How to build a melee wizard?

[Progressive_Stupidity]

Are all the summoned weapons two handed? No one handed available.

[Boeroer]

Kalakoth's Minor Blights are one-handed. If you put a melee one-handed weapon in your offhand and summmon Blights you can attack with 30% attack speed bonus and even use Two Weapon Style (for additional 20%). Or you use one-handed Style and gain +12 ACC and hit-to-crit conversion.

 

Besides that (in the beta) all other summoned wepapons are two handed.

Edited April 17, 2018 by Boeroer

[Ragnaroz]

Has anyone tried Barb/Wizard ? Wanted to try something that is a bit out there, but can't really try it because I don't have access to the beta.

[Boeroer]

Yes, I tried different stuff with that combo.

 

Citzal's Spirit Lance + Carnage is nice but not game breaking. You'll just have two parallel AoE damaging effects that don't interfere with each other (Lance's AoE hits wil not proc additional Carnage for example). But it's pretty nice for Combusting Wounds (2 hits instead of 1 for every attack in an AoE).

 

Also Frenzy + Bloodlust is pretty cool with the Lance.

 

And of course the awesome self buffs of a wizard help with sturdyness.

 

Another nice touch is that you can remove confused (a Berserker gets confused by his own powerful Frenzy) with something like Infuse with Vital Essence.

And for non-Berserkers the Infuse will lead to a bigger AoE with Lance and Carnage.

 

Later on there will be Blood Thirst in the game: I can imagine that Lance's AoE + Carnage AoE lead to faster kills which will speed up the Barb/Wizard's attacks a lot.

 

Even the Parasitic Staff + Barbarian is nice. 

Edited April 19, 2018 by Boeroer

[Ragnaroz]

Thanks for the answer, that's pretty much what I expected, was just hoping that there were no negative synergies. Guess I know what my MC is now. 

[Boeroer]

There is negative synergies in the early game with a Berserker/Wizard because Berserker's Frenzy causes confusion and confusion lowers INT. But once you can get Infuse wVE it's all good.

 

There is also supernegative synergies with Mage Slayer/Wizard - for the whole game for obvious reasons.

Edited April 19, 2018 by Boeroer

[SaruNi]

Many Berserker abilities also work with DD spells (Blooded +25% damage, Wilder Hunter +25% damage, Bloodlust +20% action speed that stacks with other speed bonuses, Blood Frenzy DoT on hit, Spirit Frenzy, as well as +2 penetration from Tenacious). 

 

And Wild Sprint can be useful (gives Nimble (+5 dex, +100% stride) and immune to engagement).

 

Concelhaut's Draining Staff might make it easier to survive while Blooded and Berserk.

 

More generally, spells make it much easier to get Blooded (less than 50% health) quickly without dying quickly. In addition to hitting yourself with your own spells, you can start out with weak defenses and then once you're blooded raise your defenses dramatically.

Edited April 19, 2018 by SaruNi

[TheMetaphysician]

Is the upgrade from Cleaving Stance to Mob Stance really very good, worth the ability pick? The -5% recovery time for threatened enemies sounds ok, until you realize that a wizard/fighter without a shield is going to have like 1 engagement slot, if that. Or does the -5% recovery time per enemy apply to any adjacent enemies, whether engaged or not? If it doesn't, it doesn't seem like a good pick.

[Doxy]

What about fighter unbroken / wizard focused on +engagements, buffs and flame shield?

Sort of fire retaliation tank. How is the dmg on flame shield btw, anyone knows?

[dunehunter]

What about fighter unbroken / wizard focused on +engagements, buffs and flame shield?

Sort of fire retaliation tank. How is the dmg on flame shield btw, anyone knows?

Pretty low, I remember it’s like around 8-14

[The Sharmat]

Extremely basic question but playing with the idea of doing a multiclass melee wizard first. How does stat progression work for multiclassing? How do they decide the endurance and accuracy per level? The defenses?

[Boeroer]

Average number of the two classes.

[Aravane]

So the full list of abilities is out now. Citzal's Enchanted Armory turns out to be the capstone spell for a summoned-weapons-centric wizard.

 

 

We get two weapons (two weapon style ahoy!) and a breastplate. Exciting, though we have no specifics on their stats yet. But it makes multiclassing a melee wizard less of a no-brainer.

However, I'm concerned about the duration of summoned weapons. It appears they've all been nerfed to last 25 seconds. I don't have the backer beta, but that seems... rather on the short side. And out of step with other wizard buffs.

 

Hoping for some thoughts from our experienced character builders on how impactful this nerf might turn out to be.

[HAWmaro]

note that that duration is with 10 int.  

Edited May 5, 2018 by HAWmaro

[Aravane]

note that that duration is with 10 int.

There's also power level to consider. Does it affect duration for summoned weapons? Since IIRC the stats on the weapons scale with character level.

[Ganrich]

 

note that that duration is with 10 int.

There's also power level to consider. Does it affect duration for summoned weapons? Since IIRC the stats on the weapons scale with character level.

It is supposed to? It's hard to say for sure. Also, there are passive talentd to increase durations on buffs iirc, and one for specifically increasing duration on Empowered Spells.

 

All that and I think a base of 25 should be fine, but with these long recovery times it can be tough to say.

[Cerulean Shaman]

Kalakoth's Minor Blights are one-handed. If you put a melee one-handed weapon in your offhand and summmon Blights you can attack with 30% attack speed bonus and even use Two Weapon Style (for additional 20%). Or you use one-handed Style and gain +12 ACC and hit-to-crit conversion.

 

 

How did that feel? I'm thinking of trying this, as I think the flavor (magical energy slinging sword swinging melee mage) is really interesting, and I'd still at least have one weapon for soulbound/enchant. I wanted to do a melee cipher, but not a big fan of it just being a SA spammer so I've been mulling over trying something else. 

[JerekKruger]

So the full list of abilities is out now. Citzal's Enchanted Armory turns out to be the capstone spell for a summoned-weapons-centric wizard.

 

We get two weapons (two weapon style ahoy!) and a breastplate. Exciting, though we have no specifics on their stats yet. But it makes multiclassing a melee wizard less of a no-brainer.

 

One of the first things I'm going to do on release is make a Wizard and use the console to check out this ability.

 

However, I'm concerned about the duration of summoned weapons. It appears they've all been nerfed to last 25 seconds. I don't have the backer beta, but that seems... rather on the short side. And out of step with other wizard buffs.

 

Hoping for some thoughts from our experienced character builders on how impactful this nerf might turn out to be.

 

 

Power Levels increases durations of summoned weapons (it's the only thing they effect). This is a strictly a transformation* rather than a summoned weapon but I imagine the same is true (can't check as I just deleted the backer beta). That said I believe (someone else might correct me) that only Power Levels you get after you reach the level required to unlock the spell count, so your might not get much of a boost from Power Level for a high level spell like this (though presumably you still do from things like the Nature Godlike's racial ability etc.).

 

Obviously Intellect also increases the duration, and at such high level I suspect you'll be able to massively buff your Intellect, so hopefully the duration will be fine.

 

*I imagine this is the easiest way to give armour given that it's already coded for Spiritshift and the Ogre transformation.

[Aravane]

Power Levels increases durations of summoned weapons (it's the only thing they effect). This is a strictly a transformation* rather than a summoned weapon but I imagine the same is true (can't check as I just deleted the backer beta). That said I believe (someone else might correct me) that only Power Levels you get after you reach the level required to unlock the spell count, so your might not get much of a boost from Power Level for a high level spell like this (though presumably you still do from things like the Nature Godlike's racial ability etc.).

Based on this post on Chanter summon durations (I think summoned weapons/transformations interact with PL in the same way) you get +5% duration per power level over unlock level. IIRC Empower gives +10 PL for a spell, so that's potentially +50% duration. The Lasting Empower passive gives a 20% increase on top of that. Doesn't seem worth it. Probably better to do another cast and use the Empower to refresh available spells. The 3 second cast time isn't disastrously long.

 

There are also the passives that speed up the cast: Martial Caster (+15%) and Rapid Casting (+10%). Martial Caster seems awful - with 3 casts of a summoned weapon in an encounter (which seems on the high end of things) it saves you 1.35 seconds. A really narrow and underwhelming effect.

 

The 25 second duration also present a problem when using Citzal's Martial Power. That buff lasts 30 seconds and disables spellcasting, meaning you're guaranteed some time with no spells and no summoned weapons if you try to combo them together. Really unfortunate, since they're clearly meant to be used together. I wish they'd actually nerf Martial Power's duration to match.

 

I'm just left hoping there are items with unique properties that work well for this character archetype, though I'm leaning towards rolling something else entirely.

Edited May 6, 2018 by Aravane

[TheMetaphysician]

Were you guys underwhelmed by Citzal's Martial Power? I was expecting something better than first-tier inspirations for the cost of not being able to cast spells. Those second-tier inspirations are just so much better, and the martial classes mostly all have abilities that get them those.

[Clerith]

Were you guys underwhelmed by Citzal's Martial Power? I was expecting something better than first-tier inspirations for the cost of not being able to cast spells. Those second-tier inspirations are just so much better, and the martial classes mostly all have abilities that get them those.

Yeah. Some defensive buffs are nice with near instant cast time and no recovery, but a lot of the offensive buffs were nerfed, like DAoM is shiiit. 

[Aravane]

Were you guys underwhelmed by Citzal's Martial Power? I was expecting something better than first-tier inspirations for the cost of not being able to cast spells. Those second-tier inspirations are just so much better, and the martial classes mostly all have abilities that get them those.

The inspirations are pretty underwhelming, but the accuracy and deflection seem quite good. It's about what I expected, and I think it'd be worth using if it weren't for the duration issues.

 

[ntbittle]

If you are willing to Multi the Melee Wiz, Shattered Pillar Monk seems pretty interesting.  Use all of the Quick Self Buffs and the use the Monk skills for your attacks.  The Mirror Images would combo well with Dance of Death.

 

Would Deleterious Alacrity of Motion generate wounds for a non Shattered Pillar?

[NZV]

I was thinking of playing a Trickster, but the wizard spells costing guile really put me off. Nerfed sneak attack was bad enough, but it seems even worse if your new defensive skills are competing for the same resource as your regular offensive ones.

 

Anyone have any opinions on Assassin/Wizard? Might end up going down that path for a similar character concept that's hopefully more effective, with wizard buffs helping to cancel out the squishiness of the assassin. Maybe going Assassin + another martial multiclass would be stronger, but I really like the idea of melee/magic hybrid characters, and wizard seems like the only one who has spells without excruciatingly long cast/recovery times.

[Aravane]

If you are willing to Multi the Melee Wiz, Shattered Pillar Monk seems pretty interesting.  Use all of the Quick Self Buffs and the use the Monk skills for your attacks.  The Mirror Images would combo well with Dance of Death.

 

Would Deleterious Alacrity of Motion generate wounds for a non Shattered Pillar?

 

The wording on DAoM is negative health restored (rather than raw damage taken) so it's ambiguous. Someone with the beta could check. Wizard/Monk seems respectable, though not spectacular.

 

I was thinking of playing a Trickster, but the wizard spells costing guile really put me off. Nerfed sneak attack was bad enough, but it seems even worse if your new defensive skills are competing for the same resource as your regular offensive ones.

 

Anyone have any opinions on Assassin/Wizard? Might end up going down that path for a similar character concept that's hopefully more effective, with wizard buffs helping to cancel out the squishiness of the assassin. Maybe going Assassin + another martial multiclass would be stronger, but I really like the idea of melee/magic hybrid characters, and wizard seems like the only one who has spells without excruciatingly long cast/recovery times.

 

Agreed on the Trickster. Class resources are scarce enough without adding to the issue.

 

Melee Assassin/Wizard? Seems extra squishy if anything goes wrong. I wouldn't take it on PotD, but you could probably make it work on Veteran. Lots of micro involved, but I think that's always the case with Assassin. Most Assassin/Wizard builds I've seen floated around are about nuking from invis with spells (Backstab bonus doesn't apply but Assassinate does) and disappearing again.

 

Melee/magic hybrid characters are in ample supply in Deadfire. Druid does that all on their own (spells and spiritshift), as does a Skald (crit in melee and cast invocations). You could probably multi a Priest if you're stubborn but I don't think they're especially well suited. But most of all there's the Soul Blade Cipher - they melee, they've got a bunch of spells as a sideboard, you can multi them with basically any martial class for good results. They also have a fair few spells with an 0.5 second cast time, though these come with a 3-4 second recovery unlike the fast Wizard buffs. But at least getting interrupted shouldn't be a problem. (Actually, did they end up nerfing Soul Annihilation in the full release? I was worried they would.)