Helm

The classes are not a smoke screen. Classes are about how you approach something, which toolset you use. Roles are defiines by builds. Yeah I think that's the difference. Roles are not defined by classes anymore but by builds. The only thing defining anything in this game is the abilities/spells you have, nothing else. There is no building. You choose a class and a trait and and spend completely meaningless attribute points. You can use every weapon, every armor and what not at your disposal. The game might as well just have one class that specializes in dealing damage and and another class that specializes in healing. There is no building and there is no diversity in this game, it is simply an illusion. You discriped the AD&D system to the point without even realizing it. You know the system used in the BG games. The only defining thing in AD&D games were the abilites and spells of the class. You did choose a class in AD&D and spend completly meaningless attribute points because their was only one perfect way to spend them on every class. You could use any armor, weapon in AD&D it just restricted you, like in this system. AD&D had classes specialized in dealing damage or healing etc. Their is diversity in this game you just refuse to see it. Most classes can do every role BUT they can only do that one role because the build you use makes them weak in the other roles. Uh no. What about equipment requirements? What about roles like rogues? And so on. There is none of that in PoE. There is no diversity.

Ok, I'm gonna try one more time to explain this to you with a simple analogy. Let's pretend Fallout New Vegas just released, and you're saying the game is "fundamentally flawed in design" because the Brush Gun deals 140 damage a shot and fires as fast as a 9mm pistol, and therefore you have no motivation to use any weapon but the Brush Gun which boasts the best stats in every category. While that is undeniably an issue, the amount of work that would be required to fix this imbalance (there's that word again!) is so simple that you don't even need to wait for the developers to fix it. You can open the GECK, find the Brush Gun data file, then go to the damage and firing speed stats and tone them down. Spoiler alert: the Brush Gun once fired faster than it does today, but Obsidian released a balance patch to slow it's firing speed down. It didn't take months of coding, tireless work and a complete rehaul and redesign of the game. It took them changing a 2.4 to a 1.2 in the coding. Literally five minutes of work. Nothing you have named spells absolute doom for the game. What you've named is something for Obsidian to consider and possibly open up their game and switch some little number values around. It's imbalance. Imbalance that can either be fixed easily enough thanks to the beta, or even IF it somehow made it to the game, it can still be fixed at any given time via a very small patch or even your own personal balance mod you make (which would be easy enough a 7 year old could do it). To claim the game is fundamentally flawed is absolute nonsense. If you truly believe that though, kindly walk out the door as there's truly no reason for you to be here if it's impossible for this game to be saved now, is there? You're completely hopeless. You choose a class and a trait and and spend attribute points any way you like because it doesn't make a damn difference. Spend them all or spend none, who cares, the difference is minimal. You can use every weapon, every armor and what not at your disposal because there are no stat requirements. You have different spells and abilities, but in the end all you do is either damage or healing and maybe C&C. The game might as well just have one class that specializes in dealing damage and and another class that specializes in healing. There is no building and there is no diversity in this game, it is simply an illusion. And you don't get it. Like I said, start Baldur's Gate, create a character and dump all the stats, then try to play the game. Do the same in PoE. Have fun.

The classes are not a smoke screen. Classes are about how you approach something, which toolset you use. Roles are defiines by builds. Yeah I think that's the difference. Roles are not defined by classes anymore but by builds. The only thing defining anything in this game is the abilities/spells you have, nothing else. There is no building. You choose a class and a trait and and spend completely meaningless attribute points. You can use every weapon, every armor and what not at your disposal. The game might as well just have one class that specializes in dealing damage and and another class that specializes in healing. There is no building and there is no diversity in this game, it is simply an illusion.

I take it you're the infamous muscle wizard everyone's been talking about, focusing more on his sweet abs than his mental intellect. Pleasure to finally meet you, good sir. Have you created a game in Baldur's Gate and dumped all the stats yet? Or are you goint to try after you are done insulting? This game has no build diversity unlike the IE games. It doesn't matter where you spend your points.

Care to elaborate? Sure. So why would you care about your attributes again. It seems that currently you can assign points in whatever way you want, because it will only have a minor effect on your character build. This needs to be fixed. The game is broken. You blatantly just played into my entire argument. The EXACT issue you just cited is one of stat weight. It's a simple adjustment of stat values and is by NO means a "fundamental design flaw." A fundamental design flaw would imply the basic system as a whole is completely dysfunctional. What you're pointing out is imbalance, where some stats need improvement and some stats need nerfing. Even if you're of the opinion EVERY stat needs a dramatic change, it's still simple imbalance that can be edited in a matter of minutes. Well if you say so. I hope you can fix in minutes what Sawyer couldn't figure out in the past two years. You could give the player 80 attribute points or 0 points to spend, it would change hardly anything, because the game is designed that way. I'd like to see you play a Baldur's Gate game where you dumped all the attributes. There is no build dversity, it is only an illusion that you think exists, because you can change the numbers.

Guys, there are more problems with this game than the experience system. Implementing combat xp wouldn't be enough to fix the game anyway, because the game is completely broken. Just read the thread at the RPG Codex. http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/pillars-of-eternity-butthurt-release-thread.93694/page-60

Care to elaborate? Sure. So why would you care about your attributes again. It seems that currently you can assign points in whatever way you want, because it will only have a minor effect on your character build. This needs to be fixed. The game is broken.

If you're gonna roll a wizard it has to be a muscle wizard. Any other wizard build doesn't make any sense. xD

The fundamental design of the game at it's core is broken. It is amusing to watch you guys give recommendations to fix something that can't be fixed. But I honor the fact that you have noticed that there is a problem with the design.

They did it because they wanted our money to make something that is almost completely different from the IE games, and is not any good either.

He MAY just be referring to the beta. I hope... That is the currently implemented quest system. Doesn't mean it can't be changed though.

Wasn't it obvious during the kickstarter that we would be getting the spiritual successor to Darklands? Darklands is Sawyer's favorite game.

I'd rather be able to wear two suits of armor at the same time to be honest.

Nothing is broken. Even if the attributes didn't matter (Which they do) it wouldn't be broken; just silly and superficial. I guess I have to post examples, but I can't be bothered right now. Oh well, just forget it. Maybe some other time.

It is okay. The pub music is boring though. The opening theme song sounds a lot like a tune from Indiana Jones (I do not mean the main theme song of the movies).

Each quest has little mini objectives and you get some XP for each one you complete. That is the only way to get XP in this game. You won't get any XP for combat, solving puzzles, learning spells, picking locks, disarming traps, etc. like in the IE games. BTW, the quest system is also broken. If you leave the village to go exploring without talking to everyone first and then clear out the surrounding areas, then you could end up receiving absolutely no XP at all.

It won't be as effective for certain builds. I for example; don't like drawn out battles. As a result I tend to favor offensive attributes with most of my team. If I were to spread my attributes out evenly; my team wouldn't quite play the way I want it to. Just saying that the effect is so minimal, that it hardly makes a difference anyway. Ok seriously your posts that the attribute system is meaningless are all over the forum. Here is a tip, play the game, try out different builds. You might find out that the way you spread out your stat points does really matter. You sound like someone that looked at the system, decided that it sucks and than never even bothered to actually try it. Like your comment that INT is useless, go in the game make a int heavy priest or mage with dots and look how meaningless that attribute is. I'd recommend that you make a build right now and the spend all of your 57 attribute points evenly. You'll see that I am right. The attribute system gives the player the illusion of choice, although there actually is none. ^This is broken and it needs to be fixed.

Nothing happens. You can kill the Ogre and he drops his head and some blood. If you're role playing a sicko packrat, you will have a valid RP reason for collecting that ogre head and placing it in your pack (you're a sicko pack rat!). If not, well, good luck finding a justification for your Meta-gaming/ESP. And that's it. You can then go meet the farmer for the first time, listen to his plight, and what he wants you to do, Then in that same dialogue you can show him the ogre's head. If you're lucky, you get XP for that. Welcome to fetch-quests 101. But make no mistake about this: If you go to that wilderness map before talking to anyone in the village, EVERYTHING you do there is unrewarded. No XP for exploration. No XP for clearing that giant cult dungeon. No XP for using your Might skill to force open the dungeon's entrance. No XP for slaughtering all the beetles and spiders that "block your path" to the ogre cave. No XP for entering that cave. No XP for dealing with the enemy party up north (even if you do it peacefully, which is an option). No XP for successfully Athletic-ing the Dragon Egg down from the ledge. NADA. Is this supposed to be anyone's idea of proper RPG design? "I am absolutely sure this is not a bug or unfinished content in a beta, and that the final game will work in the exact same way. Hear me roar!" "Experience is awarded only through quest progression. At certain points during quests a "Quest Update" scroll pops up in the top left and any experience gained is shown in the Combat Log. You may have just missed it :bow:" link

Whatever you say. I still think the attribute system needs a major overhaul.

It won't be as effective for certain builds. I for example; don't like drawn out battles. As a result I tend to favor offensive attributes with most of my team. If I were to spread my attributes out evenly; my team wouldn't quite play the way I want it to. Just saying that the effect is so minimal, that it hardly makes a difference anyway.

I already noticed that you don't care, because you know nothing about RPGs. You're just a little butthurt troll who likes to annoy me with ridiculous posts whenever we discover something ridiculous about the games mechanics.

It would definitely be much harder. I'm pretty sure it would be possible though. Just keep in mind that there are also talents in this game that help us develop our characters as well as attributes. Yes, but it is simply mind boggling to me that you could dump every attribute and still play the game without any problems. The game would just be somewhat harder and you would also have less dialogue options to choose from. This must be that balanced system that Sawyer was always going on about. ^^ It's because Obsidian has decided that talents should be important too. By adding in talents; they downplayed attributes. I haven't played a good RPG that didn't have any talents. That is completely normal. I am just saying that the attribute system is completely superfluous in PoE, unlike in other games.

Why even bother and try and build a character by selecting attributes to put points in? You might as well just spend all of your 57 attribute points evenly on every attribute. This works for every class too. Sawyer

It would definitely be much harder. I'm pretty sure it would be possible though. Just keep in mind that there are also talents in this game that help us develop our characters as well as attributes. Yes, but it is simply mind boggling to me that you could dump every attribute and still play the game without any problems. The game would just be somewhat harder and you would also have less dialogue options to choose from. This must be that balanced system that Sawyer was always going on about. ^^