US Presidential Elections - 2024 edition

[HoonDing]

Please Harris, just win Florida so this nonsense is over immediately instead of waiting til at least Saturday

[majestic]

2 hours ago, BruceVC said:

And the slip of paper with the number is that  a print out linked to the voters role?

Here in Commie-Land, you're automatically added to the electoral roll based on your primary residence. You only need to register to vote if you're living abroad. Whenever there's an election, your local municipal government sends you the necessary information via mail, i.e. when the election is held, where to go to vote and the slip of paper with your electoral roll number on it that @Lexx mentioned. You just show up to vote, hand over your slip, are handed your ballot paper in return and off to vote you go. These people also check your ID in case they don't know you - so when you're living in one of the larger cities, for instance, you'll probably need an ID on you.

As I am from the suburbs I never had to show my ID to vote. Kinda pointless when you're on a first name basis with the guys checking the ID.

Then again... we also usually have enough votes counted to call the elections a couple of hours after the polling stations close in most cases (i.e. a confidence interval of < 0.5% which is enough for most elections - except maybe the presidential one in a really close race), and only need a couple of days for an official final result. Quite baffling how long some nations need to get their votes counted.

[Hurlshort]

As a bunch of people already stated, in California you have a voter roll, so you just show up to vote. I'm not a precinct manager or anything, so I don't know the details. Why would someone risk fake voting as me? Voter fraud is investigated and that would be a pretty easy case to solve. The idea that there are statistically relevant numbers voting fraudulently is a just a big red herring. Florida did a big investigation in the last election and spent a bunch of money to catch like 12 people. 

Driver's licenses and passports are not free. I don't even have a valid passport right now. The only documents in the US people are really expected to have are your birth certificate and Social Security card. But you shouldn't be carrying those around. The artist formally known as Gorgon already explained that though.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

5 hours ago, Lexx said:

So, how many hours until we know who won?

Regardless of the results, Trump will declare victory in about 12 hours. And after the votes are counted and if Trump doesn't have the electoral college, there will be months of lawsuits trying to force recounts or disqualify voters. So maybe over a thousand.

[BruceVC]

30 minutes ago, Hurlshort said:

As a bunch of people already stated, in California you have a voter roll, so you just show up to vote. I'm not a precinct manager or anything, so I don't know the details. Why would someone risk fake voting as me? Voter fraud is investigated and that would be a pretty easy case to solve. The idea that there are statistically relevant numbers voting fraudulently is a just a big red herring. Florida did a big investigation in the last election and spent a bunch of money to catch like 12 people. 

Driver's licenses and passports are not free. I don't even have a valid passport right now. The only documents in the US people are really expected to have are your birth certificate and Social Security card. But you shouldn't be carrying those around. The artist formally known as Gorgon already explained that though.

Well South Africa  hasnt had issues of rampant voter  fraud either but we have a system of ID requirement to vote 

You dont have a system like this because of historical cases of voter fraud, its just  a way  of confirming you are the person on the voters role

Anyway its clear to me its not  as common as I assumed. Interesting to know 

 

[Malcador]

Why so concerned with voter fraud in the US, Bruce ?

Edited November 5 by Malcador

[BruceVC]

31 minutes ago, Malcador said:

Why so concerned with voter fraud in the US, Bruce ?

I dont think there is mass voter fraud in the US and I  believe  elections are free and fair 

It just surprised me that you would have elections in any state or country without ID, or another form of identification, checks 

But its more common than I assumed.

 

 

[Pidesco]

17 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

I dont think there is mass voter fraud in the US and I  believe  elections are free and fair 

It just surprised me that you would have elections in any state or country without ID, or another form of identification, checks 

But its more common than I assumed.

 

 

The principle in the US, unlike in most of the developed world, is that people should not be forced to have a form of ID. So if not everyone has to have an ID, and not everyone, additionally, has easy access to a form of ID, due to specific socio-economic constraints, requiring ID to vote is a targeted form of suppression.

 

Essentially if you require ID to vote you should provide ID to all who are eligible to vote.

[Gfted1]

28 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

It just surprised me that you would have elections in any state or country without ID, or another form of identification, checks 

But its more common than I assumed.

It was a surprise and revelation to me too. Here in IL a state ID costs $20 / 5 years (free if youre over 65) but I do agree that every single person over 18 should be automatically issued a government ID card. Hell, imo, we should be getting a DNA sample at birth too. Unsolved crime would disappear in a generation.

[Amentep]

1 hour ago, BruceVC said:

 its just  a way  of confirming you are the person on the voters role

You still do that with voter rolls though, since you can only vote at that location. Extra layers sometimes just add more exploitable gaps rather than more security.

 

8 minutes ago, Gfted1 said:

It was a surprise and revelation to me too. Here in IL a state ID costs $20 / 5 years (free if youre over 65) but I do agree that every single person over 18 should be automatically issued a government ID card. Hell, imo, we should be getting a DNA sample at birth too. Unsolved crime would disappear in a generation.

It might, but it'd also theoretically gives people the ability to create airtight frames of innocent people if they're able to access your DNA profile.

[Zoraptor]

3 hours ago, majestic said:

Quite baffling how long some nations need to get their votes counted.

The final results take two weeks here because of Special Votes, which we have a lot of (more than 25% of total). That's people voting out of electorate, from overseas, registered too late; and we also allow on day registration. All of those have to be manually checked, and generally skew enough to change the result by a couple of seats since specials always bias Left, which has been significant in a 120 (ish, often have overhangs from Maori Party winning electorates disproportionately) seat parliament. Last election despite being a 'landslide' the specials meant three parties were needed for a coalition rather than two.

[Malcador]

Have to show ID of some sort here in Canada, 1 photo ID or combination of your voter card and a bill or something official with your address on it.  You can vote without it but you need someone to vouch for you, interestingly enough.  But for most people, they have that, usually DL.

I remember using my passport and the poll guy telling me it wasn't proof of citizenship.

[rjshae]

My sympathies for all the US election workers and the stuff and nonsense they have to put up these days for just doing their patriotic duty.

[majestic]

2 hours ago, Malcador said:

I remember using my passport and the poll guy telling me it wasn't proof of citizenship.

 

[Malcador]

Lot of bomb threats disrupting the polling.  Trump not moaning about that, I guess, heh.

[Bartimaeus]

The initial prognosis tonight looks poor for Kamala Harris. Still early, but looks poor.

Edited November 6 by Bartimaeus

[Hurlshort]

10 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

The initial prognosis tonight looks poor for Kamala Harris. Still early, but looks poor.

It looks exactly like it did in 2020. There are still a ton of states and counties to go.

[Bartimaeus]

15 minutes ago, Hurlshort said:

It looks exactly like it did in 2020. There are still a ton of states and counties to go.

No, it does not: like the last election, when I was in here repeatedly calling for calm because things actually looked pretty good for Biden early on despite how nasty the initial tallies looked, I am looking at individual county level shifts to determine whether or not she is running behind or ahead of Biden, and it does not look great so far. It's not out of reach with Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin yet by any means, but the initial shifts do not favor her, especially in Pennsylvania: I will post again when things either look determinedly either grimmer or rosier. So far, North Carolina has been lost outside of some unforeseen hail mary (like different countries not dropping election day vs. early vote dumps in a consistent/predictable manner)  - the margins are just too terrible.

Edited November 6 by Bartimaeus

[Malcador]

Biden ****ed up again, should always have been a one term president. Senile ****.

[Bartimaeus]

25 minutes ago, Malcador said:

Biden ****ed up again, should always have been a one term president. Senile ****.

I feel like it wouldn't have changed that much: the biggest issue to voters this cycle is "the economy", and historically speaking, the incumbent party loses when that's the case, no matter if it's justified or not.

[Malcador]

At least would have had more time, and perhaps a stronger candidate then. 

[Hurlshort]

18 minutes ago, Malcador said:

At least would have had more time, and perhaps a stronger candidate then. 

Kamala is plenty strong as a candidate. She won the debate, she brought energy. Hopefully it really is just the economy that screwed her over. It is starting to look like a woman just can't win, which is sad. Kamala is worlds apart from Hillary, and yet I keep seeing people online bringing the two up together.

That all being said, it is a long night, so we will see what happens.

[Malcador]

15 minutes ago, Hurlshort said:

Kamala is plenty strong as a candidate. She won the debate, she brought energy. Hopefully it really is just the economy that screwed her over. It is starting to look like a woman just can't win, which is sad. Kamala is worlds apart from Hillary, and yet I keep seeing people online bringing the two up together.

That all being said, it is a long night, so we will see what happens.

She seems to be, but didn't work here. Who knows, maybe it was something as stupid as not going on Rogan, the public is amazing some times.

[Bartimaeus]

Unless there's something a bunch of election/vote analysts that I've been following for the election don't know something about PA, WI, and MI (the same ones that I followed in 2020 that helped inform me everything was looking rather promising), it would seem that we can now be fairly confident that Donald Trump will be the next president of the United States of America. Not absolutely certain, but fairly confident. There's still some legit hope of Democrats retaining the House to limit damage, but I don't know that I'd exactly say they are favored.

(e): Also, it goes without saying that the Senate has also been lost. Very bad news for the already broken judiciary, but it is what it is at this point.

Edited November 6 by Bartimaeus

[Malcador]

Embarrassing.