US Presidential Elections - 2024 edition

[LadyCrimson]

26 minutes ago, Hurlshort said:

It is starting to look like a woman just can't win, which is sad.

Oh, I have no doubt it'll happen at some point. But right now, it doesn't matter the candidate's merit - there are still plenty of people who aren't ready for a female US President (vs Mayor/Senator etc), whether consciously or not. They may not be (talking) on this forum, but we're a pretty small demographic. As someone who disliked Mrs. Clinton a whole lot, I'd agree Kamala is much different, but eh. Her short campaign time did not help at all either, I'm sure.
 

4 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

we can now be fairly confident that Donald Trump will be the next president of the United States of America.

Well, I would consider that extremely "sucky", but then again, he didn't bring about the total downfall of the US/world his first term, so I guess I can at least hope that'll be true again. The knowledge he couldn't try to run again is also a sour-grapes plus I suppose. Or he'll die from old age before his term is up anyway.

[Bartimaeus]

His platform is a little different this election than it was the last two times. I guess we'll see what happens and just how strong our institutions are: I do not think nearly strong enough in the face of re-electing someone who has run specifically on revenge and breaking those institutions, especially if all three branches of the government are completely captured. May it be that he just decides to go back to tweeting every day while basking in adoration rather than doing what he has said he would do. Good luck to all of us, I suppose - both here at home and abroad as well.

Edited yesterday at 04:55 AM by Bartimaeus

[HoonDing]

Harris even losing the popular vote

 

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

13 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

His platform is a little different this election than it was the last two times. I guess we'll see what happens and just how strong our institutions are: I do not think nearly strong enough in the face of re-electing someone who has run specifically on revenge and breaking those institutions, especially if all three branches of the government are completely captured. May it be that he just decides to go back to tweeting every day while basking in adoration rather than doing what he has said he would do. Good luck to all of us, I suppose - both here at home and abroad as well.

I think the most likely thing to happen if Trump wins, which I've said I've felt is likely to happen for months now, is that he does indeed go back to tweeting and doing rallies because that's just who he is. At the end of the day Trump doesn't believe in anything but Trump having a fun time, the worst things the Trump White House did the first go around were things that Republican think tanks had been cooking for decades in their dark money hell pits rather than something Trump himself thought of. The problem is that he's going to let an even more noxious gang of ghouls run things for him while he parades around for the next four years, and you can bet your ass they're going to **** things up.

[Bartimaeus]

To my surprise, it's still quite possible that Democrats will control the House, though most likely by a narrow margin (maybe as much as 5...but also they might still lose it by 5 as well). Not certain yet, but it doesn't look too terrible to at least prevent lasting legislation. Judiciary will still be completely hosed, of course, and many of the different agencies run through the executive are likely to be completely gutted (and in fact, I suspect the federal administration will be emboldened to withhold funding for anything it doesn't like even if it is actually mandated by legislation), but I guess it might be something. Though honestly, it might be more fun to see Republicans try to live with a, like, +1 margin in the House...but really, I'd rather not give this particular administration trifecta control.

Edited yesterday at 05:46 AM by Bartimaeus

[BruceVC]

10 hours ago, Amentep said:

You still do that with voter rolls though, since you can only vote at that location. Extra layers sometimes just add more exploitable gaps rather than more security.

 

It might, but it'd also theoretically gives people the ability to create airtight frames of innocent people if they're able to access your DNA profile.

Its too early to say who will win but its looking like Trump will win unless Harris can maintain the Blue Wall

I will comment further once the outcome is confirmed

But I wanted to clarify something about the purposes and usage  of ID  documents in the USA and the opinions of US members would matter because this may differ from state to state

Do you not need a official ID document to open a bank account, get a drivers license, get any kind of credit or similar account or a passport? And when you fly domestically dont you need an ID for verification?

 

 

 

 

 

vrs

[Malcador]

What is a search engine, I wonder

[BruceVC]

Just now, Malcador said:

What is a search engine, I wonder

Sure Malc , Im not going to research  the answers to  these questions in each state when we have people  living in the US who know exactly how it works

Call me lazy but its just practical considering the differences in states 

[Zoraptor]

1 hour ago, Hurlshort said:

Kamala is plenty strong as a candidate. She won the debate, she brought energy. Hopefully it really is just the economy that screwed her over. It is starting to look like a woman just can't win, which is sad. Kamala is worlds apart from Hillary, and yet I keep seeing people online bringing the two up together.

From the outside* Harris seemed a far better candidate than ClintonH and to make a pretty good fist of it. Definitely hamstrung by the shorter lead in, and not having a primary. Don't think being a woman was the deciding factor for either, assuming Harris does lose- I mean, if ClintonH had won in 2008 and Obama lost in 2016 we might be saying the deciding factor was skin colour instead of lack of Y chromosomes. The biggest issue on the Democrat side was that their leadership didn't seem to learn anything from 2016 and just decided they lost because of sexism and berniebros rather than anything to do with them. That's typified by going all in on Biden who was obviously having difficulties that were... unlikely to be lessened by campaigning.

The biggest factor overall is that Trump is a terrible candidate in the orthodox sense, but manages to turn that into a bonus when campaigning. Or at least when campaigning as a non incumbent, bit difficult to be an 'outsider' when you're president. People also don't really realise how effective his speeches are because the political/ media etc classes- and most people here- tend to be taught to write/ speak a particular way which is not how you actually think the relevant thoughts you're expressing. Trump speaks a lot more how people naturally think, with a load of digressions and odd elipses as things come to mind. Which seems terrible to pundits and speech writers, but to a lot of people it's a communication style that instants connects because it is the way they think.

*just take everything with that disclaimer so I don't have to type it every time

[Malcador]

6 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Sure Malc , Im not going to research  the answers to  these questions in each state when we have people  living in the US who know exactly how it works

Call me lazy but its just practical considering the differences in states 

Why not, you should know the states of the handful of people active in this thread, just go look it up for whatever reason you're so keen on this.

[BruceVC]

1 minute ago, Malcador said:

Why not, you should know the states of the handful of people active in this thread, just go look it up for whatever reason you're so keen on this.

Why are you so  concerned with me asking specific questions? Is it a big problem for you

If people dont want to respond they dont have to, its not a big deal. No need to get butthurt 

 

[Malcador]

54 minutes ago, PK htiw klaw eriF said:

I think the most likely thing to happen if Trump wins, which I've said I've felt is likely to happen for months now, is that he does indeed go back to tweeting and doing rallies because that's just who he is. At the end of the day Trump doesn't believe in anything but Trump having a fun time, the worst things the Trump White House did the first go around were things that Republican think tanks had been cooking for decades in their dark money hell pits rather than something Trump himself thought of. The problem is that he's going to let an even more noxious gang of ghouls run things for him while he parades around for the next four years, and you can bet your ass they're going to **** things up.

Think he'll reward RFK Jr or just cast him aside? Would be pretty funny if the latter.

 Galling part is that homunculus Stephen Miller being back

[Bartimaeus]

It's officially over, Pennsylvania has been called for Trump.

We probably won't know who won the House for at least a few days or maybe more, depending on how close some of the races get.

[rjshae]

4 hours ago, Malcador said:

Lot of bomb threats disrupting the polling.  Trump not moaning about that, I guess, heh.

Word is the Russians were behind it, along with a number of disinformation videos.

[Lexx]

If Trump will win, I have lost my trust in all of you americans.

/Edit: Did a quick google. I really can't understand this. wtf, americans are some of the dumbest people on the planet. If any american around here feels insulted now, yeah, you probably should be. This is just absolutely embarrassing for your country.

Edited yesterday at 06:58 AM by Lexx

[BruceVC]

3 minutes ago, Lexx said:

If Trump will win, I have lost my trust in all of you americans.

/Edit: Did a quick google. I really can't understand this. wtf, americans are some of the dumbest people on the planet. If any american around here feels insulted now, yeah, you probably should be.

Lets assume Trump has won because its more than likely

Democracy is the winner either way. For  me the most important reality of any Democracy is can you see leadership change through the ballot box and US elections demonstrate this time and time again

This is not the same as the implementation or success of policies because thats a mixed bag 

Imagine living in Russia, China or any other autocracy where you dont have free and fair elections and you stuck with the same leadership for years or decades

This election like all US election has been decided on voting issues and more importantly what voting issues matter the most to voters because there were at least 5-6 key issues but they  dont all have the same significance to US voters

And the 2 issues that IMO mattered the most was the border\illegal migration and the economy: inflation

The latter is not really the Dems fault because we went through global inflation influenced primarily by the Corona lockdowns and how  that ended. But you  can definitely blame the Dems for the former.  Its hard to make a convincing argument that Dems have done well on  the border\illegal migration

But the point Im making is most US voters vote on the issues that directly impact and concern them and the incumbent party will take the knock for this

I dont think Americans are stupid to vote like this, I would argue its the expected voting outcome in most Democracies 

The interesting part now will be how effective Trump will be in addressing these core issues, border\illegal migration and the economy: inflation

And that remains to be seem 

 

 

 

 

[Elerond]

1 minute ago, BruceVC said:

Democracy is the winner either way. For  me the most important reality of any Democracy is can you see leadership change through the ballot box and US elections demonstrate this time and time again

I that really true though? Considering how elected officials selected who can vote.

[melkathi]

41 minutes ago, rjshae said:

Word is the Russians were behind it, along with a number of disinformation videos.

Word is the Russians are behind everything.

They so zealously meddle, they even started the rumours that they are behind everything.

And if you are missing socks - the Russians.

[BruceVC]

2 minutes ago, Elerond said:

I that really true though? Considering how elected officials selected who can vote.

What do you mean by that?  People arrived to vote and the voting outcomes were determined by the choices they made

If Harris had won the same swing states that Biden won in 2020 then the Dems would have won this 2024 election?

 

[Elerond]

13 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

What do you mean by that?  People arrived to vote and the voting outcomes were determined by the choices they made

If Harris had won the same swing states that Biden won in 2020 then the Dems would have won this 2024 election?

 

That in many states they removed people from voter registry just before election.

In case where couple swing states decide president, the system isn't that democratic, it is more stateratic. But as system was created to give states power so it is what it is. 

 

Trump won Pennsylvania so it seem that he will be the president. And it looks that Trump will win all swing state, but it also looks that after California's vote is counted Kamala will have popular vote

Edited yesterday at 07:39 AM by Elerond

[Pidesco]

29 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Lets assume Trump has won because its more than likely

Democracy is the winner either way. For  me the most important reality of any Democracy is can you see leadership change through the ballot box and US elections demonstrate this time and time again

This is not the same as the implementation or success of policies because thats a mixed bag 

Imagine living in Russia, China or any other autocracy where you dont have free and fair elections and you stuck with the same leadership for years or decades

This election like all US election has been decided on voting issues and more importantly what voting issues matter the most to voters because there were at least 5-6 key issues but they  dont all have the same significance to US voters

And the 2 issues that IMO mattered the most was the border\illegal migration and the economy: inflation

The latter is not really the Dems fault because we went through global inflation influenced primarily by the Corona lockdowns and how  that ended. But you  can definitely blame the Dems for the former.  Its hard to make a convincing argument that Dems have done well on  the border\illegal migration

But the point Im making is most US voters vote on the issues that directly impact and concern them and the incumbent party will take the knock for this

I dont think Americans are stupid to vote like this, I would argue its the expected voting outcome in most Democracies 

The interesting part now will be how effective Trump will be in addressing these core issues, border\illegal migration and the economy: inflation

And that remains to be seem 

 

 

 

 

If you vote in a platform that is explicitly undemocratic, democracy definitely does not win.

[Chairchucker]

Condolences America, this sucks.

 

Re: voter ID, not required here in Australia. They asked me my name, address, maybe my date of birth, I don't remember for sure, then ticked me off a list. But yeah the imaginary threat of voter fraud is less significant than the very real use of ID laws to suppress voting by, disproportionately, ethnic minories, poor people, elderly people.

[BruceVC]

1 minute ago, Chairchucker said:

Condolences America, this sucks.

 

Re: voter ID, not required here in Australia. They asked me my name, address, maybe my date of birth, I don't remember for sure, then ticked me off a list. But yeah the imaginary threat of voter fraud is less significant than the very real use of ID laws to suppress voting by, disproportionately, ethnic minories, poor people, elderly people.

And you dont have to produce any type of ID verification to confirm those things?

So they assume what you tell them is true based on the voters role information?

 

[Chairchucker]

5 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

And you dont have to produce any type of ID verification to confirm those things?

So they assume what you tell them is true based on the voters role information?

 

Like I said, no voter ID required. Just use some common security questions I guess.

[Lexx]

Apparently voter turnout was much lower than last time. It's just such a lol thing. I guess democratic voters were so sure of winning that they felt no need to go to vote... again. Just like last time with Trump.

Edited yesterday at 08:00 AM by Lexx