Cinéma vérité - and all other types

[algroth]

Oh, I guess that's of a direction corollary though. I'm looking at cinematography more strictly as the photographic tone that these movies achieve mostly through lighting and color gamuts. Of which ZDT really borrows from that "washed out photos documenting WW2" feel that is now used to convey the "war is hell" feeling when looking back on bleak times.

 

I can see the film's aesthetic sharing the aesthetic genealogy you mention there, but I think it's a lot more detached from the particular reference you use above. The feel is much closer to that of modern first-account war documentary footage the likes of Restrepo and so on, blending also a heavy use of optoelectronics to further focalize the narrative on the raid squad. The lighting is largely naturalistic but contrary to Saving Private Ryan or Black Hawk Down for example, the conditions surrounding these missions lend to far darker, more abstract results as often the scenes descend into sheer untouched darkness of night. Despite their being some thread whereby you can link Saving Private Ryan to Traffic to Syriana to this, I do think the feel and look is overall very different.

 

 

But... I also think the content of a film often dictates what is attempted with the photographic tone. So those two films I suggested are heavy on the messianic archetype, of which Dune I feel should follow from the classic biblical epics of cinema. Hell, a little Evangelion's "disgust at one's messianic role" could be thrown in their as Paul's diet transitions to heavily malange-laced foods. Dune exists so much inside Paul's head, the film's need a strong way of communicating Paul's inner turmoil without alienating the audience and without betraying to core character motivations. I really hope they nail the conversation Paul has with Jessica throughout the book, I think that relationship is going to be the most important to get right.

 

I can see this. Oddly enough Fraser's worked on Mary Magdalene most recently though I haven't seen that and don't really plan to. Regardless, I think that if that's the look to go to then, as you say above, a Lubezki or in my opinion a Lukasz Zal for example would likely be better candidates as well. But, again, I trust Villeneuve in this regard.

[ShadySands]

Trek4 is supposedly cancelled and I'm actually kind of glad about it. I just wonder where that leaves the Tarantino Trek which I was actually looking forward to, though out of curiosity more than anything else.

[SonicMage117]

Velvet Buzzsaw?

 

Very strange, like a mix of Layers Of Fear and sci-fi plus some Andy Worhal for good measure. And that perfectly sums the trailer up lol Interesting, not sure if my type of movie but interesting.

 

 

Also, some church

 

Edited January 10, 2019 by SonicMage117

[SonicMage117]

Harkening back to my days of Homeward Bound!

A Dog's Way Home hits theater today

[Tale]

It really shows me how far Columbia has fallen when I went to see Into the Spiderverse and the only two Sony trailers were that and some Christian film that looked like it was filmed with a budget scraped up during a potluck lunch.

[ShadySands]

I don't think I've ever seen a good Christian* movie. I realize I'm not the audience they are going for but the fact that they can't make a good coherent movie first makes me scratch my head.

 

You've got black movies that tend to have a lot of religious stuff in them but they they also tend to bed below average and I think is more due to how religious black people are rather than them making a Christian story.

 

*Ben Hur and the Ten Commandments I never really liked but I haven't seen them since I was a kid

[SonicMage117]

There's quite a few good Christian movies but they're harder to find since they usually skip theater and use the Lifetime method (Straight to televison/dvd).

 

 

There's a couple of my favorite Christian movies that I recommend. I agree that most that hit theater are low budget though, and unfortunately the better ones never get any real marketing so people - even Christians themselves never even hear of them.

 

That said, there's a streaming platform called Pureflix which has the better ones exclusive to it though if you're not a Christian or have a problem with religious topics you may not care.

 

And then there are the Hollywood movies that are not made by Christians - as far as we know - but have parallels to the Christan Bible or life of Jesus and Biblical reference. Such films would be, for example: The Chronicles Of Narnia: The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe, and The Lord Of The Rings: Return Of The King and that's probably because J.R Tolkien and C.L Lewis was rooted in the Christian church, but leaving those types of movies out because they are not produced by Christan studios directly, of course.

[Raithe]

What, the Prophecy isn't a good christian movie? 

 

[Gfted1]

Didn't everyone lose their stuff on Passion of the Christ? Ive never seen it but I hear theres a sequal in development too.

[ShadySands]

I fell asleep in that one

 

I'm an atheist but I don't really have any strong feelings towards religion one way or the other because I think that anything that makes you a better person is a good thing. This occasionally leads to friends and family trying to enlighten me with a movie or something that I need to see. I don't seek out these movies but I've seen a lot of them.

 

I lost a friend because I laughed too hard during God's Not Dead.

[Blarghagh]

I lost a friend because I laughed too hard during God's Not Dead.

I once forgot one of my friends was a protestant when I picked Dogma for movie night.

[SonicMage117]

I'm guessing some people probably don't even count Passion Of The Christ as a Christian movie since Mel and Hollywood dipped their paws into the bowl - or maybe they would just ignore it because it's the typical movie that's been made over and over.

 

I would like to recommend a particular version of Samson while we're on the subject, it's older (from 1996) but it's a good showcase nonetheless:

 

 

Cast includes:

Jonathan Rys Meyers

Elizabeth Hurley (Yum!)

Dennis Hopper (rip King Koopa!)

 

It's, of course pretty low budget and yet the casting makes for better performances than most Hollywood large budget movies anyway. I never think budget is the problem since big budget Hollywood wonders tend to rely on special effects and cinematography tricks. I think many Christian movies suffer from bad writing but as said before there are just as many good as bad just like hollywood's offering.

 

Elizabeth Hurley was pretty much always my reason for watching this movie, how she portrays the most seductive woman in the Bible is a top-notch depiction. I don't think anyone in Hollywood could do a better job mainly because natural seduction on the level of Hurley is a rare thing. I think if Eva Green was younger maybe she could match that intensity, India Eisely is getting up there so I wouldn't mind seeing her take a stab at such a role. If you don't know who Delilah was in the Bible, she was basically a top-grade escort that was hired to seduce the enemy behind lines, Samson who was more or less a Hercules figure - undefeated. His superpowers came from his brades of hair so she slept with him and while he was asleep she cut his hair. He screamed in agony and the opposing army came to arrest him, they burned out his eyes and the story continues from there.

 

I'm pretty picky on my Christian movies, as you can probably tell

[Tale]

Has this made the rounds here? It's from December, so maybe. Since I was complaining about Sony earlier, it's even more interesting that this looks like a good one. They can do well when they can grab talent.

 

[SonicMage117]

Nice!

 

I'm very excited for Horror genre this year, last year was decent but I already like where this year is going with titles like that one and Us and others which have trailers on Youtube. Horror and Thriller have always been my favorites

[Hurlshort]

 

I lost a friend because I laughed too hard during God's Not Dead.

I once forgot one of my friends was a protestant when I picked Dogma for movie night.

 

 

What, they didn't get the Catholic humor?

[algroth]

I feel few cinematic crimes are greater than the way Hollywood's slew of self-proclaimed "Christian films" has forever tainted the image of a category as rich in sheer artistry and history as is Christian cinema at large, the like which would include the works of great masters such as Robert Bresson, Carl Theodor Dreyer, Krzysztof Kieslowski, Terrence Malick and the Mozart of cinema himself, Andrei Tarkovsky. The issue at large that I see with the self-appointed "Christian films" of today is two-fold: firstly it's that they tend to be "Christian" only inasmuch as they are morality tales dressed with scripture and Christian discourse/iconography so as to assume the pretense of a "Christian message", but tend to completely leave the desire to capture and represent the Christian *experience* on the wayside, which is instead an aspect that so many of the aforementioned filmmakers focused on to create films that whilst deeply Christian proved to be very universal by extension; and secondly there's the matter that for the most part in my experience the discourse these films follow aren't even necessarily Christian and more a hodge-podge of Christian morality, general American conservative ideology, and in the worst cases such as the God's Not Dead films quasi-political aspirations and cult-like partisanism, all handled in a manner so blatantly sermonic that it makes the Soviet social realist films look measured in comparison.

 

But, again, you look past this very specific category and into the broader world of Christian cinema and there is a *lot* of great stuff to be found. Here's a few I can recommend (and granted, some of these may be contentious):

 

Dekalog (Krzysztof Kieslowski, 1989) - granted, a miniseries, but I think it's too essential not to include here

Stalker (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1979)

The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1928)

Sacrifice (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1986)

Andrei Rublev (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1966)

A Canterbury Tale (Michael Powell and Emeric Pressburger, 1944)

The Gospel According to St. Matthew (Pier Paolo Pasolini, 1964)

Illumination (Krzysztof Zanussi, 1973)

Of Gods and Men (Xavier Beauvois, 2010)

The Flowers of St. Francis (Roberto Rossellini, 1950)

Ordet (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1955)

Diary of a Country Priest (Robert Bresson, 1951)

Edited January 12, 2019 by algroth

[injurai]

A lot of the trash-tier Christian films are either works meant to evangelize, or they are fantasies that Christians wish to tell about themselves in relation to their faith. Often taken on a narrative of modern persecution culminating in a form of redemption that is most salient to the modern ego.

 

While not a Christian file per se, I think Lady Bird is one of the most accurate depictions of how many actually experience modern Christianity growing up today. It's sort of "insider-outsider" take on Christianity (which itself is only a small portion of the films focus) is totally different from what a Christian might want to say about themselves. What I mean by this is that it's director writer was telling an impression of herself growing up so the perspective was from the inside, but the film was directed as a neutral capturing from the outside. Without the film having an agenda on any larger more profound claim on Christianity you are left mostly with a very human depictions of life, family, and church. Very few Christians want this image to be the face of what Christianity is, even though it's what is most often experienced.

 

The best Christian works that really try to capturing the message of Christ / Christianity (which in many ways was the message of Paul) they capture a conception on what a morally infallible martyr looks like in a climate of political persecution. In Christianity's case, Jews in the Roman empire. In this ordeal Christ model was that which was seen as truly immaculate and divine. A manner of living in which you bring about heaven on earth, but when confronted or challenged upon it, breaking from such a mode of being only corrupted one's own soul. It was through promise of retribution in the afterlife through which all of faith could lay their earthly squabbles down, and sacrifice not themselves but their lives to something productive and self-less. I think this is really emblematic of an older conception of the Christian faith, one that lived on in the puritans and Amish. One that was divorced of ruling power structures based on faith. Even Constantine largely converted as a means to keeping power against the backdrop of the times. Today many Christian films seem like a way of impressing upon a flock a certain modality of living that is focused on a rather isolated social realm centered upon a Church, which I remind you is free of tax and heavy on tithe requests. So it's no wonder so many of these films stray from harder theology.

[SonicMage117]

Not replying to anyone particular but just wanted to say that I've seen many Christian films and never have felt like any have "pressed their beliefs" on anyone, this is mainly due to Christian films being bluntly honest about being a Christian film - there's never been a false advertizement in Christian films as there have been with Hollywood and their political or otherwise agendas.

 

 

I think the main issue in Christian movies is that some people just don't know how to seperate Christian movies based by biblical scriptures or real life events from Hollywood secular movies which claim to be inspired by the Bible but twist scripture or add some non-biblical things that don't line up with the Christian Bible. Unfortunately, secular and non-Christian viewers just don't know enough to pin-point the differences of these types of schemes so it makes Christian films look bad altogether.

 

Perfect examples to back this up:

 

The Michael Bay-esque rock golems in Noah which Hollywood carefully crafted in order to make it seem like humans couldn't build a ship at that time period, big enough to house all the animals

 

Keep in mind that the people who came up with such a thing are probably also the type to think that Egyptians had recieved help from aliens to build the pyramids since we still can't even begin to figure out how Egyptians did, or they may be flat-earthers as well.

 

Another one, which, I don't think I have to explain - pretty much speaks for itself why Hollywood turned yet another biblical story into fantasy.

 

That being said, sometimes fantasy is more interesting than non-fantasy so some Christian films like "I Can Only Imagine" (which is about how a singer/band got inspired to write a mega-hit song about God) don't appeal to me - even being a musician which is strange because I saw and loved "American Satan" - which even though many Chritians may view that satanic, I thought it was a great breakdown to life on the road and how they represented a naive young band selling their soul to the devil was the best two-truthed that I've seen since a movie called "Crossroads".

[SonicMage117]

I did alot more thinking and felt like I had a couple more Christian films to recommend to you guys, if that's okay - if anyone is interested. I try to pick some that aren't sh!tty lol

 

These links are the full movies on YouTube, not sure how long they will stay up but it's better than being on a streaming platform.

 

First:

https://youtu.be/n2IIQvSw6rk

 

^This one is called "I'm Not Ashamed". Mainly recommended for parents or young/teenage girls. It tells the story of Rachel Joy Scott, the girl who got shot for saying that she believes in God and how til this day her ministry continues to change the world.

 

 

And then

The Cokeville Miracle

A story of that which is doubted by many but a true story which has been recorded in history. Basically, a few fools plan to bomb a school full of children, the bomb goes off with the kids inside but none of those 20-something kids get hurt? Okay... but the killers all died who were also in the same room. How do we explain it? We can't but there was scientific evidence which proved all this happened.

 

I'd be curious to listen to how anyone here think it happened after they watched the movie, I still don't know, that's for sure. Many who would see such a thing in real life would certainly say "It's a damn miracle" regardless of what they believe or don't. While others who hear or read about it will likely discard or discredit it as the usual laughing cow-head stew.

 

 

 

 

Now, the huge problem that I have with Pureflix is that I don't see the point in paying for Christian/Faith-based movies on a Streaming service. With some Christians (not including myself) always complaining that the world is getting worse, you'd figure that spreading faith and encouragement would be free of charge lol

 

 

But yeah, I think the biggest goal of Chistian movies is spreading love, positivity, faith and encouragement. I would say that if anyone is getting the feeling of uncomfortability, simply turn it off, maybe the movie wasn't made with th right intention or maybe the viewer isn't at the right moment in their life to watch. Also, who knows? Maybe someone is making "Christian" movies that aren't actually as Christian as they should be, it certainly happens alot in Christian music - most recently with Lauren Diagle constantly cornering herself until admitting she wasn't a Christian artist. This, unfortunately comes all to often with people not knowing what they want and I wish it wasn't like that but I suppose we all have to find ourselves and it happens in different ways at different times of life too. Negativity and drama always seem to creep into a church or Christian production when they are one foot in and one foot out, not totally committed.

 

Sorry, I'm done rambling now. I could talk more but I should just shut up and stop spamming lol

Edited January 12, 2019 by SonicMage117

[ShadySands]

I guess the people (most all not just the more religious ones) I know are just more... I don't know what to call them that doesn't sound condescending and honestly think those trash tier movies are moving/motivational/I don't what

 

That said, thanks for that movie list. Now maybe I can recommend some movies to them and maybe shift their perspectives.

Edited January 12, 2019 by ShadySands

[Bartimaeus]

There are lame-brained people in every walk of life, unfortunately.

[LittleArmadillo0]

I think that the biggest problem with most Christian related movies is that most turn to propaganda.

They paint the Christian characters as all good and benevolent, while others that are not are considered scum. It reinforces the idea that they are in the right, rather than focusing on the messages that make Christianity resonate with so many people.

[Tale]

Captain America: Civil War

 

I'm going through some of the good Marvel films I've only watched once. And this was as good as I remember it being. Next will be Thor: Ragnorak and Infinity War.

 

Edit: 20 minutes into Thor: Ragnarok and I'm laughing out loud. Why don't I own this on Blu-Ray?

[SonicMage117]

Thor: Ragnarok is pretty amazing. Cate Blanchet (I know I'm not spelling this right) as Hela is a good reason to own it as well

[Pidesco]

Into the Spider-Verse is just outstanding. Really, everyone should watch it.