So, Is this game delayed or not?

[lasthearth]

So apparently the leaked minutes from a Sega internal meeting has this snippet about AP:

 

 

Alpha Protocol

Michael Foster, product evaluator, said AP felt barely RPG. Initial level too challenging for players.

[Gorth]

Alpha Protocol

Michael Foster, product evaluator, said AP felt barely RPG. Initial level too challenging for players.

Maybe he managed to get himself shot during the first level?

[Oner]

Alpha Protocol

Michael Foster, product evaluator, said AP felt barely RPG. Initial level too challenging for players.

Thank you mister, but I rather trust the twitter feed if it's all the same to you.

[Killian Kalthorne]

Too challenging? TOO FRAKING CHALLENGING!?!?!

 

I would love to have a challenging CRPG for once.

 

Mass Effect: Too easy.

Fallout 3: Too easy.

NWN2: Too easy.

Oblivion: Too fraking easy.

 

I want a CRPG that has some teeth and a bunch of unnecessary spikey bits damn it.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

You can always play a cripple with no skills or stats.

[Killian Kalthorne]

You can always play a cripple with no skills or stats.

 

Really? Tell me how to do that in Mass Effect?

 

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

A) Play on a different difficulty

B) Don't use your level-up skill points. The game will get challenging soon enough.

[Killian Kalthorne]

I already play it on Insanity so the only other option is to go against the game rules system to artificially make the game more difficult. What a load of bull. The game's difficulty should be incorporated within the rules system provided for such stupidity is not even needed. Nice try, but no cigar.

 

Follow the rules of the game or the game means nothing.

Edited September 22, 2009 by Killian Kalthorne

[Swede]

Been lurking this forum for a while and decided to post this thread.

 

Everything points to AP being delayed and if it isnt, then why isnt there any advertising for it? The hype is nonexsistant!

Since we havent been told that its being delayed i will have to assume its coming on 2009-10-09 according to http://www.webhallen.com/prod.php?id=85230

 

Can it be that the advertising budget for AP is just small?

 

Given how dissapointed i was with Empire total war (another sega release) i sure hope this game wont be a beta sold as a full game.

[kreese12]

Too challenging? TOO FRAKING CHALLENGING!?!?!

 

I would love to have a challenging CRPG for once.

 

Mass Effect: Too easy.

Fallout 3: Too easy.

NWN2: Too easy.

Oblivion: Too fraking easy.

 

I want a CRPG that has some teeth and a bunch of unnecessary spikey bits damn it.

 

I agree with you 100%. I'd be ecstatic if Alpha Protocol was too challenging for me.

 

Mass Effect was a satisfying enough challenge on Insanity, but it was lame because this difficulty level was locked until you finished the game on the far easier levels of difficulty. And I've never been one to enjoy playing a game more than once. Too many games out there for that

 

Fallout 3 was waaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy too easy. To the point that it pretty much killed the game for me. I mean, you could defeat the entire starting Vault's security team with your bare hands. You could run up to any guy in the game, hit the magic pause/vats key, and blow off there head, even if you had no weapon skills. You also found heavy weapons like rocket launchers far too early in the game. The combat in Fallout 1 / 2 (and almost everything else in those games) were far better done than in Fallout 3.

 

NWN2: never played

 

Oblivion: Level scaling. Has to be about the dumbest design choice imaginable for that sort of game. What's the point of even leveling up if every rat / robber / skeleton is going to be at your skill level, no matter what you do? Completely nullifies the whole play-reward system of leveling up in a RPG, which is like a pillar of the whole genre. It's just stupid reasoning. You could finish Oblivion on the first experience level (I've read) . Oblivion with Obscuros Oblivion Overhaul mod is one of the best PC RPGs ever made, but with out the mods, the game is sort of meh.

 

As for that 'not RPG enough' supposedly leaked comment, I'm thinking that will be the case with Alpha Protocol. I'm still really looking forward to the game and think it'll be a lot of fun, but when I first heard about it, I was hoping it was going to be more RPG and less third-person shooter.

 

My definition of 'more RPG' in this case being that there is less combat focus, more open maps, more multiple paths to victory, and generally more to do besides stuff that directly involves killing people.

 

I think the game will be delayed...but that's alright; I'm keeping busy with a replay of the amazing Vampire Masquerade Bloodlines with last weeks new fan patch, and I'm probably going to be big into Borderlands when it comes out next month...

Edited September 22, 2009 by kreese12

[SteveThaiBinh]

Been lurking this forum for a while and decided to post this thread.

 

Everything points to AP being delayed and if it isnt, then why isnt there any advertising for it? The hype is nonexsistant!

Since we havent been told that its being delayed i will have to assume its coming on 2009-10-09 according to http://www.webhallen.com/prod.php?id=85230

 

Can it be that the advertising budget for AP is just small?

 

Given how dissapointed i was with Empire total war (another sega release) i sure hope this game wont be a beta sold as a full game.

As this is related to a (unconfirmed) delay, I've merged it into this thread so that everything's in one place.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

I already play it on Insanity so the only other option is to go against the game rules system to artificially make the game more difficult. What a load of bull. The game's difficulty should be incorporated within the rules system provided for such stupidity is not even needed. Nice try, but no cigar.

 

Follow the rules of the game or the game means nothing.

 

I wasn't aware that playing a game 'meant something' in the greater scheme of things. Maybe it's different for you; and that explains why contrived difficulty imposed by the developers is okay but contrived difficulty imposed by players is not.

[kreese12]

Hrmm well I sort of see K-K's point. It's not as much fun for myself to say, play Mass Effect without using and skills/abilites/biotics, just to make the game harder. Ideally their should be a challenge even if you play the game as it intended to be played (with using biotics) .

 

But I see the other point of view as well I guess. Like many games it would be easier to save every 10 seconds , but instead , I 'll choose to save a little as possible to make it more challenging... hmmm different folks, different strokes I guess.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

I could *maybe* see a market (however niche) for extremely challenging WRPGs, but I'm not sure that a mechanically ambitious shooter-RPG hybrid by a smaller developer still trying to stay afloat is the best place to start.

 

That said, I think there's a pretty competent if nonstandard (among games) argument to made for a difficult first mission. I'm guessing he was referring to the one where MT wakes up disoriented with no idea where he is or what's happening. I could see deliberately making such a segment overwhelming in difficulty (compensating with frequent checkpoints) to put the player in the experience of being a rookie who is basically getting hazed.

[kreese12]

Personally I think the hardcore RPG market is under-served. Publishers too afraid to alienate folks have been bending over to accommodate more casual gamers at the expense of the larger, more hardcore minded RPG audience.

 

For proof, I'm currently pointing over there, to 'Demon's Souls.' It might be too early to speak for the sales, but critics are loving the game, there is a big buzz about it, and the game is --refreshingly-- hard as hell.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

I think it's important to distinguish between W(estern)RPGs and J(apanese)RPGs in such a discussion.

 

JRPGs such as Demon Souls often are, and have been since the days of yore, ball-bustingly hard. Many of them also get good reviews in the states. That said, the core game design is typically very different from the sort of open-ended choice-based gameplay found in titles like Fallout and Baldur's Gate (prototypical WRPGs).

 

With WRPGs, there really aren't that many of them by comparison. We get at most a few each year, which makes them kind of a specialized market to begin with. If somebody targets an extreme within that already small market such as difficulty, it could be such a small slice of the pie as to be commercially unsuccessful even if the game itself is good.

[Masterfade]

I think it's almost a genre convention that RPGs start out fairly hard, getting progressively easier and become a complete cakewalk half-way through the game.

 

And being 'too hard' and being a 'hardcore' RPG are really two different things. A lot of hardcore RPG players I know are not used to twitchy shooter/action gameplay. If AP is difficult because it requires a great deal of fast-reaction and precision then it may actually turn some of its core audience anyway.

[kreese12]

CL-=> Hmm.. well in the case of Demon's Souls, even though it is an Atlus game, it is actually much more a Western style ARPG than it is a Japanese RPG. I invite you to check out a some videos. It would be a real stretch to classify it as a JRPG if you were judging it in any way besides where it was made (but I know what you are saying generally speaking) .

 

Master-=> It is fair to distinguish between hardcore and hard, but generally, don't you think hardcore gamers like stuff more challenging, and casual games are generally easier? If we are just talking about one genre, I guess. Hmmm..on second thought, I guess these distinctions and labels get a bit tricky to work with. Like someone could convince me Fallout 3 could be considered 'hardcore' these days, but it was easy...

Edited September 23, 2009 by kreese12

[Oner]

IMO the impossible/insane/nightmare etc difficulties are there to be freaking hard. Casual gamers can play it on hard and the hardcore crowd has the super extra special hard all for themselves. I mean duh, market niche for hardcore gamers? Difficulty settings exist for a reason.

 

Speaking of difficulties read this article, at first it makes sense, but the ending part is just hilariously bad.

Edited September 23, 2009 by Oner

[Pidesco]

I think it's important to distinguish between W(estern)RPGs and J(apanese)RPGs in such a discussion.

 

JRPGs such as Demon Souls often are, and have been since the days of yore, ball-bustingly hard. Many of them also get good reviews in the states. That said, the core game design is typically very different from the sort of open-ended choice-based gameplay found in titles like Fallout and Baldur's Gate (prototypical WRPGs).

 

With WRPGs, there really aren't that many of them by comparison. We get at most a few each year, which makes them kind of a specialized market to begin with. If somebody targets an extreme within that already small market such as difficulty, it could be such a small slice of the pie as to be commercially unsuccessful even if the game itself is good.

 

 

Huh, apart from special secret battles like the Weapons in the FFs, JRPGs are usually mindlessly easy, requiring only a rubber band around the attack button.

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Depends on the game. There's always an optional boss battle that will kick your ass even at level 99 and with the best gear in JRPGs.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

Huh, apart from special secret battles like the Weapons in the FFs, JRPGs are usually mindlessly easy, requiring only a rubber band around the attack button.

 

I suppose it depends on your willingness to powergame. I, for one, find the DDS games quite difficult.

[Nepenthe]

I think this just shows that some people are so 1337 they **** binary.

 

Yes, that was an Amadeus reference and yes, it got censored.

[Grone]

Hi

 

So I was down at my local Gamestop to preorder three games today, namely Dragon Age: Origins, Starcraft II: Wings of Liberty and last but not least; Alpha Protocol.

 

Everything was by the book - suggested release date for DA:O was 5th of November, while there of course was none for SCII.

 

However, someone at SEGA or possibly Gamestop must've been smoking crack, 'cause the suggested release date for Alpha Protocol said June 2010. What's up with that?

 

I'm guessing Europe won't get the game that late?

[Morgoth]

possibly Gamestop must've been smoking crack, 'cause the suggested release date for Alpha Protocol said June 2010. What's up with that?

That would be very disappointing. AP is already 3,5 years in development (with an existing engine), if Obsidian even needs more time then they're doing something wrong.