
Volourn
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Everything posted by Volourn
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"First oiif all 10 millioin is juisit specuiilatioin. If JE soiild 500,000 thats groiss sales oif 25 millioin. Noiw develoipers accoirding toi the article get 7 percent oif the groiss sales. Noiw lets say becauise bioiwiare self puiblished they goiti 30 percent oifi the sales, which is extremely generoiuis coimpared toi 7. This means that they oinly goiit 8 millioin and thuis incuirred a loiss oifi 2 millioin based oin YOIIUIR specuilatioin oif 10 millioin. Noiw if yoiui are moiire realistic then yoiui will realize that bioi getting 30 percent oifi the shelf price oif the game is as muich oif a fantasy as duiingeoins and dragoins. Noiw Im noiti saying that the game loist moiiney foir bioi, juisit that it clearly boimibed." Youa re assuming that BIO paid 100% of the costs. You seem to forget that MS was involved. Most games do not cost 10 mil to make. " Noiw Im noiti saying that the game loist moiiney foir bioi, juisit that it clearly boimibed." If it didn't lose money; it did not bomb. Period. If it had bombed, MS would not want a sequel. Period. When a game (or anything) bombs that means it completely flopped. Whether or not JE made a lot of money, very little, or lost some is soemthing that wecna't really discuss at this time since we don't have all the facts. However, the fact that JE sold 500k+ copies proves without a doubt JE is not a bomb. Do you even know what 'a bomb' is in terms of games and other goods? It surely doesn't seem like it.
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1. HOTU 2. SOU 3. NWN 55. RPGMaker 1000. Arcanum 1 million. Morrowind
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Both games sucked. I cna't believe MDK2 sold a million copies! Lots of dumb customers!
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"Anyway, even a loiti oifi the moiisit hardcoiire black isle fanboiys think that heart oif winter was garbage and lioinheart was hoirrible, soi yoiuir disappoiiintment with a few oif bioiwiares proiduicts is noit a sign oifi noit being a fanboiy." Meh. You liked HOW. And, I thought LH was underrated. "The game can sell more copies than Halo 2, Half-Life 2, Super Mario 64, and Ocarina of Time put together for all I care, that doesn't change that fact that it sucks. I for one bought the LE the day after it was released. I was ecstatic for the first few hours. But then the novelty wore off, and I saw it as it really was: a shallow, unoriginal piece of garpage full of generic cardboard people and some of the most idiotic dialouge since Episode 1." Quality is not an issue in this thread. We are disucssing whether or not JE was a financial bomb. For the record, however, JE is better than every BIO game except for BG2 and NWN:TTP. It is also betteer than 99.9% of RPGs overall - only FO series and some Ultimas are also better than it. "1. My spelling is goiioid, buiit my keyboiaird is buisited." Exuses. "2. I never claimed they were proiioif, juiist EVIDENCE. Please pick uip a dictioiinary and find oiuit the difference between the meanings oifi the twoi woirds." Evidence, proof, it means nothing. It's all hearsay based on wishful thinking; not facts. "3. Jade empire is the first noini licensed rpg... and the first noiin licensed title they made in a loinig time. Noiw I doiinit want toi get intoi a semantical arguiment oiver this, soii lets leave it at that." Irrelevant. It's not BIO's first non licensed game. Period. RPG or not is ireelevant. "4. Whether 500k coipies is goioidi oiri noiti depends oini the coists oifi the title. We can estimate these coisits based oiin the amoiuint oif marketing foiir the title as well as the size oif the team and the lenght oif develoiipment." OMG! That's what I've been saying, and I doubt JE cost more than 10 mil to make. Period. 10 mil is an amount reserved for the super main stream games. JE was never one of those. NEVER. "5. Bioiware is knoiwn toii be a hype machine... They proimise a loiti foiir their games buiit doii noiti deliver, and like in the case oifi nwn oiuitright lie regarding the games roiileplaying and coinitent. They are liars and shoiuild noiti be truisited. Yoiiui have toi be a famboiiy toi believe what bioiware says." BIO does hype; but they do not lie. Period.
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None of your horribly mispelled (even by my standards) i'facts' is proof. Not one. "Bioware is goiiing toi be very reluictant toi admit that their first noin licensed game boimbed." If you enter a conversation, at least know basic facts. Let's look at some of your misconceptions. 1. JE is NOT BIO's first non licensed title. Better look at SS for that. 2. JE did not take 5 years to make. That's a mythical myth. 3. JE did not bomb. When a game sells 500k copies,a nd is almost gaurnateed to have a sequel it is not a bomb. 4. BIO does not lie. Period. Don't mix up hype with actual facts. 5. You have (nor do I) have any idea how much it cost BIO tod evlop JE so its hard to detemrine how many copies needed to sell for them to make money. Bottom line here is that JE sold 500k copies. Until I see REAL proof that it financially bombed; opinions found in this thread are just that. Please quote me the cost to develop JE, and the profit that JE made then maybe you have a shot to prove that. Until then, 500k copies sold is very good whether its a console game or not. Game over. P.S. "The game deserves toi be woirshipped." No games do. None. Zilch. Zero.
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My response is that I have to see real proof that selling 500k copies of a game can be considered a financial failure. I shall continue to await this proof. And, wait. And, wait. And, wait. And, wait. And, wait.
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"Proof? Gaider's comments." Not proof. You notice how he mentions games like DA, and NWN; but not JE. Go figure. Eitehr way, it's not proof. The only acceptable proof as far as I'm concerned is either BIO or MS saying that JE cost them money. BIO is on record saying they ar every much happy with the 500k sales. I'll take that over fellow posters' word any day of the week. Unless you can show that JE cost 25 mil to make, and it only made 24.9 mil in profit. Otherwise, you have NO proof!
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I'm nowhere near " #1 spammer" on any board except the Codex. But, theyd eserve it so I have no mercy for those stalkers, punks, and munchies. Game over.
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"Melee fighters seem to end up being the best characters in combat in pretty much all RPGs..." No. I take mages or clerics ANY day of ther week over wimpy fighters. In NWN, I'd take rogue/shadowdancer/assassin over fighter any day of the week. Game over.
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"In the end its does not matter what Volourn thinks, as said 500,000 sales are pretty disapointing on a console title, expecialy considering BioWare usual sale numbers." Proof please. Once again, comapring JE to games like BG-NWN-KOTOR is silly as they have inbuilt audience to them. 500k sales is prettyd anr good, and I ahve yet to see ANY proof otherwise. It's so good that JE is very likely to get a sequel. R00fles! To say 500k sales is disaapointing for a console game is a statement typed illogically. How many console games reach 500k sales. I bet you anything it's a very small percenatge relatively speaking. Game over.
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"IWD still has the best combat of all the IE games" No; but it was good though. :cool:
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I'm #1 poster in ZERO forums. Don't spread rumours, myths, and innuendos please.
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IWD2 was the worst of the IE games, and it's the only one I didn't complete because it was plain old fahsion boring. IWD was good. I enjoyed it; but still it pales incomparison to BG series or PST. Not even in the same league. IWD3 is simply not needed. It would add nothing to the series. The Bg series is a role-playing game. This is undispuatble as it does everything a RPG is supposed to - allows you to play your character in a reasonable matter. Period.
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I'm a violent fanboy? Really? Tell me one person who I have physically assasulted over a BIO game. Just one. Plus, when do 'violent fanboys' not play two of their obects games, believe one game is below par, trash one expansion, rate one of their major games a 75%, and also be trahsed talked by one of the employees because I had the gall tomake fun of their games. R00fles! If that's being a fanboy, yup, that's me. And, besides, being called a fanboy by Roshan who types worse than I do and actually started a whole RELIGION over a silly game is hilarious!
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"(insert fanboy slurping sounds here followed by swallowing sound effects) Bioware's **** sure tastes great! r00fles indeed." Reported.
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MDK2 sucked. So did SS. Why do is ay they suck? Easy. If I didn't play a game it automatically sucks.
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"I loved the reviews that said the story in Jade Empire was deeper and better than KOTOR." That's because it is. KOTOR isn't even in the same league as JE when it comes to story, and role-playing. Or combat. Or graphics. Or sound. Or music. Or character depth. Or originality. Or npcs. JE is wayyyyyyyy better than KOTOR in every way that matters. "15 hours may be accurate, and I've heard the same claim from most people who have beat the game." Proof please. Most people it's been accurately reported to be between 20-30 hours. Anyone who claims to have finished it in less 20 hours is either lying, or pretty much skipped everything but the neccessary. Those who claimed it's over 40 hours are just smokin' dope. Sorry Jaguar. That comment isn't personal. Just a fact. "The limited edition preorder copies that were supposed to sell out right away are still sitting on store shelves. Jade Empire was estimated to be a huge hit, and underperformed." Proof please. JE sold 500+k copies. You (or I) have no idea if it udnerpoerfromed. In order to make that determination we'd have to know the amount of copies that Bioware and MS expected to sell. We don't know their projected sales for the game so this opinion of yours isn't based in reality. Until we know what theye xpected, 500k + sales should be assumed to be pretty darn good since JE was sold basiclay on BIO's rep and not some pre made setting. People who actually believe that BIO is some main stream company are fooling sound. I *always* epxected JE to sell around 500k copies. Just do a search of pre release post. Then again, I am a proven genius so I'm always right in these matters. R00fles!
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"I was not going to say The Sith Lords. I agree with you. I have been quite busy lately and have not had time for much gaming, but I suppose I would be forced to admit that Jade Empire is the best RPG I have played recently. This is due more to lack of gaming time and scarcity of competition, than any inherent superiority, though." Well. If it's the best RPG you played recently (if not the only one) then it most certainly is the best RPG you'v eplayed recently. I've played, btw, JE, KOTOR2, BL, TOEE, HOTU, and a few other RPGs over the last two years and out of them all, JE is eaisly the best. "I simply believe it should have been better." if you enjoyed it then it was as good as it should be. Now, if you had said, it *could* have been better then I'd agree. Then again, every game I have *ever* played could have been better.
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Whya re people keen on blaming humans for NATURAL disasters? I blame Mother Nature. She is the evil one who coldly murders innocent people. She deserves global warming. By the time, global warming actually effects the world ina really signifacnt way I will be either dead, or the human race will be living on other planets so she will suffer in the long run and we won't. A win-win situation as far as I'm concerned. We should stop pampering such a vicious creature like Mother nature.
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"Do you ever shut up? Why is every piece of excrement pulled from your ass a worthy topic for discussion?" Reported. "Do the positives outweigh the negatives? Perhaps. It depends on your focus. I prefer a strong story, so I would say no. You would say yes. It doesnt matter. We are each entitled to our opinions. However, is it the best RPG within recent history? Absolutely not." Actually, it is, and it's because of it's story and role-playing. Only BL comes close but ultimately fails due to its crappy combat.
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"I'm still think they would be disappointed with 500k." The article suggests they aren't dissapointed nor do their posts on their forums.
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1. JE's combat would be absolutely horrible on PC. I would certainly not want to try it. The role-playing part would work great on PC since that aprt is pretty much like every other BIO game (but better). The combat, however, was perfectly matched for the x-box as was BIO's intent all along. It's also why BIO faltly refuses to port it over to PC despite all the PC whiners on their boards. KOTOR was not a port so it's a horrible comparison not to mention that unlike JE; KOTOR was not full fledge RT. 2. BIO seems to be happy with 500k sales according to this article. 3. MS seems to be happy with JE's performance hence why a sequel is already in the works and is probably one of BIO's worst kept secrets. 4. Anyone who expected JE to sell as much as BG-NWN-KOTOR were in LaLaLand. JE sold 90% based on BIO's rep, and 10% on marketing. BG-NWN-KOTOR all had decades old successful licenses to pimp out. Only BIO,a nd MS know what the bottom line actual profit was made; but that's irrelevant here as it's obvious JE sold well. This is undisputable. 500k copies is pretty danr good, and remember folks that's 500k copies to date minimum. Nothing to sneeze at unless you were predicting that JE was gonna be a Halo or Diablo, or Sims type success. If so, tsk, tsk.
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"Vol, I know emotions are running high, but you've endured a lot worse comments from me, for crying out loud. ...And given some grief as well. Let's try to keep the thread open." I don't want to get into disucssing moderation stuff publicly; but I'm just tryin' to follow the rules. if I am gonna get chastized for flaming and 'personal attacks'; I'll follow the rules and refrain from them to the best of my abilities; but it forces me to report as many indiscrestions as possible of other people. I know it makes your job more difficult; but it's just the rulez.
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"And most titles lose money, so that proves nothing other than JE might not have lost as much as other titles that did even worse (or at best made a very modest profit - we don't know the production costs). 500k is not much of a hit in the modern market and 1M is definitely not a "super duper" hit in the modern market, despite what the "Platinum Hits" sign at thr shop might say to convince you otherwise. You might have predicted 500k but BioWare needs to do much better to survive in the long run. Bottom line, JE did "OK", but no more." It's funny you chastize me and others for saying if JE did this or did that fianncelly yet you go on to say it did 'ok' when you don't have the inner sources either nor do you know what its production costs are. Also, no where do I say that Bioware made millions of dollars off of JE. All I said was that JE wa sno 'financial failure' and the 500k+ copies sold proves this. "500k is not much of a hit in the modern market and 1M is definitely not a "super duper" hit in the modern market, despite what the "Platinum Hits" sign at thr shop might say to convince you otherwise." Really? Can you name the x-box titles that have sold 1 mil copies this year? How 'bout those who have reached 500k? I guarantee you that it's just a handful for 1 mil, and not many more for 500k plus. And, that's out of hundreds of games released.
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"Afghanistan. They leveled the place and last I checked the country and its 'democratic' government aren't doing so well." Amerika is still there. And, actually, other than the drug issue, Afghanistan is doing okay. Certainly in better shape than when they wer eunder the Taliban. You don't help improve a country that was in the state that Afghanistan was over night. It takes time, and patience - somehting that many people lack while they expect things to be perfect overnight. It took years for Europe to recover after WW2. Why should Afghanistan and Iraq be any different? "Nope. You don't take an oath to defend Iraq when you enlist/get commissioned. Trust me. But you're right, higher-ups have indeed committed the military to George's Middle Eastern Adventure, and I have little doubt that we're going to try and make it work. What I'm telling you is that from my vantage point, I don't see how it can, at all." That's what i meant. I didn't mean the individual Armed Forces soldier. I meant the Amred Forces intity. Though, many many individuals in the army have given their promise to the Iraqi people to help them. I am pro US Army. I epxect them to honour their pledges.