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Chelsea Manning Sentence Commuted


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From the looks of it, it seems like there's some dealings going on in the background about Snowden and Assange.

"Some men see things as they are and say why?"
"I dream things that never were and say why not?"
- George Bernard Shaw

"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

 

"The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."

- Some guy 

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I saw this development earlier and I'm a little conflicted, she did betray her country but were there mitigating circumstances....is this pardon warranted ? But no clemency for Snowden, thats a different situation IMO 

Edited by BruceVC

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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This is appalling patriarchy in action. Just because she's now a woman doesn't mean she couldn't have served the sentence she got when she was a man. There's no doubt in my mind that she would have actually served her time better now, but she was robbed the chance to show everybody that women are better than men, because powers that be, i.e. patriarchy, got scared.

Edited by kirottu

This post is not to be enjoyed, discussed, or referenced on company time.

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Forgot the reasons why everyone said he was at risk of death, will check it later. Still served a decent amount of time and wasn't exactly treated nicely over that time, so he still got some punishment.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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Forgot the reasons why everyone said he was at risk of death, will check it later. Still served a decent amount of time and wasn't exactly treated nicely over that time, so he still got some punishment.

 

I think that he attempted to do suicide a few times.

"Some men see things as they are and say why?"
"I dream things that never were and say why not?"
- George Bernard Shaw

"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

 

"The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."

- Some guy 

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Correct me if I'm wrong here... and this is inconsequential to the story... isn't "Chelsea" Manning a man in drag? As far as I'm aware isn't all the XY plumbing still in place?

 

If I put on a superman suit it does not make me able to fly.

"If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men"

- St. Francis of Assisi

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Another thing. The President is willing to commute Manning's sentence after releasing information about what his administration was doing abroad. But not Snowden who leaked what he was doing right here to the American people.

 

I might be crazy but I've always gotten this vibe from Barack Obama that he felt he real enemies were not in Russia, or China, or the Middle East. It always seemed like the people he thought were the real enemies were right here in the US.

 

Of course his administration telling the police to keep an eye one me and people like me in 2009 because we were likely terrorists might have colored my view on that.

"If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men"

- St. Francis of Assisi

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Correct me if I'm wrong here... and this is inconsequential to the story... isn't "Chelsea" Manning a man in drag? As far as I'm aware isn't all the XY plumbing still in place?

 

If I put on a superman suit it does not make me able to fly.

No :)

 

He went hormone treatment and  gender reassignment surgery so reshaping the male genitals  into the shape and function of a vagina. He effectively becomes she....why GD  do you think she is hot and feel guilty? Its okay, no judgement on this forums  :biggrin:

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Correct me if I'm wrong here... and this is inconsequential to the story... isn't "Chelsea" Manning a man in drag? As far as I'm aware isn't all the XY plumbing still in place?

 

If I put on a superman suit it does not make me able to fly.

 

My understanding is that she's not received the gender reassignment surgery; although I believe (but could be wrong) a federal court ruled that prison couldn't block gender reassignment (I seem to recall that she's on hormone treatment since 2015), I believe the logistical questions of how the surgery would be provided (as the military isn't equipped to provide it in house) and what to do with her afterwards were still questions now side-stepped by the commuting of the sentence. 

 

Another thing. The President is willing to commute Manning's sentence after releasing information about what his administration was doing abroad. But not Snowden who leaked what he was doing right here to the American people.

 

The rationale I heard was that Snowden didn't face the US justice system and either stand exonerated as a legitimate whistleblower (his claim) or convicted of treason (the state's claim), instead fleeing the justice system to Russia.  Manning faced the justice system, was dealt with fairly and accepted her culpability in what happened.  It probably also helped that the 35 year sentence has been deemed by many with knowledge of such things to be out of proportion with sentences given for similar action in the past.

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Particulars notwithstanding, "presidential" pardons are an anachronism that is difficult to justify today.

 

Good for Manning, but I think the government more than made its point already.

- When he is best, he is a little worse than a man, and when he is worst, he is little better than a beast.

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David Burge

‏@iowahawkblog

Hacker's pre-check list before sending information to Wikileaks:

OK: US battlefield comms on troop strength and position

Treason: DNC emails

 

 

David Burge

‏@iowahawkblog David Burge Retweeted The New York Times

Hey errbody, it's Handing-Classified-Secrets-To-Wikileaks-And-Russian-Spies-Is-Suddenly-Okay-Again Tuesday

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How is it OK when he was in jail for 7 years?

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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David Burge

‏@iowahawkblog

 

That guy's butthurt spat with Bill Ayers and his lame bomb jokes were equal parts fun and sad. Trying to get under someone's skin using something that happened over 40 years ago? Better not remind him that the US lost in Vietnam, I guess.

 

Haha, what a tool.

- When he is best, he is a little worse than a man, and when he is worst, he is little better than a beast.

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7 years seems like a pretty long sentence for someone who is clearly mentally unstable and is more in need of psychiatric care than prison.

This is true, this is what she said 

 

“I need help,” she wrote. “I am living through a cycle of anxiety, anger, hopelessness, loss, and depression. I cannot focus. I cannot sleep. I attempted to take my own life.”

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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I can feel sympathy for Manning because of the bullying, messed up family, and psychological issues. Not sure I agree with commuting the sentence though. There's plenty of other messed up individuals in prison.

Edited by rjshae

"It has just been discovered that research causes cancer in rats."

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How is it OK when he was in jail for 7 years?

She had to face some sentence, you cant be an intelligence analyst in any army and then distribute confidential cables and information. But 35 years was a bit harsh 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Correct me if I'm wrong here... and this is inconsequential to the story... isn't "Chelsea" Manning a man in drag? As far as I'm aware isn't all the XY plumbing still in place?

 

If I put on a superman suit it does not make me able to fly.

No :)

 

He went hormone treatment and  gender reassignment surgery so reshaping the male genitals  into the shape and function of a vagina. He effectively becomes she....why GD  do you think she is hot and feel guilty? Its okay, no judgement on this forums  :biggrin:

 

:lol:  Ummm.... no

 

I was actually thinking of the use of feminine pronouns when referring to a man. If you could actually turn a horse into a zebra I'd call it a zebra. But painting black and white stripes on a horse won't make it a zebra. I will admit I am annoyed by the whole touchy feely "I identify as a woman so call me she" b------t. A thing is what it is. 2+2=4 no matter how anyone feels about it.

 

I feel like I'm the King of England so I want all of you to refer to me as Your Majesty from now on. But even if you did when I show up at Buckingham in a U-Haul I'll be in for a disappointment. 

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"If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men"

- St. Francis of Assisi

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Correct me if I'm wrong here... and this is inconsequential to the story... isn't "Chelsea" Manning a man in drag? As far as I'm aware isn't all the XY plumbing still in place?

 

If I put on a superman suit it does not make me able to fly.

 

My understanding is that she's not received the gender reassignment surgery; although I believe (but could be wrong) a federal court ruled that prison couldn't block gender reassignment (I seem to recall that she's on hormone treatment since 2015), I believe the logistical questions of how the surgery would be provided (as the military isn't equipped to provide it in house) and what to do with her afterwards were still questions now side-stepped by the commuting of the sentence. 

 

Another thing. The President is willing to commute Manning's sentence after releasing information about what his administration was doing abroad. But not Snowden who leaked what he was doing right here to the American people.

 

The rationale I heard was that Snowden didn't face the US justice system and either stand exonerated as a legitimate whistleblower (his claim) or convicted of treason (the state's claim), instead fleeing the justice system to Russia.  Manning faced the justice system, was dealt with fairly and accepted her culpability in what happened.  It probably also helped that the 35 year sentence has been deemed by many with knowledge of such things to be out of proportion with sentences given for similar action in the past.

 

I guess the rationale on Snowden makes sense. As for Manning the commutation might have just saved the taxpayers the cost of cutting his manhood off so kudos to the President on the cost saving move!

"If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men"

- St. Francis of Assisi

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:lol:  Ummm.... no

 

I was actually thinking of the use of feminine pronouns when referring to a man. If you could actually turn a horse into a zebra I'd call it a zebra. But painting black and white stripes on a horse won't make it a zebra. I will admit I am annoyed by the whole touchy feely "I identify as a woman so call me she" b------t. A thing is what it is. 2+2=4 no matter how anyone feels about it.

 

I feel like I'm the King of England so I want all of you to refer to me as Your Majesty from now on. But even if you did when I show up at Buckingham in a U-Haul I'll be in for a disappointment.

 

However, if you were legitimately in the process of becoming the King of England, you would still be granted an honorific to reflect that status.  Arguably Chelsea has done more than state "I identify as a woman..." bit through medical and psychological treatment, even if the operation itself is still in her future.

 

 

 

 

I guess the rationale on Snowden makes sense. As for Manning the commutation might have just saved the taxpayers the cost of cutting his manhood off so kudos to the President on the cost saving move!

 

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By what standard was it harsh?

You are going to think this is an excuse or justification but she was deeply conflicted and depressed about her sexual orientation, that should have been considered surly ?

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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