Hmm... Change of mind

[Bounce]

Well I've always thought K1 was better than K2.

I have just finished both games these last 14 days, and I must admit:

I find K2 alot more exciting in terms of action/story/gameplay & the various quests than K1.

 

Also something I didn't really think much about was influence.

It's actually quite fun & sometimes challenging to get all the 'goodguys' over to the darkside

(and get them to wear one of my super nice black robes).

 

It's just more 'star wars like' if you know what I mean.

 

Well.. My 2c

[Krookie]

A lot of people would agree with you. I don't, but a lot of people do.

[Flood]

Yeah for a while I thought K1 was better too until I played K2 again. K2 storywise to me just had more depth, all the new cool sh!t they added helped too. And I agree about K2 feeling more star warsy. Both of them are awesome games though :cool:

Edited December 4, 2005 by Flood

[DeathScepter]

I like K1 for its completeness and a cooler PC.

 

that is all

[Haitoku]

KOTOR I might have been complete... but it felt really generic, storywise.

 

Despite KOTOR II being unbalanced, incomplete and buggy... I still liked it more. =)

[Mondo]

Kotor I is the classic star wars tale and the key word here is COMPLETED, it's fufilling.

 

Kotor II I also agree had more promise and I probably would have enjoyed it more.

[14884_1556103668]

Well, I recently played K1, and have to admit that K2 (in my eyes) is a lot better. Just the overall feel of the game is nicer

[Petay]

To me, plot development and progression is everything, and being unfinished as K2 was, I quite obviously prefer K1 over K2.

[Jedi_Maverick]

K1 is better, complete and don

[darth buch]

Agreed. In an RPG, particularly one with such a complicated plot as K2, the lack of a good ending massively damages the game. Plot is very important to me in games, more so than pretty much anything else.

 

If it had been finished, K2 would have had a much better plot, but somehow the Exile just doesn't seem as appealing as Revan as a character, and only a few of the Exile's shipmates just aren't as much fun as most of Revan's.

 

However, I don't like the influence system, certain planets and the random items. K1 simply has a finished plot and is easier to use. Both are great games, but the sense of disapointment when you play K2 is a big drag factor. It doesn't have to be unfinished and faulty. Much like Revan herself it could be SO much more.

Edited December 4, 2005 by darth buch

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

For compartive purposes.

 

Kotor is a Forgotten Realms novel - entertaining but about as deep as puddle.

 

KOTOR II is the Silmarilion - Not straghtforward but that much more rewarding for those who can grasp it.

[Musopticon?]

In a nutshell; everyone just wanted to play an avatar of force. *sigh*

[Dark Moth]

For compartive purposes.

 

Kotor is a Forgotten Realms novel - entertaining but about as deep as puddle.

 

KOTOR II is the Silmarilion - Not straghtforward but that much more rewarding for those who can grasp it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Key difference though is The Silmarillion is actually good. For it's supposed "shallow" storyline, I thought K1 had a lot of philosophy and twists behind it. K2's shortcoming was that it had no real resolution and no underlying moral theme. That, and the entire game seems more sympathetic to darksiders and more hostile toward lightsiders. That's what you get with Kreia as your mentor, I guess. K2 had some nice new stuff, but overall I (and the majority of players) feel K1 is still the better of the two.

[Bandobras Took]

If Sith Lords had been finished, I would have enjoyed it more.

 

I've been playing it again and wondering why I felt so disappointed . . . until I got past the scene with the Jedi Masters on Dantooine and the "What is going on here?" starts coming into play.

 

The disappointment just mounts because you can see what they were aiming for and didn't have time to complete. But why do we care about Atris when she isn't even mentioned after you get the Ebon Hawk back? Why should we care about Nihilus when he hasn't even attacked us the whole game? Why on earth, this close to the end of the game, am I forced to take characters that I don't even like along with me?

 

If they had had time to finish, Sith Lords would have served a function remarkably similar to Empire Strikes Back -- deepening the story, blurring the distinct good/evil lines of the previous installment, and setting up a wonderful third installment.

 

As it is, I have a hard time finishing the game. It would be like watching Empire Strikes Back with all of Han's smart remarks missing and half of Yoda's lessons gone.

[Commissar]

If Sith Lords had been finished, I would have enjoyed it more.

 

I've been playing it again and wondering why I felt so disappointed . . . until I got past the scene with the Jedi Masters on Dantooine and the "What is going on here?" starts coming into play.

 

The disappointment just mounts because you can see what they were aiming for and didn't have time to complete.  But why do we care about Atris when she isn't even mentioned after you get the Ebon Hawk back?  Why should we care about Nihilus when he hasn't even attacked us the whole game?  Why on earth, this close to the end of the game, am I forced to take characters that I don't even like along with me?

 

If they had had time to finish, Sith Lords would have served a function remarkably similar to Empire Strikes Back -- deepening the story, blurring the distinct good/evil lines of the previous installment, and setting up a wonderful third installment.

 

As it is, I have a hard time finishing the game.  It would be like watching Empire Strikes Back with all of Han's smart remarks missing and half of Yoda's lessons gone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, all I can say is that if you're one of the very rare folks who playes II before I, you're not even going to bother finishing the original. I'm a very new convert to the KotOR cult, and I picked up II first. Played it through, loved it, and then, since my wife's out of town for a couple of weeks, bought I in order to geek out during the off-hours. I knew I wouldn't like the story much, simply because I don't like playing a character that isn't wholly my own, and the Darth Revan secret's out. However, the first time I walked up to a workbench in I, I was going, "What, is this all there is?" The greatly expanded features of II really add a lot to the game, in my opinion.

 

Sure, the story is quite obviously not what they intended it to be. There are two ways of dealing with this: it's easy enough to figure out what was supposed to happen based on cut dialogue, and there's at least one thread to that effect around here. The other is to work with what they've given you, which would involve assuming that, for whatever reason, Mira, the remote, and possibly T3-M4 were the only ones to accompany you to Malachor, and events unfolded as they did, with either Mira returning to the ship and getting it flying after her encounter, or T3 doing it by himself. Kreia makes it clear that your companions will all be left behind, and T3's going to take you out of known space to help Revan out, and though her predictions for your companions were a little unsatisfying, I thought Mira's in particular was rather touching, especially given that I didn't really like her as a character, and she ended up a mediocre Jedi at best in my party.

 

So you can deal with the knowledge of what it was intended to be or what it actually is; knowing what was supposed to happen makes for a pretty damn good story. Knowing what did happen requires you to fill in the blanks, which I suppose would be more attractive to some.

[Laozi]

K1- was just a romp in he Star Wars world, simple and successful.

 

K2- tried for a more involving plot, but other then having really great atmosphere, fell right on its face, for various reasons. "Death of the Force" and "True Sith" belong up there with midiclorians

[Ranger0087]

For compartive purposes.

 

Kotor is a Forgotten Realms novel - entertaining but about as deep as puddle.

 

KOTOR II is the Silmarilion - Not straghtforward but that much more rewarding for those who can grasp it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Comparing KOTOR 2 to the Silmiarilion is... amusing at best. Let's face it; KOTOR 2 had a lot of potential, but after the Jedi meet on Dantooine, it degenerates into utter incoherence. I don't think that KOTOR 2 is particularly more deep than the original; it's just more obscure. Oh, and if you really think Forgotten Realms novels are "deep as puddle", then I think you need to read them a little more critically.

[Commissar]

K1- was just a romp in he Star Wars world, simple and successful.

 

K2- tried for a more involving plot, but other then having really great atmosphere, fell right on its face, for various reasons. "Death of the Force" and "True Sith" belong up there with midiclorians

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh, I don't know. If the Death of the Force thing had succeeded, maybe I'd call it a bad idea, but as it stands now, it was just a crackpot scheme that didn't - and probably couldn't - work out. True Sith I'm ambivalent about, since I don't know enough about them to form an opinion.

 

I do appreciate the darker tone of II, though. I kind of had Kreia pegged as a bad influence from the start, but it was still rewarding to attempt to live up to the good guy standard in the face of situations that clearly aim for moral ambiguity. I've said many times that I don't like "epic" storylines in roleplaying games, but it's still fun to think that, if you go light side at least, the Exile's setting the tone for the reformation of the Jedi. I suppose it comes down to how you perceive the character. Another reason I can't get involved with I is because it seems a little too cookie-cutter. I like the Exile because he seems much more complex.

[Laozi]

Well theres no secret K2 decoder ring, the plot is what it is. That being one that seemed mysterious and forbidding in our ignorance, but degenerated into nothing more then go here and kill this, for the sake of the galaxy, oh btw that Revan, one badass.

[Commissar]

Well theres no secret K2 decoder ring, the plot is what it is. That being one that seemed mysterious and forbidding in our ignorance, but degenerated into nothing more then go here and kill this, for the sake of the galaxy, oh btw that Revan, one badass.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Alright. Leaving out all of the cut material that's available, what do we have?

 

We have Sith who are attempting to track down and exterminate Jedi, as that is the source of their power. We have the Jedi order essentially disbanded, with the few remaining masters in hiding, obviously deeply conflicted over their conduct during the Mandalorian Wars, unable to do anything about their present situation. So the Jedi are dead, the Republic is crumbling, and the Sith seem to be gaining power.

 

Then we have our Exile friend come wandering back into frame; he destroys a few Sith lords, setting them back considerably, stabilizes several worlds crucial to the Republic, and lays the foundation for a new Jedi order that will presumably be the one that's still around when the Phantom Menace comes along. He then goes in search of his old commander, who has apparently realized that an even greater threat lies outside of known space. Not bad, in my book.

[-Master of All-]

^But it created more loose ends than it tied, which bugs

me to no end. All I can say is if they add another new PC

in Kotor 3, we're probably gonna need flow charts

to keep track of the plot.

[Musopticon?]

if you really think Forgotten Realms novels are "deep as puddle", then I think you need to read them a little more critically.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's true. They're as deep as an oil stain.

[Bandobras Took]

Sure, the story is quite obviously not what they intended it to be.  There are two ways of dealing with this: it's easy enough to figure out what was supposed to happen based on cut dialogue, and there's at least one thread to that effect around here.  The other is to work with what they've given you, which would involve assuming that, for whatever reason, Mira, the remote, and possibly T3-M4 were the only ones to accompany you to Malachor, and events unfolded as they did, with either Mira returning to the ship and getting it flying after her encounter, or T3 doing it by himself.

Kreia makes it clear that your companions will all be left behind, and T3's going to take you out of known space to help Revan out, and though her predictions for your companions were a little unsatisfying, I thought Mira's in particular was rather touching, especially given that I didn't really like her as a character, and she ended up a mediocre Jedi at best in my party.

 

So you can deal with the knowledge of what it was intended to be or what it actually is; knowing what was supposed to happen makes for a pretty damn good story.  Knowing what did happen requires you to fill in the blanks, which I suppose would be more attractive to some.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think some of those assumptions are a bit off. I'm sure I remember Kreia mentioning something like "if he helps his companions, he's going to weaken himself." Looking at the cut content threads, I think all of them are supposed to be there except Bao-Dur.

 

The workbench and other modifications are great; when it comes to actual gameplay, I like Sith Lords better. But overall, the ending fails to make the slightest bit of sense. This isn't fill in the blanks, it's fill in the climax. The fights with Atris, Nihilus, Sion, and Kreia ought to mean something, but they don't. Your companions' stories ought to get some resolution, but they don't. Therefore anything after Dantooine leaves me with a sour taste in my mouth, as the game is fun and involving up to that point, in spite of being forced to have Go-To and Kreia in your party.

 

if you really think Forgotten Realms novels are "deep as puddle", then I think you need to read them a little more critically.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's true. They're as deep as an oil stain.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Surely they're as deep as a Rice Krispy Treat?

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

If not for the big rush at the end this thread would likely not exist.

 

KOTOR is fantasy "trash" thats what it has going for it. It's simple to undertand, dosnt challenge you to think and anyone who couldnt see that plot twist coming is obviously perfectly suited to that type of game.

 

If you think about any of the popularity contests, "trash" wins over accomplishment.

 

In KOTOR II there is a lot of stuff going on and you need to think about how those threads connect. Not a huge deal but the "missing" ending will alienate anyone who just wants an easy answer.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

  Oh, and if you really think Forgotten Realms novels are "deep as puddle", then I think you need to read them a little more critically.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

And you need to read things with a bit more gravitas.

 

The FR novels are mass produced "trash" thats not to say you cant enjoy them. They dont challenge the reader and some people like that. You can say the same about KOTOR it dosnt challenge you to think like KOTORII does.