Gromnir

Nope. But if its taken seriously as a game that needs to exist as a game in its own right, not just a marketing tool for the show, then it's a start. you could say the same o' any game based on any franchise. again, no insight... save to recognize that we do not have similar debates when discussing d&d games or star wars games, or tom clancy games. the danger o' being a money-grab tie-in (or whatever) is different in this case than in the aforementioned. ask self "why?" HA! Good Fun!

obsidian has some o' the codexian need to inject why-bioware-sux into every thread that exceeds some vague critical mass. oddly enough, at bioware every thread that continues for at least 20 pages eventually gets a ghey romance mention. am gonna leave it up to you to decide which fanbase is more wacky. HA! Good Fun!

I used to share your cynicism, but then I played Arkham Asylum, or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love a Tie-In Game. You're right that tie-ins are usually lousy cash-ins, because they typically try to get by on IP alone. Good tie-ins are successful because they have a great alignment between theme and gamplay - in Arkham, Rocksteady nailed the gameplay of CQC and stealth. The greatest accomplishment of Arkham Asylum is that your character will perch deftly on a gargoyle wearing tights and big ceramic bat ears and you don't feel like some fiddly furry creep - you feel cool, and you feel lethal. Based on the Game Informer article, the new RPG seems to be RT hack and slash running on Onyx, which (like DS3) runs a very real danger of becoming generic gameplay with a tacked-on theme. I could see this as worrying. But this IP is kind of built to make use of traditional RPG tropes and perhaps surmount them. You mentioned earlier that Obsidian may as well make a Jersey Shore or Big Bass game, but the difference between those IP's and South Park is that South Park has its own developed universe and metaphysic - it even has 'lore,' or whatever term nerds use to designate the fake history of a fake setting. It also has elements important to storytelling - an often editorial worldview and real honest-to-goodness themes. Among those themes is the role of imagination - more specifically, how imagination is often willfully self deluding, self aggrandizing, and ego inflating. And I'm sorry, but how is this not characteristic of nearly every RPG you've ever played? There's a reason why Avellone refers often to ego-stroking and power fantasies as recurring design goals. RPGs are often about elevating the scale and stakes of the game, chiefly to accommodate the expansion of the player's ego as s/he trivializes former challenges. The twist in South Park - and this is potentially rich for both story and gameplay - is the opposition between the "power" of a person's imagination and the powerlessness he or she feels in reality - there are inevitably moments where characters in the show come down from their fantasies to face the indisputable bummer of real life. Consider for instance the episode where the boys are playing ninja: they're drawn as these massive muscle-bound anime characters in their fantasy - until a goddamn throwing star ends up in Butters' eye. They're once again themselves, small and vulnerable and in trouble. I honestly believe there's more freedom and potential in this franchise than in, say, Star Wars, D&D, or Warhammer, which are so hemmed in by 'canon,' prior world-building, and fanbase expectations that their settings are downright claustrophobic. But then I was one of the people who looked forward to Alpha Protocol, so maybe I'm just biased against swords, lasers, and laserswords. Hi, JM! If Obs can step beyond making a game that is little more than a promotional tie in or an income stream for a tv series, as most of these tie-in games are then that would be great. WHat I see as worrying is Deadliest Catch: The Game. But if the sights are set much higher, then I'm all for it. so, if its good and innovative, you will like it? not particularly insightful, but is hard to argue against you. *shrug* until we get a better idea o' the actual gameplay, we is gonna continue to be dismissive o' this seeming April Fools Joke that somebody took too far. HA! Good Fun!

as we noted in another thread, we could easily see south park as an adventure game, but not as an rpg. move forward to uncover the next one-liner or sight-gag? sure, we get that you can builds a (short) game 'round such stuff, but we is talking 'bout a crpg, no? is south park, so is probably not gonna be a combat game. if it IS a combat game, then we is not seeing the point. use the south park world to create a combat crpg? ... sorry, but this whole project makes no sense to us save as a way for obsidian to make some money at the inevitable cost of reputation. oh, and is not that Gromnir is a south park 'hater,' so disabuse selves o' that notion. we likes a good majority o' the south park material. after all, mr. garrison's "merry f&*#ing christmas" is one o' our favorite holiday songs. HA! Good Fun!

well heck, the south park movie did (shockingly?) pretty good, but this ain't a movie. maybe the movie ain't the best barometer? anybody got another example o' south park media that has done good? we know creator's o' south park has been involved in some serious bombs when they has tried to stretch beyond their tv series appeal. baseketball? team america: world police? is not as if having the creators help is actual... help. dunno. makes sense if somebody offered obsidian a barrel full o' money. after alpha protocol and ds3, am wondering if obsidian actual cares 'bout their reputation? money grab makes sense. HA! Good Fun!

is not april 1, is it? no? ... if this were a free flash game, we would look forward to playing it-- 15 minutes o' irreverent entertainment. a full length crpg? we could see developing a south park adventure game perhaps, but a crpg? did fergie lose a bet with the devil? *shrug* HA! Good Fun!

have not played an mmo in over a decade, so am a complete n00b with such stuff. we noticed at the swtor board there were mentions o' class skills... but such skills didn't seems to work as kotor, nwn, d&d or other crpg skills we is familiar with. can somebody explain or link us to an explanation? also, we read some blogs from folks who has played and a recurring complaint we saw were regarding customization-- the lack o' it. appears that physical customization of avatar is limited, and that abilities/powhaz customization is also pretty limited. meet one 23rd level sith sorcerer and you has met virtual all 23rd level sith sorcerers. advanced classes bifurcate the core classes, but is that enough to keeps interesting? anybody that has played got an opinion on swtor customization? we got some time-off in the near future, and we has been gifted with a copy o' swtor, so we will probable fiddle with the game a bit, but am looking for feedback... feedback w/o having to deal with the bio/ea/lucasarts boards. HA! Good Fun! ps we sure as hell ain't gonna take oner advice to play for an entire month before judging.

am agreeing and disagreeing. agree on protecting natural folks Liberty rights more than legal persons, at least in principal but in Gromnir example and your example, we is not talking liberty rights, is we? protect property is different, and suggesting that one person, real or otherwise, gets deserves less protection o' his property right simply 'cause he has more property is, well, un-American. we will observe that one aspect o' our hypo is not analogous to ucd: the students at uc davis were not simple trespassers. is an admitted significant difference that we did not mention. nevertheless, am thinking that a great disservice has been done by mischaracterizing the reason why the protesters were being removed in the first place. even during the late 80's and early 90's, back when Gromnir were at Cal/Boalt, protests on campus were pretty darn common. at Cal we witnessed protests o' fee hikes, affirmative action policies, tree removal, and even public nudity on campus. some o' those protesters were quite lively. no biggie. the occupation protests is different. is not the protesting that is provoking a response from governments and universities, but rather the nuisance that accompanies the occupation. obviously Gromnir is fascinated by the whole situation. public forum doctrine were kinda the area o' first amendment law in which we gots our feet wet. kokinda and iskcon v. lee marked a serious philosophical change for the Court re public forum-- am curious to see if the present Court holds the line. HA! Good Fun!

... hyperbole, right? that better be hyperbole. *shrug* as we stated earlier, we think that based on the video and released reports, the actions o' the university cop in question were over-the-top. we don't have enough info to be confident in our pov, but that is our impression. that being said, we thinks some folks in this thread is being ridiculous. hypothetical based on initial true facts: a bunch o' folks in Gromnir's neighborhood discover that we is representing some high-profile gang members in a first amendment case. the concerned parents gets organized and actually hold a protest on the street in front o' our home. high point o' our career. shoulda' taken more pictures. (end of reality) ok, now imagine that the protesters decide to camp out on our front lawn. hmmmm. is not as funny no more... trampling our lawn and breaking sprinkler heads? *grumble* nevertheless, we figure that the protesters is gonna eventual leave when they get tired. unexpected turn of events: the protesters set up Camp in our yard. they pitch tents, and have campfires and use our water. huh? even so, Gromnir endures for some time... days... weeks. unfortunately, the protester/squatters is hardly organized. bad things begin to happen with more regularity. some fights occasional break out in our yard as drunk protesters fight over nothing. we find used condoms and garbage in our rose bushes and agapanthus. oh, and btw, the protesters is NOT walking all the way to the nearest public restroom whenever they needs to relieve themselves. the protesters is a nuisance, and they is creating a growing health and safety concern. and guess what, since the occupiers is being open and notorious in their squatting, Gromnir may eventual be subject to multiple civil suits. (the above examples is the ennumerated reasons for ejecting the ucd protesters... though no mention o' roses and agapanthus.) what to do? we call the cops and ask for help. we says, "please remove the protesters from our property." unfortunately, when the cops arrive, the protesters refuse to leave. the protesters sit outside our door and dare the cops to move'em. what to do? should cops throw up hands and leave? is not a good choice from Gromnir's pov. ... would we want the cops to spray a dozen seated protesters to encourage them to leave? would we want to be demonized on tv for demanding the expulsion o' the filth on our lawn? no. wait til 2:00 am when fewer folks is 'round and then dismantle the makeshift camp. if the few protesters who is in our yard at that time still refuse to move, then single out the mostest mouthy bastard and spray him. one example gets as much mileage as twelve. spray is less likely to result in injury to the cop or the protester, so we got no problem with using spray, but use reasonable and rational. nep's weapon distinction is not particular compelling. cops is more likely to injure protesters by physically moving 'em and cuffing 'em. cops is more likely to get injured if they put hands on protesters. so, what is the difference 'tween ucd and Gromnir's hypothetical? the fact that ucd is a big organization and that Gromnir is a private citizen makes no difference, Nor Should It. Gromnir deserves no more protection than UCD just 'cause we is small-time. how 'bout public v. private property? nope. is loads o' cases that show that "public property" is not some kinda open area for protest. can't set up a table outside a post office on a sidewalk, so why should you gets to set up a camp on campus. that being said, parks and streets does gets gets special first amendment consideration for protesting. at ucd the locale were a quad at a public university, so maybe you got "public forum"... but even a public forum does not necessarily give protesters free reign to camp out indefinitely... 'specially when the protesters is creating genuine health and safety problems. we has seen a number o' people serious injured when being restrained and cuffed. as we noted in another thread, we were admonished when we worked corrections 'cause we preferred to lay-on-hands as 'posed to using spray. the reason the supervisors criticized us is 'cause they believed that we was creating an unnecessary danger to self, residents and other staff. spray were believed to be a much safer alternative... safer for everybody involved. we not got specific numbers to back up other than those provided in our links above (am wondering if anybody actual read the doj report), but spray is widely accepted as safer. spray IS safer, but our problem with spray is probable resulting from the fact that it is so much safer. some folks is too comfortable using spray. spray is NOT particularly dangerous compared to any kind o' grappling and is far less likely to result in officer discipline, so some officers is less restrained when using spray. fear is not always a bad thing. fear keeps people from doing stoopid stuff... or it should. HA! Good Fun!

first given the misinformation in the article, we would be very suspicious o' the coughing up blood claim. how the heck does that even happen unless the guy already has a bleeding ulcer or some such? having worked corrections, we is sad to admit that we has seen literally dozens (if not hundreds) of people pepper sprayed, and we never saw no coughing of blood. sounds like bs *shrug* we already admitted that this one guy appeared to be going over-the-top with the spray, but recall your original comment, "Wow. I didn't know pepper spray was that common in America. Kind of tragic. Your cops are pretty ****ed up." you is taking way too much for granted from one clear inaccurate article. anecdote from corrections... just for fun. 'bout 30 minutes before the end o' our night shift we is doing a room check. while residents is locked down you gotta peek in each room every 10 minutes, plus one random, per hour. is our last room check o' the night before going home and getting some sleep. do some paperwork, fill-in next shift, then drive home and sleep the sleep o' the dead. anywho, we peeks in one room and see *aison standing over his sink, rubbing something on his face. what the *uck? "hey *aison, what the *uck are you doing?" *aison slowly, creepy slow, turns his head and just kinda smiles at us. now just so you understand, *aison is a very large fellow, at least 300 lbs, and he stinks. Gromnir is no push-over, but particularly with so little time left o' our shift, we do not wanna have to deal with *aison. we had been forced to "dip" *aison in the past when he attacked some peckerwood in the showers. was not our favorite memory. wrestling an angry (and possibly insane) fat, wet, naked, black behemoth in a shower... protecting some 105 lb skinhead from getting killed? not again. even worse, Gromnir would needs to author an incident report if *aison caused a ruckus before we left the unit, and that would take us at least an additional 30 minutes. *groan* "look, I am serious. what the *uck are you doing?" *aison lifts his right hand and shows us the pulpy remains o' a crushed orange gripped in his meaty fist. with a deep, raspy voice, *aison says, "Rub it in your eyes... makes the spray hurt less." our jaw probable drops... not sure. whatever. "I don't care what you have planned, but you are going to stow that $hit for at least thirty minutes. You got that?" *aison smiles again and then finally gives us a brief nod before going back to his bunk. Gromnir returns to the bubble and informs our co-staff 'bout *aison. we then go home and sleep unconcerned. three days pass and then Gromnir is back at work. sure enough *aison went ape and attacked multiple residents and staff at breakfast not long after we had left him sitting in his room rubbing orange remains into his eyes. we gave him extra pop-tarts that eve. HA! Good Fun!

as stated below, we ain't a proponent o' pepper spray, but krez should be a bit more discerning when looking for factual evidence via the web. in fact, the doj report cited in the article linked actual breaks down the ~70 (actual number = 73) reported cases o' pepper spray-related deaths as follows: 10 cases excluded as no pepper spray was actually used. in all remaining cases, save 5, pepper spray were complete excluded as a possible cause o' death. "For pepper spray to cause death, it would have to make breathing difficult by closing or narrowing the bronchial tubes. The subject would have to struggle to both inhale and exhale. These effects would be noticeable shortly after the application of pepper spray. Yet, except for the two cases in which the subjects were classified as asthmatics, comments regarding breathing (other than

again, who are you talking to? you really hate scarecrows, no? you must, 'cause the way you beat on those strawmen is kinda spooky. as for "selling out to foreigners" as an excuse... HA! free speech is meaningless if you censor ideas and words due to popularity. again, look at the Chinese reasoning for censoring... sounds much like wal excuses. keep a harmonious society? bah. all minority opinions is unpopular... is the reason why they is MINORITY opinions. and the fact that you used perceived government legitimacy as a justifiable reason to limit Individual Liberties is a wonderfully illustrative example o' the hypocrisy we noted earlier. individual liberty rights exist to protect people from the government, not the other way around. sheesh. HA! Good Fun!

There's a slight difference between acts committed by people in white hoods and those with stars on their uniforms walk into any mall or bank in the US and you will see folks with stars on uniforms. doesn't mean as much as you suggest. in alabama and mississippi, the guys with white hoods often also have stars on their uniforms. *shrug* and no, there really isn't much of a distinction, unless you can somehow show that the action of the University cop in question was actually the result of some sort of state-sponsored policy or directive. one college campus cop with pepper-spray does not a policy make. having worked in a correctional facility at the time when pepper-spray was first becoming popular, am gonna say that we was disturbed by how quickly security personnel grabbed for the spray. we were originally trained in MAB (managing aggressive behavior) and Pain Compliance. both mab and pain compliance inevitably result in having to lay hands on a "resident." as soon as you put hands on a resident, bad and unexpected things can happen. an arm-bar with a circle down to a prone position Should be simple, but it frequent is not. too much pressure, or dealing with a particular resistant resident, and you gots to explain a sprained wrist, broken arm or snapped collar bone. pepper spray, on the other hand, typical results in little serious damage. yeah, it looks nasty, but is usually less dangerous than MAB or PC techniques. still, am gonna concede that we thinks that the availability o' pepper spray were a negative in the long run. some folks who woulda' talked their way outta a conflict before the advent o' spray now simply reach for their canister as soon as somebody fails the "attitude test." ... we were actual warned to quit using major outer-reap throws. we never actual serious injured anybody, but we were questioned why we did not use pepper spray in such situations. residents would get aggressive or wanna fight, and Gromnir would end problem asap. we hated spray, particularly in confined areas. even so, we were very resistant to ever lay hands on a person. spray availability removes the natural reluctance o' sane people to avoid altercations. HA! Good Fun!

am assuming the aforementioned is just random, non-sequitur gibberish, 'cause nobody we seen has suggested that "all thoughts are innocuous." ideas can be terrible and powerful, but no legit government is afraid o' the free exchange o' ideas. there is many options for dealing with dark thoughts 'mongst the populace, but censorship of thoughts is antithetical to the liberty notions embraced in most free societies. HA! Good Fun! snip is a funny picture... just not relevant. the uc davis cops were enforcing University policies and not some kinda state-sanctioned violence. supposedly the cops were surrounded and felt threatened, but we don't see it in the videos. regardless, is just a funny photoshop bit. go ahead and show us a picture o' a cross-burning in alabama or missisipi. is hardly some kinda proof that the US supports or embraces kkk activities. HA! Good Fun! ps removed the pic from the quote to reduce clutter

am assuming the aforementioned is just random, non-sequitur gibberish, 'cause nobody we seen has suggested that "all thoughts are innocuous." ideas can be terrible and powerful, but no legit government is afraid o' the free exchange o' ideas. there is many options for dealing with dark thoughts 'mongst the populace, but censorship of thoughts is antithetical to the liberty notions embraced in most free societies. HA! Good Fun!

legitimate governments have nothing to fear from the free exchange of ideas, regardless o' whether or not those ideas could possibly disrupt a "harmonious" society. 'course, before all the europeans nod agreement, keeps in mind that virtual all western nations (save for one or two notable exceptions) has laws that criminalize speech that has a tendency to offend identifiable religious, ethnic, or cultural groups. the argument for limiting rude speech is 'cause o' the tendency to disrupt harmonious society, no? yeah, the degree to which pakistan and china tends to censor is greater than in the average eu state, but am thinking that a looksee in the mirror might be necessary to be avoiding some blatant hypocrisy. HA! Good Fun!

the world you live in must be a strange and frightening place. HA! Good Fun!

about morgoth being a nutter? is possible. hasn't he written near 50 books, and lord knows how many short stories? eventually he is gonna have no choice but to write 'bout morgoth. HA! Good Fun!

cheap food? is many inexpensive options that is tasting good, BUT you gotta be careful if you is also wanting to stay healthy. cheapest chicken parts is legs and thighs... avoid boneless and skinless options and you can gets drumsticks and thighs for extreme cheap. pollo asado is a good option although it does require some citrus to makes complete. chop up a tomato, a bunch o' cilantro, onion and serve in tortillas. if you wann splurge, add a smidge o' cheese. most roasting and soup/boil options for chicken will be cheap. 'course legs and thighs is dark meat and less healthy than breast meat. pork shoulder and butt roasts can be providing enough meat to feed a small army. apples is cheap at the moment as it is fall, so you can easy find braising recipes that include apples and pork resulting in a very cheap and delicious meal... but pork is fatty. red meats is typical more expensive than chicken and pork, but the tougher cuts can be relative inexpensive. is not hard to find chuck roast on sale for costs equal to boneless chicken breast meat. is few things as tasty as a well-crafted pot roast... use cross-rib/shoulder cut and you can either braise (pot roast) or dry roast for roast beef that is Christmas Diner worthy. 'course, the tougher cuts o' red meat is hardly lean. meatloaf is only cheap if you is using loads o' stuff that ain't actual meat. two keys for meatloaf: 1) grate your onion as it will makes the loaf more moist, 2) cook on a broiling pan to allow grease to drip away-- hand-form the loaf. genuine cheap and healthy? go with lentil recipes. lentils gots almost all the proteins a person needs to stay healthy-- effective meat substitute. can makes lentil chili, soups and monk/monastery lentils. http://www.food.com/recipe/monastery-lentils-41384. use classic french proportions o' onion, celery and carrot 2:1:1 as well as 2qts homemade chicken stock (cheap) and a lb of green lentils for the start o' a very good soup... salt, pepper, and cumin to taste. unlike other "beans" lentils does not require an over-night soaking. green and yellow peas works great for soups and dal. cheap, but some folks hate peas. black beans, red beans and kidney beans is also a good cornerstone ingredient. a lb o' dry beans is cheap and may be used in any number o' filling and tasty dishes. red beans and rice typical includes sausage or some other kinda meat, but the meat is not necessary. rice is dangerous if you is avoiding carbs in your diet, but is cheap. combine wild and brown rice for a healthy alternative to white rice... but wild rice is not as cheap (or as tasty) as white rice options. you can end up looking like a sumo wrestler by eating nothing but fish, green leafy veggies, and white rice, so beware. is easy to eat cheap and tasty, but eat cheap, tasty, and healthy is a bit more difficult. HA! Good Fun! ps since austerity were mentioned, we will also note that in the unrelated "deserted island" scenario, we would wanna have a big bag o' lentils and booze. neither is gonna be immediate perishable, and booze is high carbs and lentils is high protein. can live for a good long time on nothing but booze and lentils.

"pathetic"? am thinking the correct word is "surreal." you give us feedback regarding the site maintenance o' the game you got a needs to announce indifference regarding? Bwahhhhaaaahhhaaahhh! keep posting. please. HA! Good Fun!

coming from the guy who feels need to post at obsidian his indifference 'bout a beta invite to a bioware game he volunteered to be testing? first pretends as if sign-up were accidental before doing some silly and unnecessary backpedaling? rrrrriiiiiiigggghhhhhtttttt. am perhaps slandering vol by placing you in a similar category. HA! Good Fun! ps have fun in your beta weekend. anybody wanna take bets as to whether or not morg joins the beta... whether he admits or not?

more strawman. blow outta proportion by noting silliness and linking bugs bunny? *chuckle* and now you can recall checking box And your feelings at the time? you have convenient powers o' recollection. whatever. maroon. HA! Good Fun!

beat that strawman a bit harder. where did anybody claim you were a fanboy? and is no "oops." those things is pretty clear marked. you volunteered. you registered at forums AND volunteered for testing. now you gonna come to obsidian and announce indifference? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_Kh7nLplWo HA! Good Fun!

to be selected you must needs have volunteered/applied. after having volunteered AND been selected, you then comes to an unrelated game developer's board to announce your indifference via a snarky post? ... you has clearly surpassed vol standards o' irrationality. HA! Good Fun! ps (edited) no need for us to repeat raithe.

Bioware are unable to do dark, only insane or duchy is not "can't." ... perspective can be useful. am recalling the thread on the da:o thread on the bio boards in which we pushed hard for the biowarins to explain their definition o' "dark." the thread were predictable chaos. you see, is pretty much impossible to find a definition o' "dark" that any sizable % o' people is gonna agree 'pon. even worse, the thread made it patently obvious that a very significant % o' bio-board posters didn't want anything that genuine smacked o' dark. a great many bio fans were quite clear that they were wanting traditional (which ain't genuine traditional) heroes, villains and situations in which they could affect "perfect" happily-ever-after resolutions. those demanding cotton candy and sunshine were numerous, and they were including more than a few vocal and respected community members. Gromnir were genuinely surprised at the resistance to "dark" even w/o a clear defined definition o' dark. bio response: da:o will be "dark, but not too dark." that is an actual quote. honest. hope for bio dark pretty much died that day. ask self how it is possible to write dark characters and scenario w/o those characters and scenario being too dark for the candylanders looking for happily ever afters for all. if you is genuine trying to satisfy the sunshine brigade's demands, you cannot possibly write dark... regardless o' your definition o' dark. is not that bio can't write dark, but they is making a conscious effort to keeps the happily-ever-after contingent satisfied. were quite possible the most disheartening game-board thread we ever read. HA! Good Fun!