Coronavirus 666: The Number of the Delta Variant (but in an entirely scientific context)

[Gfted1]

Amsterdam Cops Use Batons, Dogs to Disperse Anti-Lockdown Protesters.

So sad. This could have all been prevented with a couple of pepper gas drones.  

[Gromnir]

20 minutes ago, KP on top of ZA WARUDO said:

Call me crazy, but the story of Aaron's Cousin's Friend just illustrates that crowded events are a horrible idea during this pandemic.

agreed. assuming the kings referenced is nba or nhl, that means is indoors, so makes a bad scenario even worse. then add people like "friend's cousin" who test positive and don't see anything wrong with trying to do an end-around on the system, and no doubt others who has acquired fraudulent passports, and such gatherings is kinda asking for there to be unnecessary spread. 

*chuckle*

'course even with rational limits on large venue gatherings am assuming "friend's cousin" would simple try and find a crowded sports bar to watch the game, and not see the problem in going to such a location following a positive rapid test.

HA! Good Fun!

ps can't spell friend?

Edited January 3, 2022 by Gromnir

[teknoman2]

1 hour ago, rjshae said:

It's not unheard of to get a false positive. The policies are there to play the odds at a high level.

As its not unheard of to have false negatives or vaccinated people who died of covid anyway. Nothing is 100% effective in protecting you from getting sick or transmitting it to others so I'm not talking about the point of the rules, i'm talking about how irresponsible the average person is when they think they are safe.

[BruceVC]

39 minutes ago, Gfted1 said:

Amsterdam Cops Use Batons, Dogs to Disperse Anti-Lockdown Protesters.

So sad. This could have all been prevented with a couple of pepper gas drones.  

I really dont understand this aversion to non-lethal drones like you have suggested in the past , they can deployed to placate violent protests instead of using the  resources of the police only. They can reduce the casualties amongst protesters and police because confrontations will be less? But you will still need the police to mop up and for arrests of those breaking the law

The only problem with them is I wonder if they can be selective enough because if you consider your standard protest their are always people protesting peacefully and then  those breaking the law with looting and other criminal behavior? And sometimes both these groups are intertwined in the protests 

And I am not sure what basic human rights and the right to protest would say about peaceful protestors being pepper sprayed ? But for this Amsterdam protest drones would have been useful 

 

[Gfted1]

23 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

The only problem with them is I wonder if they can be selective enough because if you consider your standard protest their are always people protesting peacefully and then  those breaking the law with looting and other criminal behavior? And sometimes both these groups are intertwined in the protests 

Yeah thats always the excuse. Thats why non-lethal methods would be so efficient here...the first window that gets smashed...RELEASE THE GAS DRONES!

 

23 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

And I am not sure what basic human rights and the right to protest would say about peaceful protestors being pepper sprayed ? But for this Amsterdam protest drones would have been useful 

I think the Europeans consider it "war crime" or some nonsense so theyre doomed to take the beatings and bitings.  Ooooooooh, I just remembered the good ole water cannons too! A million years ago I was at a "protest" in Berkley CA and some clowns flipped over a police cruiser. A few minutes later the authorities deployed the water cannon and blasted them off the street. Lol it was so goddamn funny to see people getting nailed by a high pressure water stream.

[Hurlshort]

42 minutes ago, teknoman2 said:

As its not unheard of to have false negatives or vaccinated people who died of covid anyway. Nothing is 100% effective in protecting you from getting sick or transmitting it to others so I'm not talking about the point of the rules, i'm talking about how irresponsible the average person is when they think they are safe.

Wait, that actually is unheard of. How many vaccinated people are dying of covid? 

[Gromnir]

39 minutes ago, teknoman2 said:

 i'm talking about how irresponsible the average person is when they think they are safe.

you included self. you recognized you would do as did "friend's cousin" in a similar situation.

...

if this is some kinda suggestion that mitigation efforts is doomed 'cause o' irresponsible people, using self as an example o' ordinarily irresponsible, am gonna suggest we see an obvious flaw in your reasoning which might be eluding you.

HA! Good Fun!

[Gromnir]

Just now, Hurlsnot said:

Wait, that actually is unheard of. How many vaccinated people are dying of covid? 

not unheard of, but prohibitive less likely. nevertheless, somehow the existence o' any vaccinated person dying o' covid, or extreme small numbers o' such folks, is a good reason to not engage in mitigation efforts or to get vaccinated. 

as the % of people who is vaccinated increases, necessarily the proportion o' vaccinated people who die from covid will increase. the math challenged cannot unravel the puzzle behind such an obvious result. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

11 minutes ago, Hurlsnot said:

Wait, that actually is unheard of. How many vaccinated people are dying of covid? 

A few. Probably more if variants aren't effected by the vaccine. 

However at present the numbers of people dying are heavily skewed towards those who haven't had the shots. Very heavily, it's like comparing people in the US who got AIDS from sex and drug use with an infected person to those in the US who got it through a blood transfusion. One is clearly a much bigger issue than the other.

[BruceVC]

49 minutes ago, Gfted1 said:

Yeah thats always the excuse. Thats why non-lethal methods would be so efficient here...the first window that gets smashed...RELEASE THE GAS DRONES!

 

I think the Europeans consider it "war crime" or some nonsense so theyre doomed to take the beatings and bitings.  Ooooooooh, I just remembered the good ole water cannons too! A million years ago I was at a "protest" in Berkley CA and some clowns flipped over a police cruiser. A few minutes later the authorities deployed the water cannon and blasted them off the street. Lol it was so goddamn funny to see people getting nailed by a high pressure water stream.

" war crime " , if its not that it will be  something similar that human rights lawyers will object to. @Elerond normally explains the EU laws reasonably without making it personal or political 

I know I shouldnt find it funny but the thought of your water cannon story made me laugh 

If I think of some of the violent protests in SA and the USA and the sense of impunity and entitlement to break the law a water cannon would go a long  way to restore order. Maybe even more effective than non-lethal drones ?

 

[Gfted1]

38 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

I know I shouldnt find it funny but the thought of your water cannon story made me laugh 

The water cannons loaded with blue dye is even better.

[ShadySands]

2 hours ago, Gromnir said:

not unheard of, but prohibitive less likely. nevertheless, somehow the existence o' any vaccinated person dying o' covid, or extreme small numbers o' such folks, is a good reason to not engage in mitigation efforts or to get vaccinated. 

I've literally had this conversation with more people than I'd care to admit. 

Them: What's the point of getting vaccinated if you can still catch it?

Me: Lower odds of serious illness

Them: But you can still die

Me: Yes, but the likelihood of that happening is drastically reduced

Them: 

Me: 

Them: If you're going to the store grab me a lottery ticket

Edited January 3, 2022 by ShadySands

[Elerond]

3 hours ago, Gfted1 said:

Yeah thats always the excuse. Thats why non-lethal methods would be so efficient here...the first window that gets smashed...RELEASE THE GAS DRONES!

 

I think the Europeans consider it "war crime" or some nonsense so theyre doomed to take the beatings and bitings.  Ooooooooh, I just remembered the good ole water cannons too! A million years ago I was at a "protest" in Berkley CA and some clowns flipped over a police cruiser. A few minutes later the authorities deployed the water cannon and blasted them off the street. Lol it was so goddamn funny to see people getting nailed by a high pressure water stream.

Using pepper pray against people is only war crime in war, when police uses it against civilians it is okay

[Gromnir]

6 hours ago, ShadySands said:

 

Me: 

 

them: if you would just be reasonable and realize the pandemic is 90% hysteria and 10% disease, we would already be back to experiencing pre-pandemic normalcy.

...

is such a massive disconnect, and to think the disconnect were artificial and intentional is the real tragedy. pre-pandemic we had a hardened group o' antivaxxers, but they were few in number. then the pandemic hits and politicians begin conflating mitigation efforts with liberty and second amendment issues.

keep in mind, the extent of the antivaxx response were not an obvious response even back in mid 2020

"them" thinks shady is buying into yet another liberal-democrat hoax invented to distract from real problems. your preoccupation with the pandemic is just another example of trump derangement syndrome, but is only partial shady's fault 'cause mass and social media is hiding the truth from you. it is imperative you self educate like "them" 'cause the real answers are out there. 

like so many issues today, the the pandemic became a binary with "them" being unreasonable and "them" looking very different depending on party affiliation and/or where/how you get your news. if you listen to conservative radio or enjoy fox, no doubt you are less concerned about an exaggerated disease which is only killing people with preconditions which woulda' killed 'em in a few years anyways. conservative radio listeners wonder why shady cannot be reasonable and see the obvious: mask mandates and the vaccine are just the first step in the government's efforts to take your liberty.

didn't need be this way, but now that there is clear defined sides and a recognition o' "them" being unreasonable regardless o' your chosen position, we see no way to easily fix what is broken. 

*descends from soapbox*

HA! Good Fun!

[teknoman2]

16 hours ago, Gromnir said:

you included self. you recognized you would do as did "friend's cousin" in a similar situation.

...

if this is some kinda suggestion that mitigation efforts is doomed 'cause o' irresponsible people, using self as an example o' ordinarily irresponsible, am gonna suggest we see an obvious flaw in your reasoning which might be eluding you.

HA! Good Fun!

i at least have the honesty to admit my flaws, i don't use the virus as an excuse to jump on the moral high ground and act like i'm better than the others.

[Gfted1]

Welcome to this forum.

[rjshae]

17 hours ago, Elerond said:

Using pepper pray against people is only war crime in war, when police uses it against civilians it is okay

It's a bit off topic for this thread, but the use of chemical agents is now restricted, at least in Seattle.

Seattle council approves modified regulations for police use of less lethal weapons

[Gromnir]

6 hours ago, teknoman2 said:

i at least have the honesty to admit my flaws, i don't use the virus as an excuse to jump on the moral high ground and act like i'm better than the others.

no, but you do have the vanity and narcissism to ascribe your faults to "quite a few." 

again, is not your suggestion that there is irresponsible and selfish people out there which offends. problem is you make a jump to the futility o' mitigation and vaccination; assume your flaws doom mitigation and vaccination is exact the arrogance which seems to offend you.

edit: please recall before private vaccine mandates for workers were instituted, many cops, pilots, nurses or others claimed they would quit rather than get vaccinated. when the actual vaccination policies were instituted, the moral high ground folks whimpered a bit but overwhelming got vaccinated. united airlines, for example, a frequent target o' ted cruz, exceeded 95% vaccination rate for employees by late october.  as such am finding it is o' limited efficacy to put to much stock into what antivaxxers claim they would or would not do when confronted with mandates n' such. look at what people do as 'posed to what they say or claim. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Edited January 4, 2022 by Gromnir

[pmp10]

22 hours ago, Hurlsnot said:

Wait, that actually is unheard of. How many vaccinated people are dying of covid? 

Roughly 5% of deaths are among fully vaccinated. 
That's why anti-vaxxer love to compare number of deaths while conveniently forgetting to mention vaccination rate among population.

[LadyCrimson]

On 1/3/2022 at 7:22 AM, rjshae said:

It's not unheard of to get a false positive

Sure ... but it's still pretty irresponsible to get a positive result and just ignore it like that vs. going elsewhere immediately to get retested to be sure.

Although imo that shows more how ineffective these measures are at actually screening people, in terms of preventing "postives" from entering public crowded events. But I'm not sure what they should do. Stamp their forehead with a "DISEASED" temp tattoo so they can't just waltz in through another line doesn't seem like a good/ethical idea either.

[Gromnir]

please recall how quick we got accustomed to a new normal post 9/11, and the truth is a follow-up terrorist attack were far less likely than is a large venue event becoming a super spreader situation.  three thousand died 9/11. total. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us according to a stanford study, trump rallies alone 'tween late june and late september o' 2020 (just three months) resulted in at least 700 deaths. tell people how similar to new airport security changes they need be hours early to gain entry to a large venue event so they may be rapid tested and need provide proof of vaccination? no entry w/o proof o' both?  hardly a forehead stamp, eh?

would people have complained? sure, but if were a nonpolitical recommendation from cdc and got backing from virtual all political leaders on both sides o' the aisles, people woulda' gotten acclimated to such changes fast... and such stuff woulda' been far less intrusive than the patriot act which most americans went along with absent much criticism.

try and tell us what people won't do or will resist doing ignores what they has done during past epidemics and specific recognizing how passive people went forward with far more serious changes post 9/11. mask mandates? *insert eye roll* covid-19 has been different 'cause skeevy politicians made different and 'cause some people keep excusing what were done for no reason other than political opportunism.

HA! Good Fun!

ps am also just fine with going obvious and not doing large venue with fans present, particular indoors, at least until we get decent antivirals and a few more people vaccinated.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Gromnir

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

29 minutes ago, LadyCrimson said:

But I'm not sure what they should do.

The most obvious would be to not hold crowded events in the first place.  Covid precautions are looking to be too easy to circumvent (my personal experience is that they're a joke, but I do live in Texas) and being packed together in enclosed spaces is a perfect recipe for mass transmission of the rona. Staying home sucks and all that but dying or getting disabled by long covid seems worse.

[rjshae]

42 minutes ago, LadyCrimson said:

Although imo that shows more how ineffective these measures are at actually screening people, in terms of preventing "postives" from entering public crowded events. But I'm not sure what they should do. Stamp their forehead with a "DISEASED" temp tattoo so they can't just waltz in through another line doesn't seem like a good/ethical idea either.

That would be fun though.

[LadyCrimson]

6 minutes ago, KP on top of ZA WARUDO said:

The most obvious would be to not hold crowded events in the first place

Oh, I agree with that. Just keep them to televised pay events or whatever, dunno. 

But if you're going to allow such events, I assume usually because money, apparently they need to do a better job/be a lot more strict, is all.  >.>

[Gfted1]

I got my booster shot yesterday, another nothingburger. I wish they would have given me the 10ml instead of the 5ml dose.