Gromnir

am not suggesting that it takes intelligence to be curious 'bout the numbers that is highly visible but not necessarily explained in the average crpg. what meager 'mount of intelligence does it require to be exhibiting the minimal 'mount o' curiosity to question game mechanics? somewhere between octopus (an admittedly very inquisitive invertebrate) and the average nfl defensive back? is Not a question o' intellect. that being said, the state o' mind required to be seeing game mechanics mentioned in virtual all skills and abilities offered in a crpg, but to have Zero curiosity 'bout the impact on your +20 hours o' gaming is requiring a state o' mind that we suspect is most easily attained via illicit drugs. as stated earlier, we understand that attempting to fully decode the frequently self-contradictory and pervasively non-intuitive game mechanics seen in crpgs is a pursuit only a few die-hard gamers would seek to embrace. that being said, am finding it passing odd that anybody would question the motivation o' those who would be wanting to actually know what some o' those +, -, and % that is showing up in game descriptors. HA! Good Fun!

people says the weirdest things. when you level in a crpg, it is traditional to, at some pre-determined point, gets new abilities. so, how does one choose abilities. am guessing one can take mkreku complete serious and just choose random or simple looks at title of ability and choose what sounds most kewl, but that is not gonna be satisfying for all but the folks who likes to game whilst fully baked. see, virtual all games has mechanics worked right into the descriptions o' the abilities. am seeing that the swtor thread is still active, so take that game as an example. we looks at abilities for troopers and and we sees such stuff as getting an improved 2% defense chance... or should we take the ability that improves our absorption rating... or perhaps shield? how 'bout a more extreme example?. am recalling when we first were leveling our sorcerer, and we helped out an assassin do a flashpoint. the guy was frustrated 'cause he were dying so much and 'cause he couldnt hit nothing neither, so we looked at his gear. poor guy had strength and cunning and aim mods and enhancements as much, if not more, than willpower and endurance. why? 'cause surely a melee character needs strength more than willpower, right? we spent a teeny bit o' time explaining basic mechanics of game and a considerable time helping him re-gear so he wouldnt be dying quite so much. fellow seemed much happier once he knew the mechanics. is somewhat ironic that the only way the mk route o' gameplay for non-baked players would be satisfying is if game were complete and perfect balanced... and we know how mk feels 'bout balance. if any and all abilities were providing exactly same value to any and all character builds, then it wouldnt matter what ability were chosen, right? hey, Gromnir would be ecstatic to be playing such a game. would probable first need drop notion o' classes with prime attributes n' such, but that is another thread topic, eh? complex mechanics can indeed be frustrating, so we can appreciate the folks who wanna takes a bite o' the mk brownie and just play... dude. but am also recognizing that such a limited pov would make all but the most simplistic crpg all but unplayable. HA! Good Fun!

2 points 1) posting off-topic has always been the most common source of mod censure perhaps hurl has been too self-absorbed to notice, but mods likes to choose a neutral reason for killing threads and posts-- is not that hurl were being a dink or ignoramus, but simply that he was off-topic. is so much less adversarial to kill a thread or post 'cause of off-topic. really, pay attention and you will notice. 2) Gromnir's post were on-topic did we hurt hurl's feelings with the suggestion that you gots questionable taste? who cares? it were hardly a viscous insult we level'd at you, and it clearly failed to go beyond board guidelines. did we somehow crush your will so that you were incapable o' responding w/o staying on topic? your protracted whine could not have included material that kept it on-topic as well? 'course this line o' nonsense is, again, fully off-topic and likely to result in censure even if we include relevant material. ... if we has a hypothetical thread on this board that includes a review from X that slams the new south park game, and hurl questions the reviewer 'cause the reviewer also slammed fo:nv, and bg2, would anybody be shocked? "clearly the reviewer's taste in games is suspect." would such a rude observation o' the reviewer elicit a moment's notice from even the most sensitive proponents o' miss manner's school o' board etiquette? doubtful. nevertheless, Gromnir's post were like the music o' the pied piper o' hamelin overcoming the willpower o' garden variety... vermin? puhlease. nobody pulled you off-topic-- you ran. as for the dailies... server merger ("transfer"? HA!) has made doing dailies a real pain in the tukus. 58 people in the black hole? hopefully bio makes new instances open a bit sooner as the mega-servers is a bit crowded. HA! Good Fun!

no doubt you is making a point. is this your attempt to show false dilemma fallacy? ... is not a great example o' false dichotomy/dilemma, but is close enough, we s'pose. nevertheless, is always easy to picks out the folks who feels as if we has taken 'pon them a "smoldering dump." *shrug* side-note: am not sure why monkeys and the emotionally damaged is so fixated with scat. we worked at a correctional facility for a while, and residents would frequently be withdrawing from various behavior modifying drugs. too frequent these poor souls would use their "smoldering dump" as a means o' expression. ink for their tortured pen as it were. curious. HA! Good Fun! ps you forgot to say anything relevant 'bout the topic. how... rude. did you like swtor writing as much as hurl? or perhaps you would prefer to play with your smoldering...

haven't we done this before? we got our dream car: 1987 buick grand national. if darth vader owned a car, it would be a buick grand national. heck, if vader Were a car, it would be the 1987 buick grand national gnx. HA! Good Fun!

with that insightful and original post, hurl has made us rethink our posting style and our recent life choices. ... you got any idea how many times we has seen almost the exact same post from a cognitively challenged poster at codex... or in this place? but hey, your stab at it were so much more witty. really. *snort* regardless, is helpful when you post that you likes kutcher films and thinks inquisitor is superior to kotor 1 and 2. tastes is a personal thing. apparently, so is lack of taste. but don't feel bad, there is plenty o' folks who genuinely liked epic bad films such as battlefield earth and gigli, so you is hardly alone in having odd preferences in entertainment. HA! Good Fun! Being rude on the internet isn't really insightful or original either. It is sad that you won't change. I'm not refering to your posting style, that is simply eccentric, but the attitude behind it does not portray a pleasant person. and yet, your attempted criticism in your previous post were indeed directed at our posting style, no? thus your faux stab at maturity is a bit suspect... as is your taste. regardless, we will concede that we makes little attempt to be polite. am particularly blunt with folks who is similarly rude and/or with candy-arsed milksops who would likes to discuss internet etiquette rather than thread topics. so, in the future could you endeavour to at least throw in some thread-centric content into your mewling lest we sees moderator censorship. is quite rude to be so thoughtless. our first toon (mmo nomenclature is so odd) were an inquisitor. we were mildly entertained, but the shortfalls in character development were increasingly difficult to ignore. 1st half o' story forces us to be errand boy for somebody who is obviously out to do us ill... second half is difficult to remember as we were chasing an adversary who were equally forgettable. the companion stories hurl imagined were post-50 fare, were similarly uninspired... although we will concede that we never finished the final companion story as we were not enough of a glutton for punishment to endure running dailies or flashpoints to be getting his affection high enough. we played ls, so perhaps our experience were different than hurls. regardless, we find it difficult to favorably compare swtor inquisitor to a majority o' the material in kotor or kotor 2... with the notable exceptions of juhanni and visas mar. HA! Good Fun!

with that insightful and original post, hurl has made us rethink our posting style and our recent life choices. ... you got any idea how many times we has seen almost the exact same post from a cognitively challenged poster at codex... or in this place? but hey, your stab at it were so much more witty. really. *snort* regardless, is helpful when you post that you likes kutcher films and thinks inquisitor is superior to kotor 1 and 2. tastes is a personal thing. apparently, so is lack of taste. but don't feel bad, there is plenty o' folks who genuinely liked epic bad films such as battlefield earth and gigli, so you is hardly alone in having odd preferences in entertainment. HA! Good Fun!

... well, considering you thought the inquisitor story were better than kotor 1 or 2 material, we is not surprised you is "entertained." similarly, if you told us that you is entertained while watching ashton kutcher (sp?) movies, we would not be shocked. HA! Good Fun! ps a friend of ours asked us to help her level a character a bit, so we has been playing again. the game has not gotten significantly better with the additions of 1.2 and 1.3.

If you really don't see the difference between cliche and storytelling then you really need to watch something better. Good storytelling happens despite the archetype not because of it, cliches rely on the appeal of the archetype while having no real story. Hope that makes it clearer to you. ... talk 'bout a wtf moment. do you even bother to read what you write? how on earth does you get that we equate use o' cliche and storytelling? we made an initial comment 'bout the dearth o' quality storytelling in japanese anime... recognized a handful o' pervasive shortcomings only one o' which were the over-dependence on a limited number o' archetypes. YOU is the guy who comes up with the strawman/ non sequitur and tells us that japanese cliches is no worse than western. am suspecting you is being willful obtuse, but this ridiculous line o' argument seems too damn random to be intentional. well, i t looks like you gots calax to follow your lead, so we guess your detour 'round rationality and common sense weren't a total loss. *shrug* HA! Good Fun!

*smacks forehead* please review the thread.... and somebody Please explain strawman to oro. is making rational discussion increasing difficult. you are the guy that for some inexplicable reason suggested that our (western?) cliches is no better than Japanese cliches. nobody in this thread had made a claim to the contrary before you challenged the notion o' western cliche dominance. if you review you will see that from the very start we were observing shortcomings in Japanese storytelling in anime, so to suggest that we is doing red herring is... bizarre. as for the name-calling (which is again a rather poor attempt to gets thread off the rails,) the only group we actual used any arguable name-calling to reference, were coffee shop goth. you did a much better job by directing your comments at us personal. so congrats to you for standing up for the gothies? no doubt they were terribly offended by being called "clowns" and were needing you to save them... or somesuch. however, please note that nietzsche frequently insulted his detractors and contemporaries in his writings, and as you is taking a moral and cultural relativist stance (HA!) we find your most recent hypocrisy utterly baffling... winky emote aside. maybe this is one o' those language gap problems? is english your second-language? is indeed ironic that Gromnir is the one to broach the idea, but we does see that non-english speakers will frequently use words and phrases in odd ways. name-calling, red herring, strawman, etc... perhaps is just a simple matter o' lacking familiarity with language.if you is getting yourself confused by the intricacies and subtleties o' language, we will endeavor to be more patient with your seeming ignorance. ... at this point am suspecting we is now gonna needs explain "irony" and "ignorance." HA! Good Fun!

The market practice it's geared towards middle school girls, yet the means remains the same as it does with adults. Its the old adage "Sex sells", so it would be really no surprise if someone older picked up on that and responded to it. But I just used him as an example of how the media capitalizes on sex appeal even when its not completely appropriate. No, i'm defending cultural relativity by pointing out the same oddities on our own. Starting with the Greeks seems to make the most sense since its the greatest example that our own depravities are not the result of cultural exchange with Japan but rather original. Its just a difference of perspective between cultures, not really an issue of right or wrong. HA! somebody Please explain to oro that the slippery slope he is on is quite steep. the fact that the greeks did something somehow legitimizes? how 'bout the aztecs? or, gawd forbid, the french? hey, we can also looks at pervasive shortcomings in Nipponese storytelling (lack o' meaningful character development and cohesive plot) as simply the result o' cultural differences, no? all o' which is kinda beside point as it is your strawman we is beating senseless. wacky stuff. as an aside, we really hates the wiki-generation. it were bad enough when a handful o' goth types would hang 'round college coffee shops and misquote Nietzsche. 'least those clowns had genuine read some o' the source material. HA! Good Fun!

you have got to be kidding. justin bieber is popular with middle school girls. you can't see a difference? ... you is actual attempting to defend sexualized lolli? use Greeks to defend? *shudder* however, we will continue to respond to your twisted little rationalizations in the hopes you will respond with even more bizarre material. HA! Good Fun!

You have taken an entire series of stories,traditions and archetypes and reduced them to lolis. That's a strawman. no we didn't. in fact, we specifically said we weren't condemning all japanese archetypes. bad reading skills. and we would like to remind you that we initially did not distinguish japanese archetypes-- you did. was YOUR strawman. so try not to be more o' a hypocrite. "No, it doesn't make uncomfortable" *chuckle* that is all you need say. *shudder* but maybe after you learn strawman, you can figure out why the moral/cultural relativism bit is such a slippery slope. oh, and just as soon as kiddie beauty pageant contestants become mainstream archetypes in sitcoms, dramas and western animation, you will perhaps be making a point relevant to the immediate issue. HA! Good Fun!

Not sure what "void" you're talking about. IWD and Diablo 2 were released on the same day. That said, I generally agree with your overall assessment of Diablo-esque ARPGs. Although I didn't actually play one until Torchlight. I got my $5 (hooray for Steam sales) worth of entertainment out of it, but I did feel little ashamed about the time it ate up. funny how memory works. we knows that iwd were targeted to get released Before diablo 2... that were one o' the reasons it were being rushed. we knew it failed to gets released before, but we thoughts it were hitting shelves a bit after diablo 2. odd. aside: am not actually playing anything at the moment. me3 interested us less and less as it got closer to release, so we will wait for the inevitable end-of-year bargain offering before we delve into the conclusion o' the trilogy. no diablo 3 for us. da3 is on hold til after the mayan end o' the world target date. ... at no point since 1997 has we had so little interest in computer games. HA! Good Fun!

I try being concise rather than do a series of long posts that are irrelevant and cloud the point. No offense meant to anyone, just a preference of mine. Ok . With the difference being that Japan has overexploited all of theirs. Look it's okay if you're biased because it makes you uncomfortable, just admit to it, say your opinion and have the courtesy of respecting someone else's. clearly you dont know what strawman is... but that is okie dokie. and you is damn right that it makes us uncomfortable. duh. it should makes You uncomfortable. THAT IS THE POINT. the fact that such a common and "overexploited" (is that a word?) Japanese archetype doesn't make you, and the Japanese viewing public, uncomfortable were exactly what we were referencing. regardless, am not sure what kinda subtext you could be looking for to explain "pantsu" (again, am not sure if we is getting phrases correct as the vocabulary is foreign to us) and bizarre bathing suit shots o' preteens. is just... bizarre. uncomfortable? HA! yes! hell yes! orogun, let us introduce you to the point... sheesh. HA! Good Fun!

played diablo. finished diablo. ... was midly embarrassed that we actual played diablo to its conclusion. our completionist tendency, bordering almost on an ocd compulsion, had us mindlessly playing the original diablo for many hours... but not too many. diablo gameplay felt a bit like playing single-player pong on easy difficulty setting. the only saving grace for us were that unlike pong, diablo had a conclusion. game over. hallelujah. is not that diablo were a bad game. for what it was, it were a fine game. blizzard discovered the correct formula or alchemy for an action-rpg. peoples coulds see their character getting more powhaz and better 10075 in just the correct amounts and frequency to stays motivated to play for the next hour... or 10. good game-- we could recognize why diablo were so successful even if it left us personally unfulfilled. anywho, some time passes and diablo 2 rolls around... and iwd is a bit behind schedule. seems monumentally stoopid in retrospect, but we did indeed buy diablo 2 to fill the void. am doubting we played diablo 2 for more than 2 hours. with the second incarnation we could see (again) why the diablo franchise were popular, but for us it were 'bout as "fun" as pulling weeds. diablo 3? yeah, right. HA! Good Fun!

or do you think that even a company that big and prestigious is tied down in that sense? am doubting size and prestige are serious factors. am betting that the giants o' publishing is actual far more likely to engage in the flop/hit calculus than does smaller publishers. you is more likely to Need a hit if you only got one game to be released in the span o' a few years, no? on the other hand, if you is a big publisher releasing loads o' titles per quarter, perhaps you are a bit more invested in those quarterly reports, eh? releasing a modest success or two before the end o' the next quarter to offset some unfortunate losses is the kinda thing that the really big publishers is needing to consider. HA! Good Fun!

Right, our cliches are so much more better than theirs. thank you for creating the Perfect straw-man example. will be a learning opportunity for the kiddies. *add eye-roll icon here* that being said, since you bring up the issue of superiority/inferiority o' cliches, we will submit that the lolli (sp?) as a character archetype designed to elicit a sexual response is making our blood run cold. such a disturbing and pervasive archetype is hardly constituting a condemnation o' all japanese archetypes.... but it is seriously messed up, no? HA! Good Fun!

given the recent popularity o' comic superheros in other media, am genuine surprised that some developer hasn't taken a stab at a crpg. (or maybe they has, and we simply didn't notice) freedom force were a campy take on the genre, but it showed that such a crpg could be commercial viable and... good fun. marvel and dc is providing multiple possible settings, but there is sooooo many different superhero comic titles that would make excellent fodder for a crpg game. perhaps gladstone's school for world conquerors. HA! Good Fun! ps anime (japanese anime) almost universal sux. seriously. there is a handful o' cliche anime character archetypes that anime writers drop into increasingly wacky settings with largely nonsensical plots. "creativity" in anime is rare 'bout character. instead, anime writers focus all their efforts on concept.

... am just not sure how to respond. HA! Good Fun!

wanna go serious old skool bio (interplay) board nonsense? how 'bout the furor over the hidden holy sword in the firewine bridge ruins? bio let that bit of wacky live for a significant 'mount of time. am not certain how many folks rolled paladins just to take advantage o' that "find." HA! Good Fun!

having played an inquisitor (sorcerer-healer) to 50, a bounty hunter (merc-dps) to 25, and a knight (guardian-tank) to 45, am having had a much different impression. the story aspects of each class involve only an extreme small % of total gameplay time and isamazing how much the biowarians recycled to does s'posed unique story. am not gonna address "style" or "atmosphere." is just too vague. regardless, is not genuine relevant to our query as we were wondering 'bout post 50. playing all the different classes is one way some folks might be able to keeps their interest in the game, but am wondering about the post 50 draw of swtor. any ideas? am honestly curious. we seen some folks playing same characters after they hit 50 for hours each and every day, and we not get it. hurl told us that we didnt understand mmo gameplay-- game doesnt end at 50, says hurl. ok, but for the life of us, we dont see the draw post 50. HA! Good Fun!

no doubt Gromnir is in a minority, but we just don't "get" the post-50 gameplay. yeah, the first time you successful do ev, or the other operation, it is kinda fun... get 8-16 people working together is new and unlike the flashpoints or heroics one has done earlier in the game. sadly the operations and hm flashpoints is frequently beatable not through coordinated strategy, but 'cause o' tricks. boss X is unkillable once he hits 15% health... needs to be bounced off a ledge with a coordinated double knockback. uh... ok. healer gets pulled and insta-killed... unless he stands outside building near a crack in the wall of the structure. stoopid. even so, the first couple times you run hm flaspoints and operations, they can be entertaining, but what do you do afterwards? grind dailies for credits? huttball? we cancelled our subscription 'cause we didn't see no point after we finished a level 50 character, and got pretty far with a second. second character was far too similar to the first to make it worth continuing. so, what were we missing? HA! Good Fun!

I'm not sure that Obsidian uses data as Bioware does, at least the examples given in that interview seem to point towards Obsidian thinking more in terms of 'big perks' they can give their fanbase in DLC and expansions. seems like semantics. any added feature or gameplay improvement could be characterized as a "big perk," no? regardless, we thinks chrisA is kinda an amusing choice as a poster child for developers who embrace fan-feedback. equally ridiculous would be if Gromnir wrote an essay on the merits o' polite forum behavior, or vol lauded the importance o' reasoned arguments and good spelling. weird and wrong. HA! Good Fun!

... am wondering if the aforementioned chrisA comments was meant as humor, 'cause we has seen more than a few chrisA comments that is revealing just how outta touch he is with fans. am recollecting some youtube video o' a gdc event with chrisA doing all the speaking. were just plain weird to listen to some o' his reflections regarding kotor2 and ps:t. for instance, apparantly nobody complained 'bout the absence o' elves and dwarves in ps:t. *snort* am not doubting that chrisA genuine believes that feedback is important, but one suspects that much as bioware misreading o' datamining has resulted in peculiar conclusions, we believe that the obsidnaties is likewise willful obtuse or similarly incapable o' reading data correct. explains stuff like the final fo:nv dlcs and the more bizarre chrisA comments we has seen... from time-to-time. HA! Good Fun!