kmbogd

While it's true that ErlKing probably misunderstood the question, his answer is still correct as it points Stardusk78 to the thread that explains the mechanics involved when computing this stuff. Based on Stardusk's original question it does not look that he/she is very familiar with the mechanics of the game: for example that the game works with speeds and not with times (even though some abilities refer to time), that the percentages are not really that clear (time bonus/malus percentage not equal to speed bonus/malus percentage that is used by the game under the hood), that the formula does not even work with percentages but with steps, that armored grace description has nothing to do with its implementation etc. @Stardusk78: If you don't have time to read the post that was linked by ErlKing here is the explanation of the mechanics of the game when computing the recovery time for your example: the game is very confusing as it mixes wording abilities either as a bonus/malus to times or as bonus/malus to speeds; in reality, under the hood, the game works with speeds to determine a speed modifier from a time modifier you reverse the number: for example +35% recovery time from armor is actually 1/1.35=0.74 recovery speed (so -26% reduction in recovery speed), the helmet that give -20% recovery time is actually 1/0.8=1.25 recovery speed (so +25% increase in recovery speed) armored grace is worded poorly, it's effect is to increase the resulting recovery speed of the armor by 0.1, so in your case the 0.74 recovery speed is changed to 0.84 recovery speed Now you transform the recovery speed modifiers into steps: the armor (with armored grace) has a sub-unitary modifier and its step is 1-1/0.84=-0.19; the helmet is a supra-unitary modifier and it has a step of 1.25-1=0.25 Now you add all your steps into a Step_SUM=-0.19+0.25=0.06 Since this is a positive number it means that you are better than the base behavior so your recovery time is BaseRecoveryTime/(1+Step_SUM): so for 4s base recovery time you get to 4/1.06=3.77s

Hi Cdiaz, Thanks for the feedback. I went ahead and swapped the weapons: Watcher's Blade main-hand and Modwyr off-hand. The result was that Modwyr did not inherit the raw lash from Watcher's Blade, however Watcher's Blade still inherited the fire lash from Modwyr. Also in any other of my tests involving weapons with lash I did not see this inheritance of the lash to the other hand's weapon (for example for Sungrazer, Watcher's Blade, St. Droga's Skull). Therefore, it looks like this is something specific to Modwyr. Btw this still happens in the current patch: v1.1.0.0035.

I Have the same issue and I posted the files (output log and dxdiag only as a crash log is not generated) in the other thread opened for this: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/102138-crash-at-quit/ Maybe a moderator could join the two threads.

I have the same problem starting from v1.1, whenever I quit to desktop I have some sort of crash. It doesn't look like the game generates a crash log since it happens after quitting. I have a Steam version of the game. Until now I did not experience any sort of crash and I've played the game for more than 100 hours. output_log.txt DxDiag.txt

Accuracy by it's own does not mean much, it only has meaning relative to a particular target's deflection (or other defense in case of spells). So, IMO any analysis that does not consider the pair Acurracy-TargetDeflection is not meaningful enough. This being said, considering as premise that we would like to analyze the case when the accuracy is identical (or very close) to the target's deflection then my calculations have shown that: the 50% lash is always better then an extra +20 Acc right around the region where we have an AR equal to penetration from then on comes a small window when the extra +20 Acc has the lead finally, for large enough enemy AR the 50% lash is again better. So, it's something like this: lash lash lash lash lash lash acc acc acc acc lash lash lash ..... As you see, in the general case it looks like the +50% lash is better. Also take into account that this happens with the current lash dmg formula which I believe is bugged: penetration bonus/malus is applied multiplicatively instead of additively like for the base attack. So right now, in the cases that matter (tougher enemies with more than petty AR) lash dmg equates to less than what we normally expect from it. If they fix the formula for lash we might even get that +50% lash will always be better than +20 Acc given our original assumption (starting accuracy is equal to target's deflection).

I think the best way to clarify is to provide an example. Let's suppose that you are using a fine sword to hit your target. Suppose that your weapon has the ability that adds a 20% fire lash. You character has 20 might. The hit resolution is a crit. However your penetration is 1 less than you target's AR. Let us assume a dmg_roll of 16. How to compute dmg of the normal attack? We get all dmg bonuses and maluses and compute their STEP: Fine quality: +15% dmg -> STEP1=0.15 20 Might: +30% dmg -> STEP2=0.3 Crit hit resolution: +25% dmg -> STEP3=0.25 Lite under-penetration: -25% dmg -> STEP4=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=-0.33 Now we compute the STEP_SUM=0.15+0.3+0.25-0.33=0.37 Since STEP_SUM is >=0 then the dmg of the normal attack is Rolled_DMG*(1+STE_SUM)=16*1.37=21.92 pierce/slash dmg How to compute the additional lash dmg? The starting base dmg is Rolled_DMG * Lash_Percentage, which in our case is 16*0.2. Now, like in the case of the normal attack we get all dmg bonuses and maluses and compute their STEP, but exclude over/under-penetration: Fine quality: +15% dmg -> STEP1=0.15 20 Might: +30% dmg -> STEP2=0.3 Crit hit resolution: +25% dmg -> STEP3=0.25 Now we compute the STEP_SUM=0.15+0.3+0.25=0.7 Penetration modifier is 1-malus which in our case is 1-0.25=0.75 Since STEP_SUM is >=0 then the dmg of the lash attack is Rolled_DMG*Lash_Percentage *(1+STEP_SUM)*Penetration_Modifier=16*0.2*(1+0.7)*0.75=4.08 fire dmg. So in the end the attack performs 21.92 pierce/slash dmg + 4.08 fire dmg.

Yes, I believe that the formula for lash dmg is bugged at the moment as it's too different from the normal dmg formula. In the normal damage formula most of us know by now that all the modifiers (bonuses or maluses) are transformed into steps and added together to get a STEP_SUM. So all modifiers are additive (btw, in the final release, might modifier is treated like all the rest, it's no longer the only multiplicative modifier as it was the case in the backer beta). How is the step computed? If we have a bonus, it's just the extra percentage. Here are some examples: Extra crit dmg (+25% dmg) -> step=0.25 Weapon specialization (+10% dmg) -> step=0.1 Fine quality weapon (+15% dmg) -> step=0.15 20 Might (+30% dmg) -> step=0.3 If we have a malus, the step formula is 1-1/(1-malus). Here are some examples: Blunted criticals dmg (-25% dmg) -> step=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=1-4/3=-0.33 Moderate under-penetration (-50% dmg) -> step=1-1/(1-0.5)=1-1/0.5=1-2=-1 Severe under-penetration (-75% dmg) -> step=1-1/(1-0.75)=1-1/0.25=1-4=-3 Once all the individual steps for the bonuses/maluses are determined, they are added up in a STEP_SUM. Now the formula for the final dmg depends on whether this STEP_SUM is above or below 0. If STEP_SUM >=0 then Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG * (1+STEP_SUM). So, for example if STEP_SUM turns out to be 0.6 then your Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG * (1+0.6)=Rolled_DMG*1.6 if STEP_SUM<0 then Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG/(1-STEP_SUM). So, for example if STEP_SUM turns out to be -0.6 then your Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG/(1-(-0.6))=Rolled_DMG/1.6 What happens to the lashes? In my tests it turns out that the starting dmg is Rolled_DMG * Lash_Percentage. We then apply the same modifiers as for the normal damage by computing the steps and determining the STEP_SUM. However, there is a twist. Penetration bonuses/maluses are not considered at this stage. So you compute the STEP_SUM of everything besides over-penetration/under-pentration. Lash Penetration_Modifier is applied multiplicatively to the whole formula. Unfortunately, in my tests (it's true that I had time only for limited tests) over-penetration does not seem to be taken into account, just under-penetration is. So if this is indeed true, this is another reason why the formula is bugged. So the Lash_Final_DMG is: If STEP_SUM (excluding over/under-penetration) >=0 then Lash_Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG * Lash_Percentage*(1+STEP_SUM) * Penetration_Modifier if STEP_SUM (excluding over/under-penetration) <0 then Lash_Final_DMG=Rolled_DMG * Lash_Percentage / (1-STEP_SUM) * Penetration_Modifier where Penetration_Modifier=1-malus (as I said in my limited tests I don't think I've seen an impact on lashes in the case of over-penetration). In my opinion it makes no sense to have under-penetration as an additive modifier in the normal dmg formula but as a multiplicative modifier in the lash dmg formula. Hence, I assume it's a bug that will be fixed in a future patch.

The description of the ability is the one that is wrong. What the ability does is that it adds a fixed 10% of the base recovery speed. So for the recovery speed of heavy armor which is 0.645 (1/1.55) of the base recovery speed, armored grace will make it 0.745. For the recovery speed of a medium armor which is 0.74 (1/1.35) of the base recovery speed, armored grace will make it 0.84. Finally, for the recovery speed of light armor which is 0.83 (1/1.2) of the base recovery speed, armored grace will make it 0.93. To be honest it's kind of weird to word this ability. The good thing is that from an implementation perspective it's not bugged even though it's not really easy to understand what it does without having a very good grasp of the various mechanics.

- Love that unique weapons and armor are truly unique (this might be the feature I'm most impressed) - Voice acting - Scripted interactions - Enhanced graphics - Enhanced information in the combat log (although there is still room for improvement)

The ability states that it gets activated on hit but quite unexpectedly I've seen it activated also on graze attack resolution. To be honest the description of the ability should be reconsidered since it gets activated also on crit attack resolution (this is less unexpected than for the graze, however if we are precise the ability just states hit).

In this second picture my character is dual wielding swords and is using Buttom's Up on target. Combat log displays 20.2 rolled dmg which is above the max base weapon dmg for swords (19).

Sometimes the rolled weapon dmg is not correct. In the picture attached Eder is dual wielding sabres and is using confounding blind on target, however the combat log displayed a 20.1 rolled dmg. Unless I'm mistaken, rolled dmg should be a random value inside a weapon's base dmg interval, which for sabres caps at 19. Not sure if this affects only abilities or auto-attacks as well.

In addition to the above, it seems that even loot is not always highlighted. In the picture attached you can see that only some of the loot is highlighted when pressing TAB.

This is fine, the point I wanted to make is that once the fight starts you can use the ability to kill only one opponent. Therefore, it cannot be abused continuously in the same encounter.

If I remember correctly the sacrifice ability can be used only once per encounter or rest. In this case, I would say that it's not too powerful if it will work with dominated/charmed targets (as long as bosses are balanced not to be charmed/dominated)

The way you formulated the question, it's not really possible to give a clear answer: in some cases human in other cases orlan. For example if your human's accuracy is lower than your target's deflection by 7 or more then you will still have 0% chance to crit even with fighting spirit (the orlan will have to get the accuracy lower by more than 50 to have a 0% chance to crit). On the other hand if your accuracy is equal to your target's deflection then fighting spirit will equate to an average of 7% crit chance, while the orlan will have an average of 5% crit chance (assuming no other hit to crit abilities, you have 10% of 50% hit resolutions). All in all I would say there are more contexts in which the orlan is better for criting, however this does not mean that there is not a considerable amount of situations in which fighting spirit is better at that. You need to restrict to problem more in order to get a definite answer, right now it's too open-ended.

+1

Not a bug. This is because the devoted sub-class has as a drawback the fact that it can only have one weapon proficiency (in addition to fists).

Yeah I've observed the same. However, in the backer beta enemy stats were not displayed from the beginning. This leads me to believe that we are dealing with a bug.

The formula is very complicated and it is actually performed in more stages, so it's impossible to display it via the shift function. In case you are curious you can read the following: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/98679-mechanics-attack-speed-recovery-time-reload-time/ What they can do though in the short term is to make sure that they are consistent in their displayed information and ability wording. Since behind the hood they are working with speeds , they should keep references only to speed adjustments and cut off all time references. If they do this they will clear at least the confusion that arises from examples like the one you provided above.

Agree, this is ambiguous. Even the big formula for adding modifiers up is very convoluted: even though you see a succession of modifiers it's not as simple as adding them up (if you have at least one malus)

This is not a bug, but it's true that it is a bit ambiguous. In-game there are places where you get information about the recovery speed and places where you get information about recovery time. The relation between these 2 concepts is that they are the reverse of each other: recovery speed=1/recovery time. The tooltip for DEX is related to recovery speed (it also affects attack speed, reload speed, cast speed but these are not relevant now), therefore you have an increase of 30% to your recovery speed. Applying the formula above you get the the time you get to achieve full recovery, recovery time, is 1/1.3=0.77. Therefore, your recovery time, as displayed by the weapon tooltip, is reduced by 1-0.77=0.23. So an increase by 30% in recovery speed equates to a decrease of 23% in recovery time.

It seems that carnage attacks also apply to the original target. In the picture below there was only one opponent left and it got hit by both the main attack and by a carnage attack. This does not correspond to the description of the ability that states that "barbarian makes reduced-damage attacks at all other enemies within a short distance from a target".

When dual wielding, in some situations I've noticed that the lash from one weapon applies to the secondary weapon as well. For example in the picture attached my character is equipped with Modwyr and with Duskfall. As can be seen a fire lash is applied also when hitting the enemy with Duskfall. I did not notice the same behavior with a dual wielding character equipped with St. Drogga's Skull and another weapon. So maybe this bug is related to only Modwyr.

I think that everyone that pre-loaded is stuck at 99%. I'm 20 min into it. Decoding/Unpacking seems to take an eternity.