What's not to like about a KotOR "Prequel"?

[Ulicus]

I've been reading a few old posts lately, mainly along the lines of "what should be the next game in the series?" or, "What do you think is going to happen in KotOR 3"? That kind of thing - and one thing I've noticed is that whenever someone puts forward the idea of a "Kotor prequel, set around the Mandalorian Wars" the usual response is:

 

"Oh, no no no, that's a terrible idea, we all know how that plays out"

 

I just don't understand this at all.

 

A prequel to KotOR would not only be in Star Wars tradition but also help further define the character of Revan the way the *player wants him/her to be defined*.

 

Look at this section from the chronicles:

 

"Jedi Master REVAN moves surreptitiously between unknown sectors scouting for potential strongholds to withstand the attacks, he soon discovers the shadowy Malachor V, a planet listed by Mandalorian scholars as "forbidden" to step foot on."

 

Now, take away the "Jedi Master" part (ridiculous mistake) and make it "Revan and party move surrepptitiously" and you have the KotOR prequel packaged and ready to go. (well, the foundations)

 

It fits the criteria of previous games:

 

1) Planet hopping looking for certain things.

2) Takes place during a great conflict

3) Ends with the discovery of some big evil thing

 

So we'd be playing Revan in the time-period:

 

<<<The start of Mandalorian Wars to Revan sending forth the call of arms to the other Jedi/joining the Mandalorian wars proper (playing as Revan as a fleet commander/battle tactician >>>

 

The beauty of this is that it would allow people to create Revan (though I can see people being fussy about having their name defined) as a 1st level Jedi however they wanted. We'd also get the usual "myriad of diverse NPCS" and Malak would hopefully be one of them.

 

Now I know what you're thinking:

 

"But Revan's character is defined as a tactical genius etc etc - he's meant to be really charismatic etc etc we'll feel forced into choosing certain attributes by the story"

 

Not really. In KotOR 1 you're supposed to have a phenomenal connection to the Force, yet you can choose to give yourself a wisdom and charisma of 8, be a Jedi Guardian and have about 2 FP.

 

Besides, if they upped the difficulty of the game they would be able to give you certain bonuses (like charisma points always cost one attribute point at generation, as opposed to going up in value) just for being who you were. After all, all the NPCs in KotOR II had a "special ability" and I don't see any reason why the main character shouldn't either.

 

I mean, as it stands- I wouldn't mind creating a character to fit Revan's "criteria", but I understand why other people would get a bit irritated by this.

 

That aside- we all know that the main reason we play this series is for the Star Wars feel of the story (even if it did deviate slightly in KotOR 2, but just slightly), awesome gameplay and the fact that the fighting looks cool... ok well they're my reasons. It really isn't a particularly hardcore "role-playing game" in the sense that you define everything about your character. In KotOR 1 and 2 there were parts of the characters that we had no control over. I see no reason why this would be a problem happening again.

 

So we'd have certain things set: your name and your eventual destiny. However, what we should be allowed to influence (I feel, since Revan is to a great many people their "true" character in the KotOR series) is the journey and the alignment and motivations of Revan as he/she travels.

 

As it stands, most people have this view that Revan is

simply the anti-hero who chose to sacrifice himself to the dark side to save it from the True Sith, without ever being fully consumed by it.

Quite a "light-side" motivation if you will.

 

However, just because this is what the majority think doesn't mean that has to be his reasons for flipping out. Maybe over the course of his journey he has grown increasingly disillusioned with the Republic and has had enough of "weak senators" being in control and wants to rule it himself and his true motivation is out of wanting to save the Repubic but wanting to rule the Republic and crush any threats (

the True Sith

) that are out there. Maybe he was always evil inside, and like Palpatine has manouvered himself into a position of power (in this case head of third of the Republic fleet as opposed to Supreme Chancellor) in order to act as the foundations for his eventual bid for domination of the galaxy. Or maybe he was just always a nice guy at heart and only wants to use the dark side for a certain period of time before moving back to the light (silly as that is). Hey, what if the character he is romancing is brutally torn from him and that's what drives him to the dark side?

 

My point is there are a whole *wealth* of reasons for Revan's eventual decision/s and I don't think that we should be limited to just *one* and I think, given the emotional attachment quite a lot of people have to the character of Revan as "theirs" they should be allowed to determine them as opposed to being told in KotOR 3 "Revan did this this and this for this reason".

 

The argument that you couldn't have two possible endings (light and dark) is invalid. Though on the surface there would be only one ending (Revan joining the Mandalorian wars/being given command of a third of the Republic forces) the actual endings themselves would be far different depending on your alignment:

 

LS: Plays up the tragedy of a person who is sacrficing himself to evil in order to save the galaxy he feels the Jedi can no longer protect. He will become "evil" as the war progresses but he certainly hasn't yet.

 

DS: Plays up Revan's success in manouvering into a position of great power, from which he can begin his conquest of the galaxy. Already pretty damn evil.

 

*Remember that Revan doesn't find Malachor V at the END of the wars as a lot of people think, he finds it and becomes the Dark Lord of the Sith before he joins in with the Mandalorian Wars - the whole reason behind his "call to arms" is to "seduce an army of Jedi, loyal to him alone"*

 

Now I'm not for a minute suggesting that this is going to happen - I'm just trying to say that the idea of a prequel game is *not* a bad one at all and would probably be brilliant.

 

That's not to say it would have to be exactly, or even remotely like what I've outlined above. I'm just giving an example of a prequel game that wouldn't be crap. (Well, that I feel wouldn't be crap, heh)

 

So, any thoughts?

 

(Note: I don't think this should be the next game, I mean they need to finish the current story arc first. I just feel this *should* eventually get looked at in the KotOR series - even if it's years down the line)

[Lord Tarondor]

I'd be interested, but keep it away from Obsidian and any other rookie companies, and I'll be fine. Storyline is key, so if they can create a game that is plausible and works then by all means, they should do it.

 

Some good points but you'll have the staunch defenders who don't want "their" Revan defined. I say developing a male and female storyline would be interesting but remember there's not very many options since he (or she) can't be too giving or too devoted to the Dark Side so you'll have Kreia all over.

 

P.S.: I did mean to be snide with the 'their' thing and I think people should just let it go. View Revan the way you want to -- most do that for any character they read about and if it affects them that much, they don't have to buy the game. Setting certain traits would be fine as far as I'm concerned since it is their story, and furthermore, we have an imagination -- we can use it to believe Revan is still a male if it so happens the character was set as a female or something of that much importance to people.

[GhostofAnakin]

I don't know if I'd prefer a prequel rather than KOTOR3. I'm not going to say I won't like it, since if it's Star Wars, chances are I'll buy it and enjoy it atleast somewhat.

 

But my first choice would be something that isn't a prequel.

[Lord Satasn]

Yeah I could care less with what they do with Revan, it's their job to make the game, and since I'm not making the game I'm not going to critisize about needless stuff. I think a prequel would be real interesting..but maybe not for K3...they should tie up the "what happens now" type of scenerio K2 created. I don't really think K2 was a badgame, and I thought the storyline was really well done, this was after beating it light and dark, because, if u beat it darkside on ur first playthru, like me, u probably were a bit confused as to what just happened....

 

as long as they tie up the questions, I dont mind at all how K2 played out

[Wild Storm]

No. Jumping foward before the story is even complete? Nuh huh.

[Nidarrock]

A prequal would be nice, but not at this point. With so many questions hanging most, myself included, would prefer a conclusion. We did however see this happen in the gaming world just last year with Metal Gear Solid 3, and it seemed to work well, so who knows.

 

Great ideas though.

[Laozi]

F#@ken Plenty

[Quasar]

I said something like this back on the Bioware boards, but isntead of the mandalorian wars, it'd be around the time of Exar Kun.

Think about it - We get to see Jolee Bindo again! And young!

[Nur Ab Sal]

This is what all fans of Exar are waiting for - to see our master again, so we could worship him

[Saberist]

My problems with this are as follows:

 

1. KOTOR 1 Already Blew It.

In terms of having a Dungeon Crawl 'party' epic in a time of Total War. It gets to be difficult to have a reason for Revan to be off futzing about on his own, doing 'little jobs' of good or evil. When what is REALLY NEEDED is his focussed command of /thousands/ of troops and ships. Star Wars Galaxy already having been done...

 

2. KOTOR 2 Screwed Up Things Even Worse.

By effectively rewriting Revan for the convenience of making Exile just like him. Instead of /highlighting Revan/ through memories of how the Exile saw him. You can have a Lancelot for Arthur. But only if it doesn't come down to evil Guinevere messing with his head for 'reasons unknowable'. Kreia was a great opportunity that turned into a terrible mistake IMO. In that Exile is as little know as Revan ever was and so now K3 must 'unravel both' while trying to finish what should ba a fast-paced endgame. It didn't help that the 'Sith Lords' turned out to be utter wusses.

 

3. As other's have hinted, K2 left such a bitterly banal ending ('heading off into yet more danger' without having really explained the current one) that /heads would roll/ if it turned out that there was nothing to K2 but a rushed development to have 'dollars by Christmas'. Given that Lucas' entire franchise is (IMO) hanging by the thread of ROTS, I don't think he can afford many more howls of outrage at the 'commercialism for it's own sake!' level of a private Empire of such shoddy dreams.

 

 

CONCLUSION:

KOTOR 3 is a done deal. Sealed endgame based on an unexplored universe and characters that were retarded in their development as personal as much as moral symbols.

 

I myself would /vastly/ rather have a _NEW VISION_ that went even farther back into time. WHY are the Jedi called 'Knights'? WHERE does their huge powerbase within the Republic come from (especially if they can be so readily annihilated, only to rise again). HOW did they first discover sabers and The Force? WHAT was their role in bringing a Republic out of a series of (presumably) feudal monarchies on planets once held by the Rakata? DID they in fact help instigate interstellar communications as a function of say 'scouting hyperspace routes'?

 

Make the Jedi functional. Useful. And let the 'mysticism' develop around how they changed from X into Y. Warriors/Explorers/Bounty Hunters into Mage Adepts. Then show me what FIRST schism'd the order into Sith and Jedi divided camps.

 

NOT based on the Comic Books (which are what, 15 years old now?) But on a new vision.

 

In particular don't bore me with details of a war whose outcome is indeed known and whose protagonists are not so particularly impressive as to require 'someone special' to be seen to defeat them (one of the few mistakes of having a Canderous/Mandalore type character in both games was in bringing the Mandalorian identity too far out into the bright light of everyday judgment of character, motivation and capability. Leaving them to look like common thugs...).

 

 

Saberist Out.

[Azure79]

I'd rather see the prequel if there is one after the story of Revan and the Exile have come to a satisfactory conclusion.

 

It would probably work better that way too.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

MGS worked as a prequel because everyone wanted to know about BigBoss and people also wanted to play Snake.

 

There isnt really a point in KOTOR. Aside from Kreai there isnt anyone that interesting or who fits the same sort of criteria as MGS.

 

Sure you could play Revan as he pops off to the Mandalorian wars , but thats not going to play like an RPG. Might make for an interesting spin off game though.

[Odinson]

I myself would like a conclusion to the story. KoTOR's story should have ended there. It seemed like nothing else could be done, unless we went DS. KoTOR 2 just extends it, leaving the story open. I'd like to see the conclusion of that story from KoTOR 2, whether we are Revan, Exile, or a new character. It's just my opinion that I'd like a conclusion. Unless an Obsidian rep tell us we are to use our imaginations for our own end, I'd think a possible KoTOR 3 will be the concluding story to KoTOR 2.

[Lord Satasn]

I agree

[Ulicus]

Can I just point out that I totally agree that KotOR 3 needs to be a sequel to KotOR 2... I did say that at the end of my post.

 

I also like the idea of KotOR games that go even further back in Star Wars history etc- I just think it would be nice to have one last play through as Revan (since I think he's effectively ruled out as a player character in any sequels)

 

As for:

 

"Some good points but you'll have the staunch defenders who don't want "their" Revan defined. I say developing a male and female storyline would be interesting but remember there's not very many options since he (or she) can't be too giving or too devoted to the Dark Side so you'll have Kreia all over."

 

Kreia wouldn't be there - Kreia wasn't Revan's only master and by the time the game would start, Revan's operating independantly of her. As for not wanting Revan defined... well, I have my own ideas on who Revan is and what he did before and during the Mandalorian wars which would be messed up by a prequel game most likely, at the same time - I'd just really like to play as "my" character again. You could still go LS/DS and have a whole number of different choices to make throughout the game, helping you define Revan the way *you* want.

 

Hmm, anyway, I wasn't saying it should be done so much as the idea isn't as terrible as everyone seems to think. Providing the execution is good.

 

Oh and I'd LOVE a KotOR game set in Exar Kun times... hehe - mainly becuase it would completely rewrite the banal TotJ storyline to make it fit in with KotOR I and get rid of the ridiculous insect ships and magical amulets and make the Sith War an *actual war* as opposed to three skirmishes and a group of suns exploding.

 

And a younger Jolee as a PC member would be quite fun... mainly to see how different his perspective is from his older self...

[Laozi]

I would love an ending to Kotor to completely not include Revan or the Exile. Don't even mention their collective sorry asses

[6 Foot Invisible Rabbit]

What is there not to like? Its a prequel. Stories are meant to go forwards, not backwards.

[Plano Skywalker]

Mace Windu once said, "we are keepers of the peace, not an army".

 

I would like to play a SW RPG where I am doing what Jedi normally do --

putting out brushfires for the Council. Let's take a break from saving the

galaxy...most Jedi never do that.

 

Time period? I would say about 100 years before the time of Exar Kun. (I kind of like the idea of using old Exar as the main reference point in these games).

 

They could also introduce some foreshadowing for a trilogy based on Exar.

[Lord Zacarus]

I agree with the topic starter. Make a game that takes place in the Mandalorian Wars but have real time combat incorporated not just a straight up RPG. Give it an academy feel to it. That would respond better. Except with choosable dialog and custom character and skill.

[GhostofAnakin]

I agree with the topic starter. Make a game that takes place in the Mandalorian Wars but have real time combat incorporated not just a straight up RPG. Give it an academy feel to it. That would respond better. Except with choosable dialog and custom character and skill.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

No, just no.

[Lord Zacarus]

Man why dont you stop smokin yoda and think about it. It would be nice.

[Darth Flatus]

I would love an ending to Kotor to completely not include Revan or the Exile. Don't even mention their collective sorry asses

 

Testify, brother!!

[GhostofAnakin]

Man why dont you stop smokin yoda and think about it. It would be nice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Because this is a ROLEPLAYING GAME, and not some twitch game. I don't want it to be like Jedi Academy because it's not SUPPOSED to be like it. If you want that kind of game, then go suggest it on the Jedi Academy forums.

 

People need to stop trying to change the kind of game KOTOR is. <_<

[Plano Skywalker]

Man why dont you stop smokin yoda and think about it. It would be nice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Because this is a ROLEPLAYING GAME, and not some twitch game. I don't want it to be like Jedi Academy because it's not SUPPOSED to be like it. If you want that kind of game, then go suggest it on the Jedi Academy forums.

 

People need to stop trying to change the kind of game KOTOR is. <_<

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Agree with you there. There will always be Jedi Academy or an Ep III-type game for people who want more of an action game. I want Obsidian to produce SW ROLEPLAYING GAMES, whether they are called "KOTOR" or not.

 

That is not to say they couldn't introduce some Real Time elements (such as dogfighting) but the main combat encounters should be Active Turn Based (like we have now), IMO.

[Odinson]

I would love an ending to Kotor to completely not include Revan or the Exile. Don't even mention their collective sorry asses

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually this is not a bad idea. Not because they're a collection of sorry asses, but because it would be easier to make a game without tying in both characters, their genders, and their alignments. A developer will have an easier time of it to create their own myth based on the KoTOR era.

 

As for a prequel based on the Exar Kun war, maybe we can play as Nomi Sunrider.