. personally consider separation from society good enough by itself, no need for appeasement of a masturbatory thirst of vengeance.

 

p.p.s. Flouride, if you think that your description matches the Finnish prison regime, I have to point out that there is strictly no internet access for the inmates, as all communication is monitored. The TVs and game consoles are largely there to prevent them from getting into mischief (less inclined to make shivs and shank each other or the guards if they are otherwise occupied). Too bad few people realise the reasons for this.

Edited July 23, 2011 by Nepenthe

[Meshugger]

in which case he'll end up indefinitely in a psychiatric ward.

Must be horrible. Getting gently talked to by beautiful female psychiatrists the whole day "But you're special! You can change if you just want! Do you want a massage to feel better?".

 

Most likely not. I have friends who works as nurses (male) at a closed psychiatric ward and by their telling it is more like a blend of the ward where Hannibal Lecter was in silence of the lambs and like in one flew out of the cuckoo's nest, except there aren't any women. Just brick walls, silence and lots of prescription drugs.

[WDeranged]

So who do we bomb to put all this to rights?

 

*edit*

 

I just found a quote from the Norwegian PM,

 

"We will retaliate with more democracy, transparency and openness"

 

Norway.

 

F*** Yeah!

Edited July 23, 2011 by WDeranged

[Flouride]

p.p.s. Flouride, if you think that your description matches the Finnish prison regime, I have to point out that there is strictly no internet access for the inmates, as all communication is monitored. The TVs and game consoles are largely there to prevent them from getting into mischief (less inclined to make shivs and shank each other or the guards if they are otherwise occupied). Too bad few people realise the reasons for this.

 

Aye, I have no information what the inmates have (othe than the tvs) in Finnish prisons, I was merely speculating. But anyways solitaire confinment without tv and no possibilities of suicide would be pretty much of a hell for most people.

[Morgoth]

So who do we bomb to put all this to rights?

 

*edit*

 

I just found a quote from the Norwegian PM,

 

"We will retaliate with more democracy, transparency and openness"

 

Norway.

 

F*** Yeah!

Haven't you heard? Multikult is the solution to extremism and bigotry.

[Rosbjerg]

For those who can read Norwegian here's a personal account from one of the survivors on the island.

[obyknven]

Neo-templars

 

http://www.veoh.com/watch/v21123164bZCBQeZ8

 

Well, well, well ...this is getting more and more interesting as more details are being revealed about the motives of the accused.

 

Yesterday we detailed that Anders Behring Breivik is a freemason.

 

He is a member of the John lodge St. Olaus TD Three pillars of the Norwegian Masonic Order. He has 3 degree status, where the peak is ten degrees.

 

 

Edited July 24, 2011 by obyknven

[Gorgon]

Proper crazy. Being a fervent nationalist yourself, you should be able to relate.

[obyknven]

Breivik Asks and Answers His Own Questions:

 

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8...2084895,00.html

 

[Hell Kitty]

Charlie Brooker: The news coverage of the Norway mass-killings was fact-free conjecture

 

Glenn Greenwald: The omnipotence of Al Qaeda and meaninglessness of "Terrorism"

[GreasyDogMeat]

Exact same thing happened in Tucson back in January. It WAS a tea-partier who shot Giffords to death. Until it wasn't a tea-partier and she wasn't dead.

[Gorgon]

That's the nature of live reporting. Lots and lots of filler required and pretty soon you are talking about conjecture as if it were fact. Back in the day they used to make a special news update when there was something to tell. Now it's all live feed of clueless reporters on the scene.

[Gorgon]

It took them a long time to get the swat squad to the island and the closest police could have been there more quickly. It might not have been protocol, it might have been considerably more dangerous for an ad hoc group of first responders, but shouldn't they have tried anyway, given the stakes.

 

Are there times where we demand from cops that they set aside concerns for personal safety ?

Edited July 25, 2011 by Gorgon

[Rosbjerg]

Well at the time they didn't know how many were there - if there was more explosives, etc. I'm sure some of the cops would have wanted to go, but I also understand the highher ups wanting an experienced team on the ground.

[Nepenthe]

It took them a long time to get the swat squad to the island and the closest police could have been there more quickly. It might not have been protocol, it might have been considerably more dangerous for an ad hoc group of first responders, but shouldn't they have tried anyway, given the stakes.

 

Are there times where we demand from cops that they set aside concerns for personal safety ?

This is something that came up after our school shootings here a couple of years back. Instead of using even a local tactically equipped and trained "demanding situations" team, at least in the first case, they were waiting for the elite Helsinki PD unit (which, admittedly, had been training nearby and was available at an exceptionally short notice). I think the RoE was changed after, just like it was changed after Columbine in the U.S., so that basically the first support-weapon equipped patrol on scene will go in. Not sure of course, besides as police tactics it's probably classified, anyway.

[GreasyDogMeat]

One of the many reasons I'm glad to be able to carry a firearm. The police show up late to clean up a mess, not to prevent it. You can scream bloody murder and they take their sweet time.

[Malcador]

Heh, Greenwald is always a fun read. His followers, well less so.

[Gorgon]

It wouldn't have mattered. There wouldn't have been guns at a party youth convention with the PM scheduled to visit the next day, but all things being equal being armed in a crazed gunman situation is definitely preferable.

[Raithe]

That kind of reminds me of the Darwin Awards.. the Guy who decided to rob a gun store in Texas.. and walked around a parked police car to enter the store.

[Nepenthe]

It wouldn't have mattered. There wouldn't have been guns at a party youth convention with the PM scheduled to visit the next day, but all things being equal being armed in a crazed gunman situation is definitely preferable.

Mmh. I worked at a district court about a 30-45 minute train trip from the capital. We had no guards, armed or otherwise, no metal detectors, nothing. There was kind of janitor guy who was supposed to make sure that people went into the right courtrooms when they were supposed to, when he wasn't fixing the lamps or stuff.* We had a flick switch that was supposed to bring the cops from the nearby station and 7 inches of steel in front of the desk, but little doubt that we'd all have been dead by the time someone arrived.

 

*happily, he'd been doing the job for decades and had lived in the area for all of his ~65 years. He knew all the scumbags, their scumbag dads and often dirtbag granddads. In that way, he was very efficient at keeping the peace. Now that he's retired, there's no way I'd want to work there.

 

I don't think the guards carry firearms in the larger courts, either. Certainly we have nothing like the bailiffs in U.S.A.

[213374U]

I can't seem to open HK's 2nd link. Southern hemisphere only? Shame because that Guardian piece was pretty cool.

 

It wouldn't have mattered. There wouldn't have been guns at a party youth convention with the PM scheduled to visit the next day, but all things being equal being armed in a crazed gunman situation is definitely preferable.

Is it? Carrying a gun and using it effectively to protect yourself in a situation like that aren't even close. As soon as the **** hits the fan, you'll probably get the shakes bad, missing all your shots -if you were lucky and your gun didn't jam straight away- and/or hit something or someone(!) else. That's assuming you weren't paralyzed by terror or just succumbed to the overwhelming impulse to GTFO.

 

People in the police and military train for that sort of stuff for years and still fail to consistently keep a cool head under fire. Regular joes do even worse, packing or not, because we lack practice handling the violent hormonal discharge. Gun-toting pedestrians may have a mild deterrent effect, and hearing shots other than his own might have made the guy pause, but all things considered, I'd rather have just one out of control gunman.