Rangers in 5.0

[elohinen]

34 minutes ago, thelee said:

nope. bear is definitely decent for survivability, but other pets are viable. resilient companion helps, so does just healing your pet. worst case, just spend 2 bond to revive your pet (with the ability).

 

hunter's claw is amazing. it does require a wee bit of metagame knowledge, but you can sorta tell what enemies you're going to face as you enter an area. and "race" here means one of kith, wilder, vessel, spirit, beast, primordial. primordials are probably the one that's uncommon enough that it's not worth really stacking up with (except for megaboss, since hauani o whe is a primordial). but otherwise it's so good it's worth dual-wielding melee weapons [since when dual-wielded you double your potential hunter's claw stack speed] and just spamming only that, plus self-empower for extra uses, just for the first few fights after a rest to max out your bonus. (and technically, it's bugged, so if you save/reload you can stack infinitely). +20 accuracy is huge and applies to everything you do (including spells, if you're a multiclass). same with +20% damage (it also applies to spells). the +20 defense option is good for a tankier build since by being an "All defenses" bonus it stacks with deflection-only bonuses like mirror image, arcane veil,  or even a dagger modal. basically hunter's claw is so good that you would have to have a very good reason not to pick it up on any and all rangers. (note: do not combine a hunter's claw build with the woedica god's challenge as you'll have a very bad time)

 

strictly speaking, given that you can get up to +50 accuracy (+10 marked prey, +10 stalker's link, +20 hunter's claw, +10 survival of the fittest vs <50% health targets), you could completely dump perception altogether and still crit enemies left and right. but personally i don't like dumping stats below 5 or 6, and it takes a while for the ranger to really ramp up all their accuracy bonuses, and on PotD enemies have high defenses, so as a general rule on PotD i really try to avoid pulling perception below 10 at all, doing so only if it's a character that is not really offensively minded (a buffer, a healer, or a tank).

Huh, I'm really glad my initial impression of Hunter's Claw was way off then! I'm toying around with a shifter/stalker multiclass, but I was kinda bothered by the idea of only having one 'weapon' attack (wounding shot), but good to know HC won't be a waste of points.

Thanks for such an in-depth answer!

 

[Boeroer]

Bear Spiritshift/Stalker is pretty cool because you'll get quite the high AR without any recovery penalty. 

[Kaylon]

Hunter's Claw doesn't stack with Marked Prey. For that reason Nature's Resolve + Marked Prey/Devotions for the Faithful is always the better option because you can have the same accuracy without restrictions. I usually pick Hunter's Claw just to get the bonus accuracy/dmg vs vessels ( always good to have against skeletons, animats, vampires) and then respec out of it.

[thelee]

6 hours ago, Kaylon said:

Hunter's Claw doesn't stack with Marked Prey.

hi, i think my current run (as well as the last few runs where i brought along maia) would like to talk to you.

 

edit: from my guide and my own tests:

"Marked Prey (AL1): interestingly, the +10 accuracy bonus here is implemented not as an accuracy bonus on yourself against a specific enemy, but as an effect on the enemy that triggers an accuracy bonus on a specific character targeting it. Sounds real subtle, but this has the ramification that the accuracy bonus from Marked Prey stacks with other active accuracy bonuses, so long as they are not implemented in a similar "marked" mechanism (and I don't think any do; the only other marked mechanism I can think of is the paladin's Sworn Enemy and that one instead boosts damage)."

edit 2 - the magistrate's cudgel also bestows a "marked" accuracy bonus, but being from an item i'm not sure whether or not it stacks with marked prey.
 

Edited February 26, 2020 by thelee

[Kaylon]

1 hour ago, thelee said:

hi, i think my current run (as well as the last few runs where i brought along maia) would like to talk to you.
 

You're right, even if it has no logical explanation. Because Borrowed Instinct or Judge don't stack with Hunter's Claw or Marked Prey, I assumed they all suppress each other. 

[thelee]

44 minutes ago, Kaylon said:

You're right, even if it has no logical explanation. Because Borrowed Instinct or Judge don't stack with Hunter's Claw or Marked Prey, I assumed they all suppress each other. 

 

in theory the deadfire stacking system makes sense, but in practice a more explicit D&D style "named" bonus type (where only the highest of a type is used, but different types stack) would be better. that's effectively what's happening right now, except the "name" of a type of bonus isn't really clearly surfaced anywhere, leading to unintuitive outcomes like marked prey.

[gandrasch]

I'm fairly new to PoE2, but not CRPG as a whole.

 

I'm going with a Ghost Heart / Beguiler Seer, as it a good combination for getting additional dialogue options and I like the magic gun wielder theme a lot. Only playing normal, so it doesn't have to be ultra optimized, but I still don't like the feeling of having a badly build character.

Will probably be a Death or Nature Godlike, for flavour and options mostly, but now I'm struggling with attributes.

I've read somewhere might isn't that important for non caster damage, so I'm thinking about leaving it at 10, raising Perception to 20, Dex to 16, Int to 16 aswell and dumping Con and Res to 8. Does that make any sense?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Boeroer]

If you can pile up some other damage bonuses (like weapon quality for example) then MIG doesn't have that much of an impact after a while. Stats do make sense. But they don't have such an enormous impact anyway, so you're good. The early game feels easier with high PER because you will not miss/graze that often and you will be able to find all secrets and traps (early official companions don't have high PER).

Since you chose Beguiler you already took the powergamer route, so don't worry.  Also Ghost Heart + Cipher can be nice because you can drop the Animal companion right behind an enemy and then cast Ectopsychic Echo.

By the way: Takedown Combo will apply its 100% dmg bonus to damage over time spells and not go away if the spell does no initial direct attack. So you can use Takedown Combo + Disintegrate and get +100% damage for every tick of raw damage. Which is already high.
Very nice also: charmed enemies (Whisper of Treason/Ring Leader) don't become hostile again when you cast Disintegrate (or Soul Ignition) on them.

So all in all: good combo.

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Boeroer

[Haplok]

Yeah, its a good combination. Race selection is probably not optimal, but it doesn't have a great impact, so whatever.

Personally I think I'd want a little more Might, at least 14. Not a huge difference, but at least something. Probably at the cost of dumping Res further, as it's not that important for a ranged character.

Edited March 4, 2020 by Haplok

[kronozord]

On 1/27/2020 at 10:57 AM, Boeroer said:

So, I still had a savegame with him. Only of the testing session on Port Maje though - the savegame of the run I did I seem to have deleted. But I guess the test dummy is good enough because I don't remember that I changed a lot of stuff (besides adapting to encounters during the run of course).

The gist of it is that you use Willbreaker and turn your Animal Companion (AC) and an Essential Phantom into your main damage dealers - while you drop down the defenses of the enemy - and then also deal damage.

The Essential Phantom inherits your items. If you are currently equipped with Concelhaut's Draining Touch (CDT) then the Phantom will have it as well - and it will not lose it on hit. Instead it will keep it until the Phantom is killed or expires.
CDT targets Will instead of Deflection and also has high base damage - so on crits it does substancial damage even with the non-optimized phantom. It also drains health which lets the phantom last a lot longer. It weakens on hit - that lowers enemies' fortitude and health. All in all a formidable weapon. 

So what we want to do is to throw enemies' will defense on the ground - so that the phantom (or us when while are using CDT) will crit nearly every time. Dazzling Lights + Miasma + Willbreaker will drop enemies will defense really fast and reliably (-50 and beyond if you also use terrifiy effects).
Your phantom will crit the heck out of such will-debuffed enemies. Club would be even better, but here's the other part of the build that calls for a Morning Star:

The Animal Companion, besides his normal attacks + passives, has Takedown Combo (TDC) which makes the next attack on target get +100% dmg. This can be used with the phantom for a really hefty CDT smash or for your spells (like Necrotic Lance or Killing Bolt). Unfortunately TDC targets fortitude. That's why we will use a Morning Star + modal to lower enemies fortitude by 25 via Body Blows. This makes it way easier for the AC to land its TDC. The Phantom with CDT also helps (-10 fortitude). Besides TDC also a lot of spells profit from the lowered fortitude. So the Willbreaker is the ideal weapon for this combo since it lowers fortitude AND will. 

It's important that we really hit the enemy with our initial debuffs before the phantom and AC can go to work, Hence we need lots of ACC.

At the same time we are also tanking a bit for our compagneros who are not supersturdy - so we want to have very high AR. Stalker, spells, armor and items help. 

If you want to also attack with the CDT once your enemies are set up correctly and you seek to clean up more quickly you can use the "keep CDT for the whole encounter" trick: only cast it from a grimoire (don't learn it). Once it's there, before hitting anything with it, change the grimoire to one that doesn't have CDT: voilá - it will not disappear after a successful hit and you can use it like a regular weapon - very effective in combo with club + modal in a dual wield setup to drop enemies will even further and without the need to recast Miasma etc. all the time. I'd only do that when enemies' fortitude is low anyways and the enemies are not supertough. In boss encounters the Morning Star is always better in my opinion because several impactful spells need to overcome fortitude (e.g. Combusting Wounds vs. Lich Dragon which really helps to bring it down a lot faster).  

Besides that you also want to interrupt the enemy once its about to do something that would really mess you your strategy. That's why Concussive Shot/Transquilizer is so good. That's also why I don't keep hitting the target mindlessly with my morning star but ionstead watch what it does, let the AC/Phantom do the hitting and stay ready to interrupt or debuff the enemy. Nothing's more frustrating when you see the enemy starting a nasty ability but you can't interrupt because you are in the middle of a recovery phase. Since our recovery is rather long due to armor we want to fight smart, not hard. The dmagae dealing is done by our guys anyway.

----------------------

Race: Mountain Dwarf (not that important, Coastal Aumaua, Wild Orlan are also nice - resistances in general are good since neitehr Ranger nor Wizard have passives for that. Pale Elf is also good)

Background: Old Vailia - Hunter (background doesn't really matter but I want the +1 INT)

Classes: Stalker/Wizard (was pre Bloodmage - I would consider Bloodmage nowadays. The combo of Concelhaut's Corrosiphe Siphon and regeneration gear + Blood Sacrifice is hard to pass. Although an empowered spell + Takedown Combo can save the day, too)

MIG: 10
CON: 11
DEX: 17
PER: 18
INT: 19
RES: 03

Skills: Athletics 20, Survival 20 (you'll have to retrain for certain events, this was used during the fight with Neriscyrlas - I didn't need the Survival though. I guess a leftover from some skill check before)

Abilites (I fiddled around with the console with this test char, so maybe there's too few or to many abilities here, I didn't double check)

Ranger:

• Actives:
  • Wolf Companion: highest damage per hit. But I would consider Boar or Bear for better staying power due to endless regeneration/higher AR.
  • Marked Prey --> Mark of the Hunt: We want the bonus ACC mainly for the tough-to-hit bosses in order to debuff for our allies (Phantom & Animal Companion)
  • Wounding Shot --> Accurate Wounding Shot: same, also unlocks Predator's Sense as a bonus
  • Takedown --> Takedown Combo: works with spells and also for the Phantom's attacks
  • Hunter's Claw: wasn't present when I did this. I think I would take it now if I had enough metagaming knowledge - e.g. if I knew which enemies come next. You can really supercharge your ACC against bosses during some mob encouters before if you know whom to hit with it. 
  • Concussive Hot-->Tranquilizer: you really really want to use this gainst some bosses (e.g. to prevent Neriscyrlas from casting Llengrath's Safeguard)
• Passives:
  • Vicious Companion
  • Resilient Companion
  • Merciless Companion
  • Protective Companion --> Stalker's Link (more ACC)
  • Predator's Sense
  • Survival of the Fittest (more ACC)

Wizard:

• Actives (important ones in bold; besides Concelhaut's Draining Touch it doesn't matter if from Grimoire or learned. Make it so that you don't put too many points into leanred spells but also have a collection of these without too much Grimoire swapping):
  • Arkemyr's Dazzling Lights (lowers Will directly by 10 and dazes--> enemies' PEN -4 - which is important since our sturdyness comes from AR/underpenetration of enemies)
  • Spirit Shield (Concentration + AR is golden)
  • Miasma of Dull-Mindedness (massive -40 drop of Will defense which stacks with Dazzling Lights and -10 Deflection)
  • Mirrored Image (prevents crits should we get targeted)
  • Combusting Wounds (always good if you have multiple sources of attack rolls - like two allies)
  • Necrotic Lance (nice as early single target spell in combo with Takedown Combo - but only the initial dmg will get the +100%, not the DoT)
  • Concelhaut's Corrosive Siphon (source of healing)
  • Infuse with Vital Essence (more INT = more duration)
  • Essential Phantom (our super punchy ally)
  • Llengrath's Displaced Image (see Mirrored Image)
  • Ryngrim's Repulsive Visage (terrify targets Will and lowers Will at the same time and is very powerful alltogether)
  • Concelhaut's Draining Touch (do NOT learn this but use it from a Grimoire - see "the gist" description above)
  • Arkemyr's Wondrous Torment (like Miasma but longer range and lasts longer - backup if you have no uses left for Miasma)
  • Llengrath's Safeguard (more AR when things go south)
  • Ryngrim's Enervating Terror (moar terrify!)
  • Iron Skin (everlasting +5 AR as long as you don't get hit - can have its uses)
  • Citzal's Martial Power (+20 ACC for the times you really can't hit something)
  • Substancial Phantom (should you run out of essential ones - this is actually worse in our case since it often starts to casts spells when we want it to smack things)
  • Ninaguath's Killing Bolt (great with Takedown Combo's +100% dmg boost)
• Passives:
  • Rapid Casting
  • Martial Caster
  • Quick Summoning
  • Accurate Empower (if not Bloodmage obviously)

Items (will change from encounter to encounter obviously - depends whom you are facing - but basically) :

• Head:
  • Death's Maw (great early game source damage reduction that stacks with underpenetration)
  • White Witch Mask (terrify when blooded is nice, the +1 PL for our Illusions/Will debuffs is as well)
• Back:
  • Shroud of the Phantasm (Animal Companion also gets its Living Illusions: hilarious. Also I had my Living Illusions cast Essential Phantoms: even more hilarious). 
  • Three Trolls Stiched (in combo with other regenration items can be nice for a Bloodmage)
  • Cloak of Greater Deflection (due to our low RES we can really use some more deflection)
• Neck:
  • Cog of Cooh (Communal Carnage is not that important but nice - but the constant Aware inspiration from my dudes killig things sells it)
  • Wahaki Tua (when you don't want to get terrified)
  • Strand of Favor (generally useful especially for a 3-RES char)
  • Precognition (the crit protection can be a live saver against arquebus gunners and such)
  • Dragon Pendant (agaisnt slashing enemies it's great: +1 slash AR that stacks)
• Armor:
  • Nomad's Brigandine (I didn't use anything esle once I got this. Tactical Withdraw: it's so useful for this char to cancel enemies' engagement entirely. With the Horde gives us +5 deflection all the time as AC and Phantom are always there, Head of the Column gives us another +5 deflection vs. melee weapons - stacks nicely with stuff like Mirrored Images)
• Hands:
  • Gatecrashers (the knock down occurs from time to time because we crit frequetly due to our very high ACC + flanking, Reeling Blow is nice)
  • Hylea's Talons (to keep up Predator's Sense most of the time)
  • Corroded Vambraces (reduce enemies' PEN by -1 on 50% of crits: nice)
  • The Left Hand of the Obscured (terrify chance on crit: nice)
  • Engwithan Bracers (when you really don't want to get Paralyzed etc.)
  • Bracers of Greater Deflection (see Cloak)
• Weapon:
  • The Willbreaker (Battered Mind, Unavoidable Demise - will drop Fortitude by 25 points via Body Blows which we will never turn off. Will also lower Will per hit)
  • Concelhaut's Draining Touch (pure destruction to targets with low Will and corrode AR)
• Rings:
  • Ring of Greater Regeneration (especially Blood Mage)
  • Ring of Regeneration
  • Ring of Minor Protection
• Waist:
  • Blunting Belt (most of times)
  • The Maker's Own Power (when you are facing mostly crushing enemies and expect to get pommeled real hard)
  • Undying Burden (best if your enemies are underpenetrating at -3 anyway - since its DR stacks with underpenetration - like Death's Maw)
  • Upright Captain's Belt (when you face pushing enemies you really want this - else they push you away from your AC and you'll lose 1 AR which we don't want)
• Boots:
  • Boots of Speed
  • Boots of the Stone (resistance)
• Pet: Abraham (I used nothing else although Animancy Cat might be nice as well for the Phantom in situations where it has trouble penetrating)

 

 

Do you think this build would work for Maia?

I made her a geomancer this time around and this was the only post that i found to provide a geomancer build.

Do you recommend any grimoire in particular? She doesnt even has one for starters.

[dgray62]

This build would definitely work for Maia, although the Gunhawk subclass is less optimal than the stalker for the melee geomancer build that @Boeroer suggests. But you could still do it. As for grimoires, you definitely want a grimoire with Concelhaut's draining touch, as you do not want to learn this spell, since doing so makes the grimoire switch trick impossible. Ultimately you'll want Concelhaut's grimoire, but early game you can get the Blood Soaked grimoire from the Tangaloa temple ruins crypt on the island just south of Port Make. You can take the enemies on there early, once you're about lvl 7.

[Boeroer]

18 hours ago, kronozord said:

Do you think this build would work for Maia?

I made her a geomancer this time around and this was the only post that i found to provide a geomancer build.

Do you recommend any grimoire in particular? She doesnt even has one for starters.

As @dgray62said, Gunhawk might not be the optimal choice of subclass, but I think it would still be good. The Bird is a great animal companion (better than all other ACs) and it cannot be stopped with engagement - which makes positioning and flanking with it a lot easier. So that should work well.  

Regarding Grimoires: since this combo needs quite some abilities from the Ranger side I tried to only learn very few spells and do the rest with Grimoires. I don't have a particular grimoire in mind right now - it's too long ago and I can't recall which spells are in which grimoire, sorry.  I tend to hoard all grimoires I find though and then pick a nice collection for random encounters and some special collections for certain tough fights (for example I'd make sure to have a grimoire with Combusting Wounds against Neriscyrlas and so on).

But a ranged Geomancer Maia with the Red Hand for her & her Phantom should also be powerful I think?

[dgray62]

Regarding grimoires, naturally for any wizard you will want to keep a nice array of several choice grimoires in your quick slots. But if you are interested in going the grimoire quick switch trick, such that you cast Concelhaut's Draining Touch from a grimoire, and then switch the grimoire before striking, you'll be able to keep CDT as your main hand weapon for the rest of the encounter, which is sweet as it's an amazing weapon. If you cast Essential/Substantial Phantom the phantom will have this weapon too. But for this to work you'll have to cast it from a grimoire, and not learn the spell when leveling up. Blood Soaked Grimoire is the first grimoire that has it that you can easily get early game.

[masterty66]

On 7/3/2023 at 9:32 AM, Boeroer said:

As @dgray62said, Gunhawk might not be the optimal choice of subclass, but I think it would still be good. The Bird is a great animal companion (better than all other ACs) and it cannot be stopped with engagement - which makes positioning and flanking with it a lot easier. So that should work well.  

Regarding Grimoires: since this combo needs quite some abilities from the Ranger side I tried to only learn very few spells and do the rest with Grimoires. I don't have a particular grimoire in mind right now - it's too long ago and I can't recall which spells are in which grimoire, sorry.  I tend to hoard all grimoires I find though and then pick a nice collection for random encounters and some special collections for certain tough fights (for example I'd make sure to have a grimoire with Combusting Wounds against Neriscyrlas and so on).

But a ranged Geomancer Maia with the Red Hand for her & her Phantom should also be powerful I think?

I have done Red Hand Maia with phantom and it's definitely a solid build. 

[mjo2138]

On 7/2/2023 at 2:42 PM, kronozord said:

Do you think this build would work for Maia?

I made her a geomancer this time around and this was the only post that i found to provide a geomancer build.

Do you recommend any grimoire in particular? She doesnt even has one for starters.

I just finished Geomancer build with Maia, and basically I played her link a typical Ranger - sniping mobs and with incredible accuracy. I used the Wizard spells for Self buffs for stats, accuracy, armor, and so on. In other words, I rarely used her for CC/Dmg spells since her Int is pretty low so you really have small AoEs. I also used Red Hand w/ a Phantom and it was powerful. Great single target DPS, but it lacked the shock and awe of PL 8/9 wizard spells. Also, the small AoE radius made it harder to use one of m fav spells (the Terrify ones wizards). 

 

 I also remember reading on the forums that you can acheive really high accuracy on a single target (Mark for the Hunt + Ranger Passives + Wizard self buffs + debuffs such as Misama of Dull Mind, and others). This is also useful; what's more, using Mark for the Hunt benefits all attacks against a target, so it is super useful.