[4.1.2 MAJOR BUG] Broken core mechanic: Afflictions not supressable/not removable by inspirations

[thelee]

edit - this post has been edited to clarify the nature of this bug. For any devs, please do skim this thread, angry posts aside, due to the many examples being given. there are many interactions with afflictions that appear to be just fundamentally broken now, such as counters, suppression, resistance interaction, or weakness interaction. I do provide a dropbox link and output_save for a specific such case in this post.

 

edit 2 - a more complete summary of the rest of this thread i posted on page three, but i'll re-quote here:

it's a little more complciated then that. i forget if it was mentioned here or i mentioned in a direct message to someone else, but inspirations will still counter the affliction if the debuff is solely the affliction. (I've been able to counter some afflictions in my current run like this)

 

if, however, the debuff has more than just the affliction (like another affliction e.g. spreading plague is both hobbled and weakened) or has extra effects (like xaurip skirmisher poison is both a paralyze and a damage-over-time) what appears to happen is that dispelling an affliction just transfers the characteristics of that affliction to the remaining parts of the debuff. it's such a weird bug.

 

and then, not to mention that suppression effects don't work at all for hostile effects, and there's a lot of weirdness with weaknesses and resistances going on (e.g. fugue spores' confusion being resisted by giant cave grub, who should be weak to intellect afflictions). also i've seen very weird behavior with charm and dominate.

 

 

original post:

I thought this was just limited to Suppress Affliction, but it's not.

 

Just now, Tekehu got hit by a debuff (Putrid Blast) that both sickened and immobilized him. That's fine, his AI script is set up to use his shapeshift (which grants dexterity immunity) when he has a dexterity affliction. It dispelled the immobilized. But he still can't move. In fact, when I try to move, the game erroneously claims that the remaining Sickened affliction is the reason why he can't move:

 

 

Given that I'm also a software engineer, I try to be patient and understanding about bugs that crop up because I know they're a fact of life, but seriously, what the hell is going on that these kinds of regressions are occurring. This is especially alarming given that the game is pretty much approaching end-of-life for support if not with the next patch to bring turn-based mode out of beta, then soon after that.

 

Dropbox link to output_log and save: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kbocdfa6ag9vejf/AAAqIQSwvXVwQ6ktHld7Qzcia?dl=0

Edited March 28, 2019 by thelee

[Boeroer]

I said it elsewhere, but I suspect TB mode stirred up the code pretty nicely. Where nicely == badly.

[Phenomenum]

I blame TB mode - this patch revealed some old bugs + new bugs. Until TB patch the game was in very solid state. I hope this game is worth the candle (in terms of sales), becose if not, it will be stupid - to break almost solid game for the sake of...nothing.

 

I want to say this again: Deadfire is one of the most bugged game i've ever seen for 19 years of gaming. Shame but true.

Edited March 9, 2019 by Phenomenum

[DragonDrop]

Most likely many elements of the game engine weren't properly isolated/decoupled from other elements, which was probably fine before turn-based mode. Adding TB probably shifted many fundamental elements of the game around, causing unforeseeable bugs. This is why when I develop anything I focus on isolating the different moving parts so that changes in A don't cause unexpected changes in B. Usually you see stuff like this because someone did a fast job writing some engine code getting it working in the short term rather than the long term.

[Verde]

I blame TB mode - this patch revealed some old bugs + new bugs. Until TB patch the game was in very solid state. I hope this game is worth the candle (in terms of sales), becose if not, it will be stupid - to break almost solid game for the sake of...nothing.

 

I want to say this again: Deadfire is one of the most bugged game i've ever seen for 19 years of gaming. Shame but true.

It's the most bugged quality game I've ever played. I keep coming back but that doesn't change the reality.

[Archaven]

it is truly annoying. i thought i had wait for them to fix bugs.. but the more i wait.. the more bugs it has. i work in saas industry. i would end up in disciplinary action if i weren't able to resolve certain bugs or issues within SLA. i would say it's really nice if i don't really have to revert or even answer to any bug or technical issues at all. 

[Phenomenum]

it is truly annoying. i thought i had wait for them to fix bugs.. but the more i wait.. the more bugs it has. i work in saas industry. i would end up in disciplinary action

 

Hah, how could we know - maybe Obsidian programmers already got a huge penalies and works for food

[Woopee]

This is still happening. With Liberating Exhortation too. 

 

My Watcher just got destroyed by a party member's Essence Interrupter. Instant game over. 

Edited March 17, 2019 by Woopee

[rockfish42]

I'm waiting until the next patch to complete my playthrough because of this. I have about a 50% chance that Eder will murder everyone in the party in tough fights with dominate/charm enemies.

[Ophiuchus]

It's been happening to enemies as well: hit a Mountain Dwarf with Weakness and it gets perma-Sickened.

[Torm51]

Confirmed, tried to use supress affliction on a weakened Xoti and it did nothing.  Dang guys I really dig the turn based mode but bleh at all these new bugs!

[thelee]

It's been happening to enemies as well: hit a Mountain Dwarf with Weakness and it gets perma-Sickened.

 

can confirm this interaction. i cast interdiction (dazed) on a might resistant enemy, and it got resisted down to a staggered but now has no duration, so they are permanently staggered.

 

edit - actually, the effect went away normally, despite the lack of duration. either way, this is extremely bad regression in core gameplay.

Edited March 22, 2019 by thelee

[thelee]

UGH, but I just hit a "weakness: intellect" with confuse, and instead of it being upgraded to charmed, it got resisted down to nothing. (Giant Cave Grub at end of old city with a Fugue Spores poison)

 

what a mess, guys.

[Boeroer]

It's really a mess right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

Edited March 22, 2019 by Boeroer

[Verde]

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

It's unacceptable. I won't be supporting any Obs product at full price until I see some drastic QA changes.

Edited March 22, 2019 by Verde

[Torm51]

 

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

It's unacceptable. I won't be supporting any Obs product at full price until I see some drastic QA changes.

I played thousands of hours of POE 1 and it was troubled, but this one seems even more poorly optimized. I’m sad to say I agree.

[Gromnir]

 

 

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

It's unacceptable. I won't be supporting any Obs product at full price until I see some drastic QA changes.

I played thousands of hours of POE 1 and it was troubled, but this one seems even more poorly optimized. I’m sad to say I agree.

 

am knowing it is correlation rather than real evidence, but the game were relative stable before turn-based were added, and now it ain't.  sure, before tb there were bugs, but obsidian were fixing the bugs with each build. now it appears as if each attempt to fix bugs creates new problems, and a few bugs is soon gonna be eligible to collect social security.

 

deadfire is not a new game.  obsidian is no doubt devoting most o' their resources to other projects.  makes sense.  am doubting obsidian qa sudden got worse.  nope, am thinking deadfire gots a relative smallish post-release team, which is normal, but whoever ultimate made the decision to add tb to deadfire underestimated the scope o' additional resources needed to implement and stabilize the game after adding the new feature. simply put, somebody got bad advice or ignored good advice and added tb to deadfire w/o having the resources to do the job.  is too late.  only way to fix is to invent a time machine, cause the folks need to fix deadfire in a timely and professional manner is working on other projects, projects which got development milestones which need be reached.  fix deadfire necessarily handicaps other projects.

 

am guessing, but would appear current problems stem from the decision to glomp tb onto deadfire. am not seeing a trend.  am not thinking the deadfire problem is the kinda thing which would likely be repeated neither.  am also not making excuses for obsidian. contrary. the current issues has resulted in 0 hours of gameplay for Gromnir in the past two months.  even so, in our experience following obsidian games, this is a unique situation.  make fundamental engine changes a year after release o' a title? what could possibly go wrong, yes?

 

HA! Good Fun!

[TheWeaver]

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

 

I stopped playing about 2 months ago when I reached the same conclusion.  Rather than focusing on cleaning up the bugs that inevitably come when they add new core features (in this case the issues that came with the new sub-classes) and instead decided to use the last of their dev time on the TB stuff.  The game is entering end-of-life and so they will naturally be winding down the dev team -- makes perfect sense.  Also likely that the most skilled/senior folks will be the first to be moved on to other things.  Why on earth would they drop this in at the end?  I'm guessing it was motivated by sheer panic at the sales numbers and a sense of "well Divinity is TB and it did well -- we have this TB experiment someone did in their free time, let's drop that out there as a beta".  Too bad -- POE1 settled into quite a nice end state (not perfect, but nothing this complex ever is) and Deadfire was headed in the same direction, until this.

 

I keep poking my head back in to see if a patch has been released that pulls it back from the brink, but no such luck.  Oh well... was fun while it lasted...

 

EDIT -- just noticed the Gromnir said the same thing, much more effectively... so read his again . 

EDIT2 -- doubled checked with Steam and it had actually been since 1/26 that I fired up the game (time flies...).

Edited March 22, 2019 by TheWeaver

[Verde]

The biggest problem in my opinion, are pervasive bugs that affect basic mechanics. Since these bugs occur consistently, it changes builds. I'll give you a perfect example - the Stag spiritshift (a natural choice for badassery and 2H prof) stalls on certain HEALING spells and others, the very spells a Lifegiver would cast. The fact you can't cast Nature's Balm in Stag form is build breaking. The very purpose of a build is compromised. And there are others like AoE afflictions not applying, suppress affliction not working (for real?!) and now traps are all wonky so I need a high Per char all times. I love Deadfire enough to play multiple playthroughs but need to draw a line in the sand.

 

I played PoE1 a year out and it was great. I thought it ran well and didn't run into any memorable bugs.

Edited March 22, 2019 by Verde

[Phenomenum]

I only want to wish "Good luck" (sarcasm) to Obsidian with Outer World sales - no chance i will buy this game on release after this "bugfect" with PoE 2. And i'm pretty sure more peoples also don't buy OW on release for the same reason (exluding some devoted Obsidian fans).

 

That's how the poor quality of products can ruin company reputation.

 

P.S. Guys, you literally ****ted on yourself. Congrats!

Edited March 22, 2019 by Phenomenum

[thelee]

 

 

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

It's unacceptable. I won't be supporting any Obs product at full price until I see some drastic QA changes.

I played thousands of hours of POE 1 and it was troubled, but this one seems even more poorly optimized. I’m sad to say I agree.

 

 

PoE1 was troubled, but at least it had a good trend line and the final version is strictly more stable than prior versions, even if there are still some insanely wonky bugs.

 

I don't have the confidence anymore that Deadfire will end as a strictly more stable version of the game at release. I fear that we'll get one big patch to bring TB out of beta, the post-release team will move on to something else, and the huge disruptive effect of that one big patch will mean that there will be lots of small/big broken things stuck with us forever.

 

The fact that afflictions--a core gameplay mechanic--is in such a busted state in 4.1.2 is insane to me; I half want to find a way to revert to earlier versions, even if that means missing out on some other QoL fixes. Even Backer Beta 1 was more stable than this about core gameplay features.

Edited March 22, 2019 by thelee

[ocelotter]

So is it safe to say the last stable release of Deadfire was 4.0.1.0041? I haven't played the game yet, because I didn't feel like beta testing on "release", but if things are heading in the wrong direction maybe I'll just accept a mostly okay version. Thankfully GoG has incremental patches for each major version (version 4 at present).

Edited March 23, 2019 by ocelotter

[Torm51]

 

 

 

It's really a mes right now. Like it was just released. I don't want to play it atm because since the introduction of turn based beta there's tiny bugs crawling out of... everywhere.

It's unacceptable. I won't be supporting any Obs product at full price until I see some drastic QA changes.

I played thousands of hours of POE 1 and it was troubled, but this one seems even more poorly optimized. I’m sad to say I agree.

PoE1 was troubled, but at least it had a good trend line and the final version is strictly more stable than prior versions, even if there are still some insanely wonky bugs.

 

I don't have the confidence anymore that Deadfire will end as a strictly more stable version of the game at release. I fear that we'll get one big patch to bring TB out of beta, the post-release team will move on to something else, and the huge disruptive effect of that one big patch will mean that there will be lots of small/big broken things stuck with us forever.

 

The fact that afflictions--a core gameplay mechanic--is in such a busted state in 4.1.2 is insane to me; I half want to find a way to revert to earlier versions, even if that means missing out on some other QoL fixes. Even Backer Beta 1 was more stable than this about core gameplay features.

Saddens me, I had so much damn fun in the first one, logged 1700 hours. I never finished this one, I want to and maybe I will for the sake of knowing what happens in the story but the fact that a core gameplay mechanic is broken this far in is total crap.

[bringingyouthefuture]

Does anyone know if this is the same bug?  when a character is charmed and you use the Cipher ability Dominate on them, it use to bring your character back to your side.  Right now it doesn't though.  Was this a nerf from an earlier patch, or could this be from the same bug?

[thelee]

Does anyone know if this is the same bug?  when a character is charmed and you use the Cipher ability Dominate on them, it use to bring your character back to your side.  Right now it doesn't though.  Was this a nerf from an earlier patch, or could this be from the same bug?

 

it could be related. i've seen this happen, and it's definitely new behavior from 4.1.2 or 4.1.1

[Stardusk78]

Have Obsidian acknowledged this or are they working on it at all?