Sedrefilos

I usually don't buy a agme that I definately know I'll like. There are so many let's play videos for every single game out there. Why spend money blindly (or semi-blindly) on a (usually) expensive game if you don't know if you're gonna play it to the end? Unless money is not a problem, so it's ok I guess. But I get it. Games are like movies this days. Spam everywhere with their "awesomeness" and most people are not scrutinizing geeks like us here so they buy based on cover. Still, fool me once it's on you, fool me twice...

Why do they buy them then?

Classed is better for Pillars since it is a party game. Even if it was classless, you would "class" each companion eventually, since you'd need them to fill specific roles. Same happened to me with Tyranny and Wasteland 2. Classless is better for single character games, imo.

When your godlikes tries to wear a helmet for the first time, a little scipted interaction should appear: "jelous of your partymates wearing headgear, you grab the greathelm and pull it down your head with determination. It breaks open and it's ruined forever. What do you do?" "1) Leave it there as it never happened. Helmet? What helmet?" "2) think "fakk it" and toss it over your shoulder. Who needs them when you have those glorious hornes. Let the others grow horns instead" "3) pick another one and try to wear it. The last one was of bad quality for sure"

That's what I mean. How a good resting mechanic works is not something objective. I'd like it that way you'd like it that way. Personally I don't believe it can work in this game in a way it makes good sense gameplay-wise. Removing it altogether, as you suggest, sounds good, imo, but it'll require too much rules changing so that you can heal more frequently/sustain more damage during combat since you wouldn't want to have any companion drop to 0 life anytime. I still believe "survive the encounter or die" + wounds for fallen (DA:O style) is the best way to go for these games. EDIT: Also, I don't believe resting has to do with wanting the game to be easy so that they can sell more. Pillars 1 had resting yet not even 1% finished it, as you said.

"Fixing" resting is a bit subjective.

Some zionist conspiracy maybe?

Indeed. This makes us assume that fire godlikes sleep on stone beds without pillows. Ha! Let the devs explain how they deal with ordinary daily stuff with all those flames constantly errupting from their head! :D

@Enduin Having minor and serious wounds sounds like a good idea, imo, although I don't think inn-resting curing serious wounds will solve much, more like it'll have the the latter of the outcomes you describe and it'll annoy players. If two kinds of wounds are to be implemented, I suggest serious wounds be treated in a more unique and hard-to-get way (like special treatment using a rare rsource or something, I don't know), so when you have one or two wounds you're like "ok, I won't be able to cure enough serious wounds untill I don't even know when, so screw this side dungeon I'm currently in - I guess I've failed it at this playthrough - better save for the critical path because if I fail that too is either game over for good or reload a very old save". That, me at least, will make think twice before consuming my wound-curing supplies. Of course, as I said before, I'm not sure resting can be done that good in these types of games so maybe this conversation is meaningless and Obsidian will just inplement their current idea, which noone will complain when the game is out 'cause, ok another not very successful resting mechanic and they'll just abandon it altogether in the future

Apparently "consoles" was not the only reason rpgs moved away from IE mechanics, if that was a reason at all.

Do you think 1 point of difference = 10% damage would work better? Like pen 5 VS armor 5 = 100% damage. pen 5 vs armor 4 = 110% damage. pen 4 vs armor 5 = 90% damage. And so on?

POE2 has perma-death, once you get 4 injuries the character dies and is removed from the party. You get a corpse on the ground with all his/her gear. Well, yeah, but you can always rest almost without limitation correct? So you WILL rest frequently because why not? In Darkest Dungeon you get some limited supplies and you never find any more in the dungeons. So choosing when and where to rest is crucial because if you lose your heroes that's it they're gone and if you abandon the delve they get afflictions, and you lose the quest etc. They are very different games Deadfire and Darkest Dungeon but that's my point: resting mechanic is good in no story-heavy games that rely mostly on mechanics and they are built around the "push-your-luck" idea. I'm not so sure resting fits in stroy-driven rpgs, (although it adds to the atmosphere) because, at the end, it brings nothing to the table mechanics-wise. It's just something that you do. "Oh, I'm hurt. Ok I'll just rest I suppose - here wounds gone. Those guyz look pretty nasty. Ok, I'll fight them and then rest again thanks to my endless food supplies". I don't know. I never gave much thought on rest 'cause whenever it was present ti was just something I did when I got hurt much - a click of a button. I'm not sure there is a way to implement it in a way that is meaningful in these types of games, unfortunately.

Am I the only one that feels resting in video games is good only in games with perma-death (like Darkest Dungeon for instance)?

I'd love to play an endless dungeon mode with custom party, no story whatsoever, just delving and delving until you drop or quit or something.

There is only 1 way to solve rest spamming: don't use rest mechanics at all. Although I like it as a concept, I've never seen it implemented well. The new resting system looks better, imo, but, if one thinks rest-spamming is indeed a problem, I don't believe it'll solve it. I'm always a fan of DA:O style: survive the encounter or game over + wounds for the fallen to spice up things. So build better and fewer encounters. I'd love to see a rest mechanic that will be meaningful enough to represent what it supposed to be, but until then, DA:O style ftw.

Happy to see some more people asking for screenshot portraits. I asked about that in the first game but it never happened. I'd like to see it now since the character models are so much better this time and with greater variety than the portraits. I won't mind if they don't appear as a watercolor in conversations.

This is what I am thinking while reading posts in the beta threads. As a non-beta tester and a big fan of the Pillars 1 system (by far the best system for party-based crpgs ever, imho) I'd like to ask the beta -testers: In general, do you believe the new system is better, worse or just as good as the old, just doing things differently?

This is not the thread to talk about injuries - there is a dedicated one. This thread is to sum up the greatest concerns of the beta if I understood correctly, so better not overflow it with discussions. If I'm wrong, let the OPer correct me.

Still there is a lot of concern. Maybe you don't see it because you like it and don't participate in the conversation, but as a lurker, I see that many have raised concerns - that should concer Obsidian too.

A good thing would have been if Obasidian uploaded the entire class trees in an update, so people testing can have the whole picture.

OP change the name of the thread to something more general, imo.

There is also a great concern about the wounds system (wounds being too brutal, forcing rest spamming).

So... does anyone miss the 6th party member? It was huge concern for many but I haven't seen anyone bring it in the discussion.

You can still use new spells you find in Grimoires, and switch Grimoires before a difficult fight to switch up your spells. There's a better Grimoire than the one your wizard starts with near Tikawara, which you should probably pick up before doing the dungeon on a high difficulty. Tbh, without having played the beta myself, havign your wizard pick fewer spells but cast more from grimoires that you can find and collect sounds pretty fun to me. I never switched grimoires in the first game, I just picked up spells and stuck with them because it felt a bit of a chore. This sounds more interesting.

From what I read throughout the threads, it seems they have tried to fix many mechanics that were not broken. Does it worth it in your opinion?