Politics 2017 part 4

[Gfted1]

[Hurlshort]

Ok WoD, let's start from the beginning.

 

First we have the threat of terrorism. Is it your argument that we have not done enough to prevent another attack?

 

We can get to the threat of other world nations next. Let's focus on one aspect at a time.

[Wrath of Dagon]

Ok WoD, let's start from the beginning.

 

First we have the threat of terrorism. Is it your argument that we have not done enough to prevent another attack?

 

We can get to the threat of other world nations next. Let's focus on one aspect at a time.

No, I'm not saying we haven't done enough, but you can't just say we've done enough and stop. We have to keep taking measures, because they haven't stopped trying to attack us.

[Hurlshort]

 

Ok WoD, let's start from the beginning.

 

First we have the threat of terrorism. Is it your argument that we have not done enough to prevent another attack?

 

We can get to the threat of other world nations next. Let's focus on one aspect at a time.

No, I'm not saying we haven't done enough, but you can't just say we've done enough and stop. We have to keep taking measures, because they haven't stopped trying to attack us.

 

 

I don't think anyone is arguing to stop the measures that are already in place right now. The Trump administration is not simply maintaining measures, it is aggressively ramping them up. Where is the justification for that?

[HoonDing]

In the 50s a draft-dodging commie like Trump would've already been hanged from the nearest kumquat tree.

Get your act together, 2nd amendment ppl.

[Ben No.3]

Not everyone appealing to the proletariat is a commie -.-

 

Edited March 2, 2017 by Ben No.3

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

 

Ok WoD, let's start from the beginning.

 

First we have the threat of terrorism. Is it your argument that we have not done enough to prevent another attack?

 

We can get to the threat of other world nations next. Let's focus on one aspect at a time.

No, I'm not saying we haven't done enough, but you can't just say we've done enough and stop. We have to keep taking measures, because they haven't stopped trying to attack us.

 

 

I don't think anyone is arguing to stop the measures that are already in place right now. The Trump administration is not simply maintaining measures, it is aggressively ramping them up. Where is the justification for that?

 

You'd have to be more specific about which measures you think they're ramping up for me to answer that. If you're talking about the travel ban, it's only a temporary measure until they can improve scrutiny of visitors, which isn't sufficient as we saw in the San Bernardino attack.

[Malcador]

 

What are the problems with readiness right now? Guess that is hard to tell as everyone is trying to stuff their budgets so you're going to get alarmist reports at best and maybe self sabotage at worst. Also need to consider what you are being ready for.

I guess you can always question their claims but for what it's worth: http://dailysignal.com/2017/02/10/defense-leaders-agree-us-military-readiness-is-at-a-dangerous-low

 

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/05/14/wiped-out-air-force-losing-pilots-and-planes-to-cuts-scrounging-for-spare-parts.html

Isn't that what the Boneyard is for, though? Isn't exactly a guarded garbage heap.

[Wrath of Dagon]

I think it's equivalent to a junk yard, I don't think they're supposed to actually get parts from there, except as a last resort.

[Gfted1]

Sweden Reinstates Conscription, With an Eye on Russia.

[Hurlshort]

 

You'd have to be more specific about which measures you think they're ramping up for me to answer that. If you're talking about the travel ban, it's only a temporary measure until they can improve scrutiny of visitors, which isn't sufficient as we saw in the San Bernardino attack.

 

 

The San Bernadino shooting was committed by an American citizen and his wife, what sort of scrutiny do you suggest that will prevent that? http://abcnews.go.com/US/inside-immigration-file-san-bernardino-shooter-tashfeen-malik/story?id=35912170

 

 

This is an example of ramping up: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/03/01/police-chiefs-immigration-task-force-outlines-opposition-to-trump-policy/?utm_term=.7fcfef384afa

Edited March 2, 2017 by Hurlshot

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

You'd have to be more specific about which measures you think they're ramping up for me to answer that. If you're talking about the travel ban, it's only a temporary measure until they can improve scrutiny of visitors, which isn't sufficient as we saw in the San Bernardino attack.

 

The San Bernadino shooting was committed by an American citizen and his wife, what sort of scrutiny do you suggest that will prevent that? http://abcnews.go.com/US/inside-immigration-file-san-bernardino-shooter-tashfeen-malik/story?id=35912170

 

The wife was admitted in spite of terrorist links.

 

This is an example of ramping up: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/03/01/police-chiefs-immigration-task-force-outlines-opposition-to-trump-policy/?utm_term=.7fcfef384afa

This is primarily about illegal immigration, not terrorism, no? Btw, do you believe that foreign criminals should not be deported?

[HoonDing]

Funny how ~1% of population is muslim yet everyone is wetting their pants in fear. Getting worse than France.

[Hurlshort]

 

 

You'd have to be more specific about which measures you think they're ramping up for me to answer that. If you're talking about the travel ban, it's only a temporary measure until they can improve scrutiny of visitors, which isn't sufficient as we saw in the San Bernardino attack.

 

The San Bernadino shooting was committed by an American citizen and his wife, what sort of scrutiny do you suggest that will prevent that? http://abcnews.go.com/US/inside-immigration-file-san-bernardino-shooter-tashfeen-malik/story?id=35912170

 

The wife was admitted in spite of terrorist links.

 

This is an example of ramping up: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/03/01/police-chiefs-immigration-task-force-outlines-opposition-to-trump-policy/?utm_term=.7fcfef384afa

This is primarily about illegal immigration, not terrorism, no? Btw, do you believe that foreign criminals should not be deported?

 

 

The administration is working very hard to tie the two together. I think foreign criminals deserve the rights of due process, and I tend to side with the police chiefs on this specific scenario.

 

As for the wife, I think you are giving the government a tremendous amount of power over the rights of an American citizen. Does he not have the right to marry who he wants and have her live in his country? How long do you plan on denying her entry based on those links? How many real families are you willing to break up in order to prevent one of these situations from happening again? 

[Enoch]

So, how about that Jeff Sessions, huh?

 

By now, the news that yet another figure in Trump's circle has been in touch with the Russian government isn't all that surprising.  The surprising thing is just how Sessions got himself in trouble.  Here's the exchange from his confirmation hearing:

 

 

 

Q: [A reference of some media reports regarding the Trump campaign's ties to Russia.] [if] there is any evidence that anyone affiliated with the Trump campaign communicated with the Russian government in the course of this campaign, what will you do?

 

A: Senator Franken, I’m not aware of any of those activities.  I have been called a surrogate at a time or two in that campaign, and I did not have communications with the Russians, and I’m unable to comment on it.

 

Set aside the fact that he didn't answer the question asked-- that's perfectly normal.  (And even appropriate-- a law enforcement official-to-be probably shouldn't be making comments on specific cases like that.)  Instead of answering, though, he voluntarily made a declarative statement, under oath, asserting a fact that is very very close to demonstrably untrue.  (Sessons acknowledges that he did talk with the Russian ambassador, but argues that he wasn't lying because he did so in his capacity as a Senator, rather than as somebody involved in the Trump campaign.)   I'm going to repeat that-- he volunteered an answer to a question that he was not asked, and did so arguably untruthfully. 

 

The first rule of any sworn testimony situation is that you do not volunteer information that you were not asked unless you really really want it on the record and are 100% certain that it is 100% true.  Even if all the Russia stuff amounts to nothing, in my book, he should resign immediately because any lawyer dumb enough to make that mistake has no business running the U.S. Department of Justice. 

Edited March 3, 2017 by Enoch

[Elerond]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/03/02/mike-pence-private-email/98637782/

Pence used personal email for state business — and was hacked

 

Vice President Mike Pence routinely used a private email account to conduct public business as governor of Indiana, at times discussing sensitive matters and homeland security issues.

 

Emails released to The Indianapolis Star, part of the USA TODAY Network, in response to a public records request show Pence communicated via his personal AOL account with top advisers on topics ranging from security gates at the governor’s residence to the state’s response to terror attacks across the globe. In one email, Pence’s top state homeland security adviser relayed an update from the FBI regarding the arrests of several men on federal terror-related charges.

 

 

[Guard Dog]

Irony... definitely my favorite form of humor!

[Enoch]

And, perhaps most damning of all, that email address was @AOL.com.  (Seriously!)

Edited March 3, 2017 by Enoch

[Guard Dog]

In other news gun manufactuer stocks are down 5% since Trump took office. Now that the fear of draconian gun control has been lifted folks are not racing out to arm themselves... more than they were before 2008 anyway. I was far less worried about that kind of thing after the Republicans took over the House in 2010. And Hillary losing is a big win because any justice she seated would likely have been amenable to reversing the Heller decision.

[Zoraptor]

Is anyone really surprised that Pence uses AOL? Hardly seems equivalent in any way to Hillary's situation.

[BruceVC]

Did US citizens freedom not already suffer enough from this fight against "Islam"? Did you really learn nothing from your fight against "communism"?

Well the West won the ideological war against  Communism and it will obviously win the war against Islamic extremism....what lesson should we learn?

[Malcador]

Is anyone really surprised that Pence uses AOL? Hardly seems equivalent in any way to Hillary's situation.

Well could argue it is, external server is as bad as your own. Is a fun situation for types like Pence harping on about integrity or justice or whatever moralizing hill they want to shoot from.

[Hurlshort]

I still get the idea that Pence and Clinton are simply old people with no real grasp of technology, and they are just doing what someone tells them to do, but also being stubborn about it.  

[Ben No.3]

 

Did US citizens freedom not already suffer enough from this fight against "Islam"? Did you really learn nothing from your fight against "communism"?

Well the West won the ideological war against Communism and it will obviously win the war against Islamic extremism....what lesson should we learn?

Essentially, what it means for freedom and freedom of speech. The Cold War took away everyone's opinion who was himself a communist or just somewhat around that spectrum in the name of security and te American way. Black List and all, does that ring a bell?

Now, it takes on different forms with Islam, namely the constant surveillance. But in essence, it is the exact same thing all over again.

 

Another thing is that the ideologies in question become senselessly defied in pure black and white patterns. Very few in the Cold War bothered to read Marx, Engels or even Lenin. Very few today bother to read the Quran (even though it would do good-one of the last few Textes even specifically tells Muslims that they have their religion, others have their own religion, and everyone should just get along). This of course does not only result in the waging of a war against the abstract concept of a certain ideology, but it also creates so much unnecessary fear, justifying the measures I've previously mentioned in the first place.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Very few in the Cold War bothered to read Marx, Engels or even Lenin.

And neither have you. If you're going to constantly use Marx as your only frame of reference, at least bother to read something he wrote.

Edited March 3, 2017 by KaineParker