E_Motion

So maybe some of the current Mandalorians are actually voluptuous divas hidden beneath body armor? I thought about Mira - but she doesn't have that great Australian accent (although come to think of it, I'm not sure that Mandalore does either).

Glad to do it... sorry for the typos. Also glad to see that others found them interesting. It does, I think, add a bit more story info - such as why Traya was kicked out of the academy; quite ironic btw, that she was betrayed for waiting for the right moment to attack the Jedi, mirroring Revan and Malak's betrayal of the Jedi Council. Also as mentioned earlier, the darker characterization of the Malachor V atrocity changes the Exile, in my mind - but I wish there had been other supporting info such as holochrons on the Malachor corpses with statements such as "... death and corpses everywhere... thousands... all dead..." and/or dialog for Exile better reflecting awareness of what she/he had done -- For example, instead of current dialogs to the effect "If I can help someone, I will", (LS) in my mind more apt dialog choices would have been something like "I carry a debt that this small kindness cannot begin to repay" (LS) or "I've killed millions already. Your life means nothing to me." (DS)

Just wondering. Has anyone ever seen a Mandalorean female? Is it possible that some of the Mandaloreans we see in body armor are females? How will the Mandalorians ever rise again if they don't reproduce? Do they reproduce asexually? Do they have body armor instead of skin?

The game illustrated this poorly. Not enough detail to make me believe this statement. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes and yes! When you compare, for example, the detail of Atton's or Bao Dur's comments about some of the atrocities committed by the Mandalorians with the sparce details of the Malachor V destruction, its hard to understand how Malachor V could have been equivalent, much less worse, than the actions of the Mandalorians. Having said that, I would also add that this info, provided only as loading screen info, really makes me rethink my impressions of the Exile. Too bad there wasn't similar info/emphasis elsewhere in the game.

I stumbled on quite a bit more of the story info. It rurns out that whenever you load or save a game, the loading/saving screen contains some story info. The info changes dedending on the module at the time of loading/saving. I found that the Malachor V and Ravenger modules have quite a bit of story info - so I have copied all of the info on the Ravenger and Malachor V loading/saving screens below. Btw, to see all of this in your own game, just repeatedly do a quicksave (F4) at a given location, the go to the "dialog" screen. All of the loading/saving info is found there. ********************************************* Loading/Saving Screens from the Ravenger The Sith fleet attacking Telos appears to be composed of many damaged warships... the wreckage of a great battle. All in close proximity to Visas' master find themselves succumbing to his power... and are slowly devoured by it. The Ravenger was hauled from the gravity well at Malachor V by its new master. He used it to escape imprisonment on Malachor V. Loading/Saving Screens from Malachor V Malachor V is the greatest tragedy of the Mandalorian Wars, an atrocity greater than any the Mandaorians ever inflicted on the Republic. Malachor was a forbidden world to the Mandalorians - a cultural taboo that Revan used against them. Revan marshaled the tattered remnants of the Republic fleet at Malachor, using them as bait for the Mandalorians. It is no coincidence that the Republic fleet at Malachor was composed of soldiers and Jedi whose loyalties to Revan were in doubt. The gravitonic anomalies in the Malachor System are what made Bao-Dur's mass shadow generator possible. The resultant destruction of Malachor V destroyed almost the entire Mandalorian fleet - and many of the Republic's ships as well. Malachor V's surface is constantly shifting, the planets continually crushing against each other, Earthquakes and eruptions of poison gas are frequent. The storms of Malachor V are enough to draw down even the strongest of ships. Once on the surface, there is little chance of escape. The constant pressure of war can erode even the will of the strongest Jedi... and turn them to the Sith. The death of so many Jedi, all connected to each other, created an echo in the Force. If the echoes in the force are not stopped, they will build and spread, until all who can hear it will be deafeded of killed. The Trayus Academy on Malachor is an ancient structure that was built thousands of years before the Mandalorian Wars. Revan walked the halls of the Trayus Academy, using its knowledge to learn more of the Sith - and the presence of Korriban and other dark side worlds. Revan used the Trayus Academy to influence the battle above Malachor V, using its power to affect the tide if battle and corrupt others to the Sith. The Trayus Academy somehow survived the Malachor V event - and fed on it, drawing Jedi to its surface to teach them of the Sith. Sion, Traya, and Nihilus, all were drawn to its surface after the destruction of Malachor V. Each learned a different techniqie of what the academy had to offer. From the teachings of the Trayus Academy, Sion learned pain, Nihilus learned hunger, and Traya learned betrayal... and then was betrayed in turn. Traya used her skills at manipulation to assume the dominatoin of the other Sith Lords. She wished to stucy Malachor V and the echoes it was causing in the Force. Unwilling to wait to do battle with the Jedi, Sion and Nihilus turned on Traya and began their shadow war against the Jedi.

Where did you get that number? It seems way too high given that it would require sales of one million games at a wholesale price of $25 just to break even (most companies prefer to make a profit btw). But average sales of a "hit" game doesn't currently approach that. So you got any backup for that number?

At end (male LS), when Kreia says that Revan had to leave his loved ones behind: Kreia: ... It would have helped had he made her understand ... Exile: [rolling eyes] Yeah, if only he'd paid better attention to your lectures on the art of clear communication.

Following Kreia's death at the end, Exile and crew reunite for a chorus of, "DING DONG THE WITCH IS DEAD!"

There's an interesting, and possibly similar, patch situation developing with Sid Meir's Pirates! -- rights to the game have been transfered from Atari to Take2 and now a new patch is scheduled, speculation being that the original publisher, Atari, wouldn't fund the patch; see http://www.rpgdot.com/index.php?sid=45b4ec...9a4ee5f39#39631

Good poll topic! As I reflected on how useless G0T0 was to me; the following came to mind as and end-of-game dialog addition. Handmaiden to Bao Dur [after Ebon Hawk escapes Malachor]: "I could just kiss you for sacrificing your remote to lure that pompous and useless G0T0 to his demise."

Modified dialog for the second Telos Academy visit. ***************************************** Handmaiden: "I am no longer the last of the handmaidens. I am Brianna, the ONLY handmaiden" <pause> "My snotty sisters seem to have disappeared."

Freedon Nadd's Tomb is explained by Kreia prior to that quest; without going into detail, it is significant in conveying that the right strategy for winning the military battle (occuring simultaneously with different team members) wasn't found solely in the tactics of the military battle. As to the possibility of characters falling to DS and being pulled back to LS by Exile, there are numerous references in the game to the effect that a single Jedi can change the course of history, and can strongly impact others.

...but only if you don't know the difference between a duck and a goose. Seriously, the game has a lot going for it, even with the current ending. And it has been well received because it's heads and sholders above many, many other rpgs. Nevertheless, it is also true that the game is unfinished in the sense that it's incomplete. The episodes (i) with Mira at the end, and (ii) with the remote and G0T0 at the end; simply aren't complete (i.e., they're unfinished). On balance, there's a lot of great work in the game; and IMO its fun to play and has good replay value. Still, objectively, the unfinished parts play a role in the overall evaluation and ultimately prevent a "best of the best" rating, despite the "best of the best" potential of the game.

I'm thinking now that the Exile's healing is coming from her/his new connections to ppl - after all those years in exile. When the Exile first gets on the Ebon Hawk, Atton comments on the glow, and how much she/he has changed --When Handmaiden first joins, same thing; Again when Mira first joins, same thing. Later when HM and/or Bao Dur look different, calmer, after the Tomb mission on Dxun, but won't comment on what they learned about themselves, I'm thinking that each of them had been outcasts/exiles in their own way; maybe they had connected with the others on that mission.

With the stalled patch and all, it can be easy to lose sight of the good stuff in the game - but honestly, there is plenty of it. Just noticed that RPGDot has this as #37 on the all time list of RPGs (http://www.rpgdot.com/index.php?hsaction=10070). I've been looking for the patch too ... but crazy.joe's efforts are a good thing ... I've got as big a mouth as the next guy, maybe bigger; but crazy.joe needs to be able to focus whatever efforts he can put into this, on getting whatever results he can, not worrying about passengers on the bus. So thanks. And yes, I'll sit back down now

Oops. Sorry; I'll go back to the Accountants' Forums. Guess they were more creative there than I realized,

OK. Just one more. *************************** Exile to Handmaiden: "It's time you learned force meditation. Come closer..." [Cut Scene: Entrance to storage room -- Darkness. Flashing lights. Fade out.] Exile: <in storage room with Handmaiden> "Listen. Do you hear the others?" Handmaiden: "I hear ..." [Atton: "Eschani rituals ... he knew ... he knew all along ... "] [Mandalore: "is that what he meant ... when he said ... there's more than war?" ] [bao Dur: "Can I follow you, General?"] [Visas: " I want to see what the Handmaiden saw ... feel what she felt ..."] [Mira: "Yeah, right. Now they'll both be glowing. ... what if I ask him about force bonding ... I stumble ... we touch ..."] [Kreia: "How many more?"]

How 'bout a slight mod? **************************** Handmaiden to Exile: I fear I may have hurt you. You have a large swelling. Perhaps I should <interrupted> Atton's Voice: I warned you Handmaiden! Exile and Handmaiden in unison: STFU!

And I'll go talk to Ali (Bastilla)

You may need to have a conversation with Kreia that incluces the line "You are spending time with the servant of Atris"

Exile: <at game end, after defeating Kreia> "And what will happen to my friends?" Kreia: <coming out of trance with shocked look> "I see ...Handmaiden, Visas and Mira ... no, no ...no .... All three preg..?<voice trailing off>... <pauses> ... <screaming now>I told you to use protection! Exile: <defensive> But I did! I kept my power shields on. Kreia: Fool! Exile: Schutta! Atton's Voice from the distance: Hey, that's my line!

Yes! Great observation - I hadn't seen that.

I don't think that the answer you are seeking has been fully developed. If there is a KOTOR3, I think the issues you have raised will playa central role. My view is that the Council only had it half-right in their views about the Exile's force wound - and that they mistook the Exile's benign condition to be the same as the malevolent condition of Darth Nihilius and other Sith. If you pay careful attention to Kreia, HK-47, and Atton, you will learn that the Mandalorean wars actually masked a different war - to convert LS force users to DS force users. Revan had discovered that horror and atrocities caused Jedi to lose a great deal of their connection to LS force, making them succeptable to DS corruption. Those atrocities, and Malachor V, in particular, resulted in "wounds" in the force where the LS users in particular seemed unable to connect with LS force. The Exile had always been gifted with the ability to form strong bonds with others. Revan called this a "human being" quality in discussions with HK-47 and said it would be the Exile's downfall because if ppl around the Exile were killed in large numbers, all of those bonds would surely kill him too. We also learn from HK-47 more of Revan's views that this "human being" quality is unusual because it relies on being able to feel the passions of other ppl, but that type of a human connection normally interfers with the discipline which is part of the training of Jedi and Sith. After Malachor, the Exile cut himself completely off from the force because of all of the pain. But she/he was unique in being able to do that. No other Jedi had ever done that before. Apparently it had another effect. The Exile was the only Jedi capable of walking away from Malachor V without falling to the dark side (Kreia basically tells this to the Council). In contrast, other LS force users apparently suffered great damage to their "will" which greatly harmed their LS connection to the force, but they couldn't disconnect from the force and thus kept their connection as a DS connection. Kreia has a great deal of disdain for the force because she feels that on balance the force has controlled her more than she has controlled the force. In the Exile she saw the capability to counteract the control the force had over her. Having said all of that, I will tell you that some believe that the Exile did not extablish a new connection to the force; the he/she simply used the connection of others. Vrook (who was about as closed minded as one could get) certainly believed that, and apparently convinced the other Council members of that. But Visas strongly disagreed and apparently believed that the Exile could both give and take strength from his/her companions. Visas tells the Exile that the Council does not understand what it means to be human (which clicks with Revan's observations that the Exile has human qualities but other Jedi do not). She also tells the Exile she/he should find strength from his/her companions and not exile her/himself like before. I think that the horrible thing Revan had discovered, and had gone to combat, was that she/he had uncovered a "perfect" DS strategy - the strategic use of atrocities - against which there is NO LS defense. The LS users must themselves become horrible to defeat a DS user who uses atrocities with the result that the LS user cannot win without falling to the DS. I think that Kreia, for all of her faults and deceptions, saw that the Exile with her/his ability to disconnect from the force, might be able to counter this perfect strategy. I think Kreia was preparing the Exile to help Revan. Visas advice that the Exile take strength from companions, may play a future role in allowing the Exile to have a source of strength when she/he does disconnect from the force. Also there is something special about Visas, not fully developed yet, that she was the only person to survive the Kataar masacre. I think she also has those human qualities. In fact, if you look closely you will see that Mira also survived a massacre and that Atton has massacres in his background. Bao Dur, or course, was also present at Malachor V. Handmaiden goes on to teach about how disconnecting from the force made the Exile stronger; but it may turn out that she has a greater massacre connection than we know of, perhaps through her father. Finally, Mandalore is a walking massacre. I just mention the last part in that I think most or all of these guys will play a role in any future KOTOR 3, despite Kreia's views of the future, which seemed to leave the Exile out of all of their futures. At any rate that is my current view (I may not have explicitly said it but I think that the Exile has a good connection to the force at game's end - by the way, my computer screen told me over and over the Exile was getting better and better connections to the force).

This is true, honestly. When the Manhatten Project first started up, there was a great debate within the scientific community whether the project should be allowed to continue because there was a calculable probability, albeit small, that if a chain reaction were ever started, it might not stop until it consumed all matter in the universe. As far as we know, that didn't happen (although according to some current theories of physics, every event of uncertain outcome results in the spawning of a sufficient number of parallel universes to accomidate each of the possible outcomes of the event). So I guess I should say that it never happened in our current universe. Perhaps a similar "big bang" preceeded the big bang.

You don't get that third fight until you reach a certain level.