The All Things Political Topic - new edition

[Gromnir]

EXCLUSIVE: DA says indictment announcement coming this summer in Trump probe

Willis revealed the timetable in a letter to local law enforcement in which she asked them to be ready for “heightened security and preparedness” because she predicted her announcement “may provoke a significant public reaction.”

no doubt ms. willis is concerned 'bout the need for heightened security 'cause she is intending to indict relative nameless fake electors or perhaps lindsey graham, or...

am not a fan o' idle speculation in the absence o' facts, but this story, assuming is true, makes the question o' whether or not trump will be indicted in georgia much less o' a question, eh? 

HA! Good Fun!

[Guard Dog]

Three torpedoes in the water. Two are homing. The suspense is killing me! 

[Guard Dog]

Don Lemon and Tucker Carlson fired on the same day? Two turds with one flush!

[Sarex]

 

[BruceVC]

https://www.newsweek.com/tucker-carlson-gets-offer-russia-state-media-1796379

Tucker has been offered a job in Russia and apparently he has been offered a VERY  lucrative deal in Sweden

@Azdeus  and @Pidesco

I know you guys arent big fans but its good to have alternative views on the news...less echo-chambers?

He could really shake things up in Sweden and he said he likes Swedish food 

 

[Pidesco]

1 minute ago, BruceVC said:

https://www.newsweek.com/tucker-carlson-gets-offer-russia-state-media-1796379

Tucker has been offered a job in Russia and apparently he has been offered a VERY  lucrative deal in Sweden

@Azdeus  and @Pidesco

I know you guys arent big fans but its good to have alternative views on the news...less echo-chambers?

He could really shake things up in Sweden and he said he likes Swedish food 

 

First if he likes Swedish food, it is just more evidence that he is unhinged.

 

Now, his views are not his views. As a Fox News employee, he was a mouthpiece for the billionaire class, like the rest of Fox News. The media landscape does not need a made up, astroturfed "side" for things to be balanced. There are not two sides to every issue. Sometimes issues are more complex than that, and the brainless reduction of discussions to stupid talking points helps no one. Fox news is actively and intentionally destroying the social fabric. It is not needed anywhere.

[Guard Dog]

If a cable TV channel could even do such a thing that social fabric needed to be destroyed.

[Gromnir]

fyi, the state efforts to prosecute trump, assuming such efforts by the respective state DAs proceed as anticipated, is not gonna result in trials starting soonish. if ms. willis indicts in july, then a trial is unlikely to happen until late first quarter o' 2024, or even a bit later. the ny thing, if it even goes to trial, will occur late 2023.

however, the feds do different than states insofar as speedy trial is concerned. defendants have a right to speedy trial in state court proceedings as well as fed, but is likely trump don't want speedy. am assuming team trump will delay state prosecutions as long as possible and it sure looks as if the state prosecutors dragged their feet before indicting. the feds tend to be meticulous 'bout building their cases, and they rare charge unless they is certain they will win, so if charges are brought against trump by the feds, then am suspecting more than a few people will be surprised by just how quickly a fed trial happens. 

observation: if the feds get a first crack at trump and succeed in convicting trump for the mar-a-lago documents kerfuffle, then significant pressure on state prosecutors to bring trump to justice is removed. am not reading the minds o' the ny or ga prosecutors, but we cannot help but recognize how much easier the political lives o' willis and bragg  become if trump is already convicted by the feds before state criminal trials begin.

HA! Good Fun!

[BruceVC]

13 hours ago, Pidesco said:

First if he likes Swedish food, it is just more evidence that he is unhinged.

 

Now, his views are not his views. As a Fox News employee, he was a mouthpiece for the billionaire class, like the rest of Fox News. The media landscape does not need a made up, astroturfed "side" for things to be balanced. There are not two sides to every issue. Sometimes issues are more complex than that, and the brainless reduction of discussions to stupid talking points helps no one. Fox news is actively and intentionally destroying the social fabric. It is not needed anywhere.

Yes I was just joking, Sweden doesnt need the type of divisive media  rhetoric that Tucker specializes in. Also do you have right wing or left wing dedicated media houses in Sweden? We dont in SA, all our  local media houses are centralist with left wing\liberal leanings generally 

Besides he wont leave the US. It will be interesting to see where he ends up working, I predict it will be one of the more  right media houses than Fox like Newsmax?

[BruceVC]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/25/south-africas-president-and-party-sow-confusion-over-leaving

I have mentioned before that SA often makes inconsistent statements around our foreign affairs and foreign policy views 

Here is an example, our president yesterday at a media conference with the Finnish president  said that SA is leaving the ICC again only for the ANC to retract that statement a few hours later with another statement, to quote 

"Ramaphosa told reporters on Tuesday: “The governing party, the ANC, has taken the decision that it is prudent that South Africa should pull out of the ICC largely because of the manner in which the ICC has been seen to be dealing with these types of problems.”

Within hours however, his office issued a statement saying “The presidency wishes to clarify that South Africa remains a signatory (to the ICC).”

The statement said the “clarification follows an error in a comment made during a media briefing held by the governing African National Congress.”

I like our president, he means well and really tries to address our domestic problems  but he must fire his speech writers and the people that update him on world events 

 

[xzar_monty]

17 hours ago, BruceVC said:

I know you guys arent big fans but its good to have alternative views on the news...less echo-chambers?

Whenever someone puts forth this argument, especially if it also contains the suggestion that "both sides are probably right in parts, and the truth is somewhere in between", I think of a discussion between a mathematician and someone who approaches numerals from a refreshingly different viewpoint. The first person thinks that 2+2=4, whereas the second thinks that 2+2=22. Thus, we'd be forced to conclude that 2+2=13.

[BruceVC]

17 minutes ago, xzar_monty said:

Whenever someone puts forth this argument, especially if it also contains the suggestion that "both sides are probably right in parts, and the truth is somewhere in between", I think of a discussion between a mathematician and someone who approaches numerals from a refreshingly different viewpoint. The first person thinks that 2+2=4, whereas the second thinks that 2+2=22. Thus, we'd be forced to conclude that 2+2=13.

Im not saying both sides are right in a debate, it depends on the topic and how people reflect on the issue

And you definitely can agree to disagree in many debates and sometimes the truth is  in between. For example  "is the media an important and relevant institution" and there are many opinions that people have on this based on their experiences. I think the media is critical in any sustainable  Democracy for numerous reasons that include public and private sector accountability and just informing people of news. But then you get examples of culture wars media where both the left and right peddle stories a certain way and thats not right or helpful IMO 

And then you get absolute truths and there are no grey areas or truths in between like Russian war  atrocities committed in Ukraine or the clamp down within Russia on freedom of speech and a free media

For me debates are not complicated, they just can be  nuanced 

 

[uuuhhii]

1 hour ago, xzar_monty said:

Whenever someone puts forth this argument, especially if it also contains the suggestion that "both sides are probably right in parts, and the truth is somewhere in between", I think of a discussion between a mathematician and someone who approaches numerals from a refreshingly different viewpoint. The first person thinks that 2+2=4, whereas the second thinks that 2+2=22. Thus, we'd be forced to conclude that 2+2=13.

one could argue some vile screaming lunatic are less repulsive and more honest than some hiding behind enlightened centrist attitude

 

[BruceVC]

43 minutes ago, uuuhhii said:

one could argue some vile screaming lunatic are less repulsive and more honest than some hiding behind enlightened centrist attitude

 

Possibly but I dont think a screaming vile lunatic would make very convincing points but the suggestion  made  me laugh 

[Hurlshort]

5 hours ago, uuuhhii said:

one could argue some vile screaming lunatic are less repulsive and more honest than some hiding behind enlightened centrist attitude

 

One could argue, but one would still be wrong.

But really I'm thankful for a free media, even though that means we end up with vile screaming lunatics on the 'news'. They only exist because they have an audience, and the best way to counter them is to offer that audience a better option. The truth does tend to win out. Building your house on lies and hyperbole is really only going to work in the short term. Eventually it will catch up with you. Both Fox News and CNN are dealing with this to some extent right now. I think they both will survive it, but certain mouthpieces will need to be sacrificed to make it through.

[Gorth]

15 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

Whenever someone puts forth this argument, especially if it also contains the suggestion that "both sides are probably right in parts, and the truth is somewhere in between", I think of a discussion between a mathematician and someone who approaches numerals from a refreshingly different viewpoint. The first person thinks that 2+2=4, whereas the second thinks that 2+2=22. Thus, we'd be forced to conclude that 2+2=13.

Actually, there is a third option... both are right (both the mathematics and the participants in a debate).

(complex numbers can give you some really oddball looking results when adding the imaginary component to the equation)

Like arguing whether an object is round or green... sometimes both are right, even though they can't see past their own narrow perspective and close off their mind to additional information. 'Or' being the problem, as neither can accept 'and' in its place.

[Gromnir]

HA! Good Fun!

[Gorth]

1 hour ago, Gromnir said:

HA! Good Fun!

From what I've seen being attributed to her the last 24 months (quotes), that is probably no state secret. I find it worrying that anyone actually listens to her (and by extension justifies her existence in the media landscape).

[Chairchucker]

2 hours ago, Gorth said:

From what I've seen being attributed to her the last 24 months (quotes), that is probably no state secret. I find it worrying that anyone actually listens to her (and by extension justifies her existence in the media landscape).

People vote for her because she hurts the people they've been told to hate.

 

EDIT: Great example in that clip of how people who use 'woke' as a pejorative are worthless and should be ignored.

Edited April 27, 2023 by Chairchucker

[BruceVC]

13 minutes ago, Chairchucker said:

People vote for her because she hurts the people they've been told to hate.

 

EDIT: Great example in that clip of how people who use 'woke' as a pejorative are worthless and should be ignored.

Please dont tell me you go around saying to people  " Im woke " ....please dont tell me

Imagine walking into a bar and saying to  people "hi everyone, I just wanted to tell you Im woke " 

[xzar_monty]

37 minutes ago, Chairchucker said:

EDIT: Great example in that clip of how people who use 'woke' as a pejorative are worthless and should be ignored.

A survey done in England found out that well over two thirds of Britons would use "woke" in a disapproving sense, and only 11% would use it approvingly.

I'm also not certain whether anyone condemning other people as "worthless" on the basis of one single word is worth taking seriously, in a discussion. Pot and kettle, and all that.

[Lexx]

As soon as someone uses "woke" in an argument, I'm already mentally checking out, tbh. It's like a flag that tells you this is just a waste of time.

Edited April 27, 2023 by Lexx

[xzar_monty]

11 minutes ago, Lexx said:

As soon as someone uses "woke" in an argument, I'm already mentally checking out, tbh. It's like a flag that tells you this is just a waste of time.

For me, "patriarchy" is another word like that, except in strictly historical contexts. Modern buzzwords [sic] are often just like that: unnecessary and ill-defined, and often, as you say, an indication in themselves that the discussion is probably not going to be very good.

EDIT: Also, whenever someone says "radical left", it's almost guaranteed they have nothing worthwhile to say and probably don't even know what they're talking about.

Edited April 27, 2023 by xzar_monty

[Chairchucker]

1 hour ago, BruceVC said:

Please dont tell me you go around saying to people  " Im woke " ....please dont tell me

Imagine walking into a bar and saying to  people "hi everyone, I just wanted to tell you Im woke " 

I don't go around calling myself a 'libtard', but I still know to disregard the opinions of people who use that as a pejorative, too.

[xzar_monty]

19 minutes ago, Chairchucker said:

I don't go around calling myself a 'libtard', but I still know to disregard the opinions of people who use that as a pejorative, too.

Looking at it from the outside, what I find especially interesting about the US political culture is the utter and complete disregard for even the idea of any kind of consensus or compromise. Both sides hate and despise each other in similar ways and with identical amounts of vitriol, to the extent that it really doesn't matter which side you're on, the very fact that a side has been chosen, out of two, appears in itself to be a huge problem already.

For instance, when you said that "people who use 'woke' as a pejorative are worthless", there is no difference in that to how a Republican may condemn liberals as softies  who ought to just píss off or whatever. It's the exact same game.

(Btw, I don't know if you're American, so this may not necessarily pertain to you.)

It's astonishing to see how the culture has changed. Here's Nixon talking about some of his political enemies. You don't get this anymore!

 

Edited April 27, 2023 by xzar_monty