Politics 2017

[Orogun01]

 

Pros and cons of California.

If California seceded from America, I'd imagine they'd have a very hard time.

First off, the jobs there are American jobs and a lot of the tech would be considered American. Very good possibility they'd have to start from scratch or else everything they are currently working on would result in a massive landslide of being sued.

Then from scratch, they'd have to find their roads, wouldn't have access to snap and all those goodies, the tolls going INTO California and such.

TBH I don't think they would have it as good as they think they would.

Course could be wrong as I have been many of times before.

 

I'm pretty sure Google, Apple, all the movies studios, HP, Tesla, etc. are not owned by the US in any way. That would kind of violate the entire model of capitalism. And considering a lot of these tech companies make their stuff in China, an independent California would probably have no trouble negotiating trade deals. Plus the port of LA is the largest trade port in terms of dollars in the world. Basically it would be a major loss for the US, but it doesn't really matter because it isn't going to happen. Anyone who wants it is delusional and is too caught up in political rhetoric to recognize basic economics. 

 

California loves the idea though, like a scorned wife that keep saying that she'll leave. 

 

Even if they are a big producer without a market they can't make profits and the US is a large consumer market.

[BruceVC]

 

 

Pros and cons of California.

If California seceded from America, I'd imagine they'd have a very hard time.

First off, the jobs there are American jobs and a lot of the tech would be considered American. Very good possibility they'd have to start from scratch or else everything they are currently working on would result in a massive landslide of being sued.

Then from scratch, they'd have to find their roads, wouldn't have access to snap and all those goodies, the tolls going INTO California and such.

TBH I don't think they would have it as good as they think they would.

Course could be wrong as I have been many of times before.

 

I'm pretty sure Google, Apple, all the movies studios, HP, Tesla, etc. are not owned by the US in any way. That would kind of violate the entire model of capitalism. And considering a lot of these tech companies make their stuff in China, an independent California would probably have no trouble negotiating trade deals. Plus the port of LA is the largest trade port in terms of dollars in the world. Basically it would be a major loss for the US, but it doesn't really matter because it isn't going to happen. Anyone who wants it is delusional and is too caught up in political rhetoric to recognize basic economics. 

 

California loves the idea though, like a scorned wife that keep saying that she'll leave. 

 

Even if they are a big producer without a market they can't make profits and the US is a large consumer market.

 

I would argue states like Texas play the old " I want to secede from the  USA card " more regularly than Cali ?

Edited January 28, 2017 by BruceVC

[Hurlshort]

I have never heard anybody in an actual position of influence in the state actually talk about seceding, so I don't think 'California' is quite as keen as you might think.

 

The main people I hear talking about are jealous 'conservatives' from other states.

[Calax]

I have never heard anybody in an actual position of influence in the state actually talk about seceding, so I don't think 'California' is quite as keen as you might think.

 

The main people I hear talking about are jealous 'conservatives' from other states.

Basically this. This is the third or fourth "let's split this sucker" movement I've seen in my lifetime. Admittedly with the political world we live in, I could see it somehow magically catching fire and the entire western (and mostly democratic) states leaving. Probably won't happen but with the way the times are a changin, I don't put money on anything.

 

I do laugh at the fact that most of the facebook posts I've been seeing are repeating the meme that California leaves... alone, and then magically turns into the Soviet Union. Realistically if it left it'd be incredibly messy while people figured out military and utility needs.

 

Facebook is providing hilarity with how people think **** works

Let them go, but they have to remember...

They do not get to take American $ (Since it is, technically, property of the US Government) and all American servicemembers must vacate the area immediately (There would be no standing agreement for the US Military to occupy). Let us also not forget any and all FBI agents and US Marshals.

Also wik, any and all utility lines must be severed until proper treaties are in place. Plus, there would have to be provisions on sovereignty of the ocean between California and Hawaii.

 

Also also wik, all California teams of professional sports would have to cease as there are no international treaties in place for those organizations to do business. They would, of course, have the capability to relocate inside of the US proper. Hollywood would naturally crumble as new movies could not be shown in US Theaters until a trade treaty would be ratified which could take some time.

Finally, how is your economy going to look if you have to pay a large tariff to move goods into the rest of the US?

By all means, let them go.

[Orogun01]

 

 

 

Pros and cons of California.

If California seceded from America, I'd imagine they'd have a very hard time.

First off, the jobs there are American jobs and a lot of the tech would be considered American. Very good possibility they'd have to start from scratch or else everything they are currently working on would result in a massive landslide of being sued.

Then from scratch, they'd have to find their roads, wouldn't have access to snap and all those goodies, the tolls going INTO California and such.

TBH I don't think they would have it as good as they think they would.

Course could be wrong as I have been many of times before.

 

I'm pretty sure Google, Apple, all the movies studios, HP, Tesla, etc. are not owned by the US in any way. That would kind of violate the entire model of capitalism. And considering a lot of these tech companies make their stuff in China, an independent California would probably have no trouble negotiating trade deals. Plus the port of LA is the largest trade port in terms of dollars in the world. Basically it would be a major loss for the US, but it doesn't really matter because it isn't going to happen. Anyone who wants it is delusional and is too caught up in political rhetoric to recognize basic economics. 

 

California loves the idea though, like a scorned wife that keep saying that she'll leave. 

 

Even if they are a big producer without a market they can't make profits and the US is a large consumer market.

 

I would argue states like Texas play the old " I want to secede from the  USA card " more regularly than Cali ?

 

The reason why Texas talks so much about it is because they are actually legally allowed to secede from the US. As part of their deal of surrender during the Civil War they have the right to do exactly just that whenever they feel like it.

[Volourn]

Right. 'Treaties'. Trust me, if Texas leaves they'll be attacked just like the last time.

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

 

Pros and cons of California.

If California seceded from America, I'd imagine they'd have a very hard time.

First off, the jobs there are American jobs and a lot of the tech would be considered American. Very good possibility they'd have to start from scratch or else everything they are currently working on would result in a massive landslide of being sued.

Then from scratch, they'd have to find their roads, wouldn't have access to snap and all those goodies, the tolls going INTO California and such.

TBH I don't think they would have it as good as they think they would.

Course could be wrong as I have been many of times before.

 

I'm pretty sure Google, Apple, all the movies studios, HP, Tesla, etc. are not owned by the US in any way. That would kind of violate the entire model of capitalism. And considering a lot of these tech companies make their stuff in China, an independent California would probably have no trouble negotiating trade deals. Plus the port of LA is the largest trade port in terms of dollars in the world. Basically it would be a major loss for the US, but it doesn't really matter because it isn't going to happen. Anyone who wants it is delusional and is too caught up in political rhetoric to recognize basic economics. 

 

California loves the idea though, like a scorned wife that keep saying that she'll leave. 

 

Even if they are a big producer without a market they can't make profits and the US is a large consumer market.

 

I would argue states like Texas play the old " I want to secede from the  USA card " more regularly than Cali ?

 

The reason why Texas talks so much about it is because they are actually legally allowed to secede from the US. As part of their deal of surrender during the Civil War they have the right to do exactly just that whenever they feel like it.

 

That cant be true? Do you have links so I read it myself ....Im not being rude I just find that incongruous 

[BruceVC]

Kalifornia is a symbol of crying ineffective Liberal policy. Sure, it has some good qualities but the non stop bellyachching and arrogance and self righteousness ruins everything. I mean, they get all judgemental but, again, this is a state (the only state/NA place) that is literally always lacking water. LMAO

 

Also, it has too many surfer dudes and wannabe actors. And, the actors they do get actually think people care about them outside of them being entertainers.  HINT: I can like your movies and tv shows and still think your opinion means crap. Though, they aren't alone in having arrogant celebrities. Just ask the poor state who has Stephen King. My favorite writer but can be an absolute bonehead with his silly pandering idiotic delusional political beliefs.

 

Also, I have the same message for Kalifornia as I do for Texas or Quebec in my own country when they threaten to leave; JUST DO IT. Get the hell out if you don't want to be here. I don't believe in slavery so I ain't gonna force ya to stay. But, I won't beg you to stay if you don't want.  You ain't that important or needed.

volo you sound very bitter about California, its a similar temperament to when you hear  those stories about some young  starry eyed Canadian women leaves Canada with dreams of becoming an actor in Hollywood....but once arriving in Hollywood her dreams are dashed as she cannot find work and ends up working in the Porn industry but pretending to her friends and family in Canada she has a real acting job, you know that can make a person bitter  ....did that happen to you ?

 

Be honest ...no judgement here 

Edited January 28, 2017 by BruceVC

[HoonDing]

I'm actually rewatching The O.C atm.

[BruceVC]

I'm actually rewatching The O.C atm.

You really shouldnt watch that show, its racist and sexist ...it will rot your brain and maybe you could become reticent and cynical 

[Ben No.3]

 

It's just such a weird sentiment to WANT California to leave. I mean, as you type it on your computer, or maybe on your fancy smart phone. Or as you enjoy your fruits and vegetables. Or as you watch your entertainment. Sure, California is the source of all the US's problems. Right-o.

From my point of view, it's the source of all of US's political problems, or most of them anyway. It was fine when it was Republican, or even a swing state, but now it's an evil, lawless Democrat empire.

A lawLESS empire? I thought the problem with the left was that they regulate the economy too much

[Hurlshort]

You know, we haven't even covered the whole torture stuff that the President keeps talking about. Yikes.

[Darkpriest]

Sethrida Geagea

 

 

 

wait, what happened? No Ivanka?

[Keyrock]

wait, what happened? No Ivanka?

 

Don't worry, I haven't forgotten about Ivanka.  I'm just adding a bit of variety.

 

[Rosbjerg]

It wasn't meant as an encouragement to spam women in the thread.

[Chilloutman]

Keyrock, post some handsome man politician so we get these equality quotas so we can continue

[Gfted1]

CA can barely flush their toilets. We would have them by the balls on water rights alone. If its yellow, let it mellow indeed. 

 

Not that I want them to leave anyway. My time spent there while in the Navy was fantastic. Beautiful climates, beautful people, a little too head-up-own-bum but otherwise a very nice place.

[Keyrock]

Keyrock, post some handsome man politician so we get these equality quotas so we can continue

I planned to do that anyway.  I'm all about catering to different demographics.  We can't have just attractive women to break up the pointless bickering in this thread. 

 

Jigme Khesar Namgyel Wangchuck

 

 

Bonus extra many shot of him with a compound bow

 

Dat hair tho.  As a balding man I'm jealous as ****.

Edited January 28, 2017 by Keyrock

[Hurlshort]

CA can barely flush their toilets. We would have them by the balls on water rights alone. If its yellow, let it mellow indeed. 

 

Not that I want them to leave anyway. My time spent there while in the Navy was fantastic. Beautiful climates, beautful people, a little too head-up-own-bum but otherwise a very nice place.

 

I'm not really sure where that idea comes from either, we aren't shipping in water from other states. There are plenty of disputes about how we use the water we have, and how we manage droughts, but the majority of the state is self-sufficient. The biggest dispute would be the use of the Colorado River. Now Colorado could turn the spigot off, which would hurt SoCal, but then we go back to the fruits and veggies that the rest of the country loves so much. Cut off your nose to spite your face, I suppose.

 

[BruceVC]

You know, we haven't even covered the whole torture stuff that the President keeps talking about. Yikes.

I have been following this on various mediums, I am not trying to undermine the point but its important to understand the context around what Trump said 

 

• In an interview it all started where he said something like " ISIS is the most brutal group the world has ever seen. They behead and crucify christians and kill and rape indiscriminately...so if you ask me is waterboarding acceptable I say yes ".....I agree with Trump on this, why are we concerned about extending a group like ISIS  any humanity or civil rights ?
• As usual Trump differs to experts, he is leaving this up to Mattis who is opposed to torture

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-torture-works-theresa-may-washington-white-house-a7550316.html

[Gfted1]

The biggest dispute would be the use of the Colorado River. Now Colorado could turn the spigot off, which would hurt SoCal, but then we go back to the fruits and veggies that the rest of the country loves so much. Cut off your nose to spite your face, I suppose.

That's a bit of an understatement.

 

Assuming this link is accurate: Colorado River Water Users Association

 

 

 

The Colorado River is a vital link in sustaining the economy of Southern California -- water for irrigation, water for cities and hydroelectric power for both. Today it supplies about 65 percent -- and by the turn of the century, still as much as 55 percent -- of the total water used south of the Tehachapi Mountains, from the Pacific Ocean to the river.

 

[Darkpriest]

Meh give me a burger over some overrated fancy fruit dish

[Elerond]

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/28/us/refugees-detained-at-us-airports-prompting-legal-challenges-to-trumps-immigration-order.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share&_r=0

 

President Trump’s executive order closing the nation’s borders to refugees was put into immediate effect on Friday night. Refugees who were airborne on flights on the way to the United States when the order was signed were stopped and detained at airports.

The detentions prompted legal challenges as lawyers representing two Iraqis held at Kennedy Airport filed a writ of habeas corpus early Saturday in the Eastern District of New York seeking to have their clients released. At the same time, they filed a motion for class certification, in an effort to represent all refugees and immigrants who they said were being unlawfully detained at ports of entry.

...

The lawyers said that one of the Iraqis detained at Kennedy Airport, Hameed Khalid Darweesh, had worked on behalf of the United States government in Iraq for 10 years. The other, Haider Sameer Abdulkhaleq Alshawi, was coming to the United States to join his wife, who had worked for an American contractor, and young son, the lawyers said. They said both men had been detained at the airport on Friday night after arriving on separate flights.

The lawyers said they had not been allowed to meet with their clients, and there were tense moments as they tried to reach them.

“Who is the person we need to talk to?” asked one of the lawyers, Mark Doss, a supervising attorney at the International Refugee Assistance Project.

“Mr. President,” said a Customs and Border Protection agent, who declined to identify himself. “Call Mr. Trump.”

[Hurlshort]

 

That's a bit of an understatement.

 

Assuming this link is accurate: Colorado River Water Users Association

 

 

 

The Colorado River is a vital link in sustaining the economy of Southern California -- water for irrigation, water for cities and hydroelectric power for both. Today it supplies about 65 percent -- and by the turn of the century, still as much as 55 percent -- of the total water used south of the Tehachapi Mountains, from the Pacific Ocean to the river.

 

 

 

Yes but:

 

1. The Colorado River runs through California. 

2. South of the Tehachapi is a pretty small part of the state as a whole. 

 

Right now a bunch of states share water rights along the river. It is unlikely they would abandon that relationship for any reason. Unless you think California will suddenly become an enemy state or something.

[Hurlshort]

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/28/us/refugees-detained-at-us-airports-prompting-legal-challenges-to-trumps-immigration-order.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share&_r=0

 

 

Jesus. Land of the free?