Dragon Age discussion

[Orogun01]

They are meant to be overpowered, no point to be afraid of mages if they are no threat.

 

Sure but they're meant to be artillery - hard striking but fragile. With Improved Herbalism aka potion spam my mage can go toe to toe with more enemies than he should be able to handle. His longevity against melee enemies isn't significantly lower than Alistair or Sten even though I haven't invested a single point in his constitution.

 

...

 

 

The fade part of the Circle of the Magi handed out permanent upgrades like candy. This was a mistake because the PC didn't do anything in particular to deserve it

 

Constitution is only useful if you have a Blood mage build on mind, it's true that the mages are at par with warriors on surviving attacks; no doubt about it. My guess is that they did it to balance with the fact that they are the biggest damage dealers and therefore the only ones targeted by the AI. Fault on the designs.

[RPGmasterBoo]

That's true. Everyone ignores all my party members and heads straight for me, even when the fighters use Taunt.

 

I was under the impression that its actually because enemies chase the first character that deals damage to them, and since I'm always the first to throw a spell, usually a big one...

 

Another thing that allows them to do this is there not being any significant penalty for changing combat position. They can just run past my fighters and hound me easily.

 

An irritating thing is having to go over areas twice because the Rogue type NPCs aren't much use in combat, which forces me to change my party after killing everything to chase down chests. Chests should have been made breakable with sufficient force at the risk of damaging the fragile contents. This is practically a convention, I don't know why they skipped it. Or is there a way to force open a chestt?

Edited February 10, 2010 by RPGmasterBoo

[Sand]

I tend to do Redcliffe around level 7 or 8. Never had any problems. A few well-placed fireballs and all is good.

[Gromnir]

I tend to do Redcliffe around level 7 or 8. Never had any problems. A few well-placed fireballs and all is good.

 

redcliffe is no problem at level 7-8... if you is playing a mage. morrigan maybe not even have access to heal at that point, and she clear don't have fireball. is yet another bit o' evidence regarding the disparity in power between classes.

 

btw, for boo...

 

with few exceptions enemies prioritize targets based on armour strength. the community were informed that this enemy ai quirk were done intentional, in part to keeps player & player party mages from being made dead too frequent. if enemies used tactics similar to the tactics you utilize to combat enemy spellcasters, morrigan and wynne would be wormfodder with alarming regularity. you will get attacked once you do damage to enemies, but you are relative free to position self on the battlefield unmolested... which is a major tactical advantage.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Orogun01]

That's true. Everyone ignores all my party members and heads straight for me, even when the fighters use Taunt.

 

I was under the impression that its actually because enemies chase the first character that deals damage to them, and since I'm always the first to throw a spell, usually a big one...

 

Another thing that allows them to do this is there not being any significant penalty for changing combat position. They can just run past my fighters and hound me easily.

 

An irritating thing is having to go over areas twice because the Rogue type NPCs aren't much use in combat, which forces me to change my party after killing everything to chase down chests. Chests should have been made breakable with sufficient force at the risk of damaging the fragile contents. This is practically a convention, I don't know why they skipped it. Or is there a way to force open a chestt?

There is no way to open them without a mod. There is one that adds what you mentioned, force open. I think it was over at the nexus site.

BTW rogues are more useful in scouting with stealth, setting traps and (if you have the patience) becoming rangers.

[Sand]

Or I am playing the PC version with a mod that doesn't auto-level a joinable NPC so I can tailor make the character as I see fit and not the devs, Gromnir.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Sand

[Gorth]

BTW rogues are more useful in scouting with stealth, setting traps and (if you have the patience) becoming rangers.

Rangers are almost too powerful. Those animal companions are no whimps, giving you an additional party member (exaggerated for effect).

[Gromnir]

Or I am playing the PC version with a mod that doesn't auto-level a joinable NPC so I can tailor make the character as I see fit and not the devs, Gromnir.

 

that is indeed possible, but Gromnir never presumes cheats... even if the cheats is perfect reasonable in light o' the idiotic choices the developers made for some o' the jnpc powhaz.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Sand]

I don't consider it a cheat. You still have the same amount of slots on the character. You just get to choose them instead of the auto-leveling process. I also got rid of the baseline crap you get at 1st level you supposedly get for "free" and allow myself to spend those points as I wish.

[Gromnir]

I don't consider it a cheat. You still have the same amount of slots on the character. You just get to choose them instead of the auto-leveling process. I also got rid of the baseline crap you get at 1st level you supposedly get for "free" and allow myself to spend those points as I wish.

 

 

optimizing is a cheat, and a very effective one. for those who wish to alter the challenge factor o' the game, using the point-redistribution mod is far more effective than moving the difficulty slider. is a cheat, but we do not blame you for using. if the powhaz were actually balanced properly then it would not matter how points and powhaz were distributed. sadly, da balance considerations is somewhat lacking.

 

even so, point redistribute has a significant impact on game difficulty.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[RPGmasterBoo]

Game keeps spamming hordes of these MMO type quests through job boards, kill x, gather y, deliver z. I'm working for like 10 organizations at the same time. Would have been much better to cut the number of quests in half and make them more involving/interesting.

 

Before anyone says its optional, as far as I'm concerned -it isn't. I play thorough and wont have it any other way.

with few exceptions enemies prioritize targets based on armour strength. the community were informed that this enemy ai quirk were done intentional, in part to keeps player & player party mages from being made dead too frequent. if enemies used tactics similar to the tactics you utilize to combat enemy spellcasters, morrigan and wynne would be wormfodder with alarming regularity. you will get attacked once you do damage to enemies, but you are relative free to position self on the battlefield unmolested... which is a major tactical advantage.

 

Interesting. I'm not feeling much of the benefit since most combat starts with me flinging the best spells I've got... and everyone chasing me... but ok.

 

Edit: you're right, I've noticed just now that everyone ignores Wynne, which keeps my healing steady. Weird.

Edited February 11, 2010 by RPGmasterBoo

[Orogun01]

Interesting. I'm not feeling much of the benefit since most combat starts with me flinging the best spells I've got... and everyone chasing me... but ok.

 

Edit: you're right, I've noticed just now that everyone ignores Wynne, which keeps my healing steady. Weird.

That's probably because you chose to specialize as an elementalist (as I did on my 1st playthrough) most of the primal spell are high damage dealing over large areas. Which makes you a prime target for mobs.

[Sand]

Yeah. Those who fling fireballs tend to piss people off the most, but I often use the "KILL THE HEALER" tactic first and foremost. Of course if I focus my Magic I could have Inferno by 5th level.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Sand

[Orogun01]

Yeah. Those who fling fireballs tend to piss people off the most, but I often use the "KILL THE HEALER" tactic first and foremost. Of course if I focus my Magic I could have Inferno by 5th level.

Those last tier spells; specially the primal ones, are a waste of points. Aside from a few exceptions, they waste and exuberant amount of mana and do damage for the three seconds it takes enemies to run through them.

[Gromnir]

Yeah. Those who fling fireballs tend to piss people off the most, but I often use the "KILL THE HEALER" tactic first and foremost. Of course if I focus my Magic I could have Inferno by 5th level.

Those last tier spells; specially the primal ones, are a waste of points. Aside from a few exceptions, they waste and exuberant amount of mana and do damage for the three seconds it takes enemies to run through them.

 

blizzard frequent freezes enemies so that they may not move out of range. couple the area effect elemental spells with earthquake (groan) or grease (better) and you may also greatly increase the likelihood of doing damage for a longer duration. additionally, and we hesitate to mention as is such a horrible bit o' cheatery, as boo has observed, enemies do not notice you if you is slightly beyond range or around a corner. area effects is large and enemy ai is stoopid. chances are that the no-goodnicks will try to avoid being burned, electrocuted or frozen by running to a corner of room that is currently being blasted by cold, lightning and/or flame. worst-case scenario: you position your melee combatants at the very edge o' the area effect-- any enemies that tries to leave kill zone most fight you before exiting.

 

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Orogun01]

blizzard frequent freezes enemies so that they may not move out of range. couple the area effect elemental spells with earthquake (groan) or grease (better) and you may also greatly increase the likelihood of doing damage for a longer duration. additionally, and we hesitate to mention as is such a horrible bit o' cheatery, as boo has observed, enemies do not notice you if you is slightly beyond range or around a corner. area effects is large and enemy ai is stoopid. chances are that the no-goodnicks will try to avoid being burned, electrocuted or frozen by running to a corner of room that is currently being blasted by cold, lightning and/or flame. worst-case scenario: you position your melee combatants at the very edge o' the area effect-- any enemies that tries to leave kill zone most fight you before exiting.

 

 

HA! Good Fun!

The first one is only effective if done by two or three people, the second suggestion is the most effective. Even though storm of the century is a gamble to do that way.

The way that I find them most effective is to put them right on the edge of bottlenecks and have them clogged by paralysis spells and/or tanks.

Edit. The same way with traps.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Orogun01

[Gromnir]

blizzard frequent freezes enemies so that they may not move out of range. couple the area effect elemental spells with earthquake (groan) or grease (better) and you may also greatly increase the likelihood of doing damage for a longer duration. additionally, and we hesitate to mention as is such a horrible bit o' cheatery, as boo has observed, enemies do not notice you if you is slightly beyond range or around a corner. area effects is large and enemy ai is stoopid. chances are that the no-goodnicks will try to avoid being burned, electrocuted or frozen by running to a corner of room that is currently being blasted by cold, lightning and/or flame. worst-case scenario: you position your melee combatants at the very edge o' the area effect-- any enemies that tries to leave kill zone most fight you before exiting.

 

 

HA! Good Fun!

The first one is only effective if done by two or three people, the second suggestion is the most effective. Even though storm of the century is a gamble to do that way.

The way that I find them most effective is to put them right on the edge of bottlenecks and have them clogged by paralysis spells and/or tanks.

Edit. The same way with traps.

 

the most effective parties have multiple mages... the aforementioned tactics is just one reason why. stack up glyphs o' paralysis, grease and multi elemental spells. typical we gots 1 combatant, shale and 2 mages in party. shale can does hurl rock (knocks folks back into kill zone) and rock barrage AND be tank while the two mages do their elemental havoc or earthquake or whatever.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Volourn]

"go to redcliffe first?"

 

Yes. It's the easiest place to do first except perhasps the mage tower but the mage tower has a much ahrder boss battle (that's not even the final boss). redcliff is easy, and you don't need the PC to be a mage to do it. That's ridiculous.

 

 

 

"Magic is so powerful that enemy mages even manage to kill themselves by casting Fireball at point blank range. "

 

Why is this surprising? It's certainly nothing new. In D&D, mages get 1d4hp per level, and fireball does 1d6 damage per level. Do the math.

 

 

"His longevity against melee enemies isn't significantly lower than Alistair or Sten even though I haven't invested a single point in his constitution."

 

Kiddin' right? Any mage I've seen dies really quickm in melee. 2-5 hits usually while meleers can last much longer than that. *shrug*

 

 

"An irritating thing is having to go over areas twice because the Rogue type NPCs aren't much use in combat, which forces me to change my party after killing everything to chase down chests."

 

Sure, they are. Just like in D&D or any other game that has a rogue, you just have to know hwo to use/build them. Tons of people have given suggestions on how to play a combat effective rogue - including someone going through the game solo as one.

 

 

" Chests should have been made breakable with sufficient force at the risk of damaging the fragile contents. This is practically a convention, I don't know why they skipped it. Or is there a way to force open a chestt? "

 

yeah, it would be nice.

 

 

"Before anyone says its optional, as far as I'm concerned -it isn't. I play thorough and wont have it any other way."

 

Bet, you were one of those who played BG by acting like a lawnmower and going over every single inch of every single map doing every singlem thing even if your character probably wouldn't do it. Why not, you know, role-play your character. The completionist thiung where one one has to cover every square inch of the map, collect every single item, do every single quest, talkm to every single npchurts role-playing imo. It turns what should be playinga role into just a 'gamey' thing and not neccessarily in a good way. But, shrug, whatever is fun for everybody. For examplle, my 'good' character didn't go around doing quests for the theives' guild, assassins, or any other unscrupoulous people. Sure, missed out experience and gold but whatever.

 

 

 

"Interesting. I'm not feeling much of the benefit since most combat starts with me flinging the best spells I've got... and everyone chasing me... but ok."

 

grom claims to speak for everybody but he's simply wrong. Armou is sued as the intial detemrining factor but if you go in throwing your most powerful spells before the melees going in, you better believe any surviving enemies are coming for you. I have the same experience as you do as has plenty of others. Then again, Grom belives rogues are completely worthless in DA lol.

 

 

"Those last tier spells; specially the primal ones, are a waste of points. Aside from a few exceptions, they waste and exuberant amount of mana and do damage for the three seconds it takes enemies to run through them."

 

Nah.

[Gromnir]

grom claims to speak for everybody but he's simply wrong. Armou is sued as the intial detemrining factor but if you go in throwing your most powerful spells before the melees going in, you better believe any surviving enemies are coming for you. I have the same experience as you do as has plenty of others. Then again, Grom belives rogues are completely worthless in DA lol.

 

 

2 points, 'cause some folks hasn't seen in a while.

 

1) Gromnir never suggested that rogues is worthless.

 

we said the opposite... said that rogues is effective, but unnecessary. could simply have created a warrior class and a mage class and allowed any character to choose rogue skills if they so desired. cobbled-together quasi-warrior that is rogue is unnecessary bloat.

 

2) vol didn't pay attention to boo follow-up

 

 

"Edit: you're right, I've noticed just now that everyone ignores Wynne, which keeps my healing steady. Weird. "

 

is not a matter o' Gromnir opinion and am not certain who you thinks we is speaking for in this instance. we passed along information that were provided by bio and confirmed by numerous players, including boo. armour determines targeting priority.

 

...

 

debating with a chimp.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Volourn]

"armour determines INITIAL targeting priority."

 

Fixed. You are welcome, monsieur.

[Tigranes]

We get it, you two. He thinks rogues are worthless and the he thinks they're not and he's wrong but he says he never said he said rogues are worthless and he's wrong for thinking he said he thinks and Move on

 

Haven't touched this after 3 playthroughs, sort of seen all there is to see and I think there just isn't enough variety in DA to encourage a lot more playthroughs than that. Granted, my copious use of respec mods meant I experienced the maximum number of character style combinations more quickly, but at this rate I'm not even sure if I'll bother with Awakening. Just seems like the relentless flow of DLCs and products and whatnot are meant to keep me pumped but the core gameplay has already run dry.

[Monte Carlo]

What Dragon Age really needs is Sherman flame tanks, King Tigers and Panzergrenadier as a playable class.

 

Sorry, this Company of Heroes addiction is getting to me.

[Nepenthe]

Haven't touched this after 3 playthroughs, sort of seen all there is to see and I think there just isn't enough variety in DA to encourage a lot more playthroughs than that. Granted, my copious use of respec mods meant I experienced the maximum number of character style combinations more quickly, but at this rate I'm not even sure if I'll bother with Awakening. Just seems like the relentless flow of DLCs and products and whatnot are meant to keep me pumped but the core gameplay has already run dry.

 

Yes - and let me tell you, having the game on the PS3, with still no news of even Return to Ostagar, that's not working too well.

 

I have serious doubts future bio games will get ported to the PS3 - or if they do, I'm pretty sure they'll get the same red-headed stepchild treatment this one has. Too bad, I still prefer it over the ugly off-white/gray screamer.

[Monte Carlo]

I must admit the replayability issue is hitting me too: unlike BG2 there isn't enough going on outside of the critical path / main quests to justify more tinkering. There are also fewer character builds to tinker with and the deus ex machina Bio style gets under my skin.

 

Don't get me wrong, it's a great game but I just can't get back into it the same way I can (like, right now) with BG2. For example, I can play BG2 with my own characters like a turbo-charged IWD game. Simply not possible with DA. I can solo BG2. Ditto. I can visit big dungeons that have nothing to do with the critical path. And so on.

 

I think when the XP comes out enough time will have passed for me to have a mega-playthrough with a new character.

[Sand]

I do believe that Dragon Age Nexus does have a custom class, Grenadier, in their list of available mods.