Should the UK leave the EU?

[Mamoulian War]

 

"Maybe not, but it is the perception that EU does that matters."

 

Sure, that's why either you don't hold referenda on such complex matters or you use a 2/3 majority.

 

Why not?  Better than the the undemocratic EU that is run by unelected, appointed officials, i.e., the European Commission in particular, who  routinely  overturn local laws passed by locally elected officials.

 

 

Yeah Yeah, Because House of Lords in UK is full of elected individuals

 

ROFLMAO

[ktchong]

 

 

Yes, because wikipedia is the right place to link to

 

/facepalm

 

So you think Wikipedia just created those cases out of thin air? That none of those rape cases happened and Wikipedia made them up?  BTW, those are all cases that have been investigated, put on trial, and the Muslim rapists were convicted. So it was not like Wikipedia just invented them.

 

 

Because raping is solely a muslim business .... riiiiiiiiiiiight... give me a break...   *sighs*

 

 

Rape gangs and sexual grooming are Muslim businesses.  I have not heard of any other demographic group that do those things on such a large scale.  For example: Chinese or Koreans do not have rape gangs targeting white women.  Chinese or Koreans do not groom little girl for sexual slavery.  Yet we keep reading about how Muslims - in particularly Pakistanis (who are unfortunately called "Asians" by the British media) - consistently commit those atrocities.

 

It is a Muslim thing, because I remember when I was in college in the late 1990s, Muslims in Indonesia (whom Obama used as the examples of "moderate Muslims") were targeting local Chinese women for gang rape.  I still remember a bunch of Indonesia Chinese women in my university who were granted immediately asylum by the US government due to the incident.  For me, the pattern of how Muslims act and behave is clear.

 

 

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1998_riots_of_Indonesia

Edited June 25, 2016 by ktchong

[Mamoulian War]

 

 

 

Yes, because wikipedia is the right place to link to

 

/facepalm

 

So you think Wikipedia just created those cases out of thin air? That none of those rape cases happened and Wikipedia made them up?  BTW, those are all cases that have been investigated, put on trial, and the Muslim rapists were convicted. So it was not like Wikipedia just invented them.

 

 

Because raping is solely a muslim business .... riiiiiiiiiiiight... give me a break...   *sighs*

 

 

Rape gangs and sexual grooming are Muslim businesses.  I have not heard of any other demographic group that do those things on such a large scale.  For example: Chinese or Koreans do not have rape gangs targeting white women.  Chinese or Koreans do not groom little girl for sexual slavery.  Yet we keep reading about how Muslims - in particularly Pakistanis (who are unfortunately called "Asians" by the British media) - consistently commit those atrocities.

 

 

Here you have and example of Christian performed gang rape

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/05/27/dozens-of-men-took-part-in-the-gang-rape-of-a-brazilian-teen-the-the-video-made-it-online/

[ktchong]

 

 

 

 

Yes, because wikipedia is the right place to link to

 

/facepalm

 

So you think Wikipedia just created those cases out of thin air? That none of those rape cases happened and Wikipedia made them up?  BTW, those are all cases that have been investigated, put on trial, and the Muslim rapists were convicted. So it was not like Wikipedia just invented them.

 

 

Because raping is solely a muslim business .... riiiiiiiiiiiight... give me a break...   *sighs*

 

 

Rape gangs and sexual grooming are Muslim businesses.  I have not heard of any other demographic group that do those things on such a large scale.  For example: Chinese or Koreans do not have rape gangs targeting white women.  Chinese or Koreans do not groom little girl for sexual slavery.  Yet we keep reading about how Muslims - in particularly Pakistanis (who are unfortunately called "Asians" by the British media) - consistently commit those atrocities.

 

 

Here you have and example of Christian performed gang rape

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/05/27/dozens-of-men-took-part-in-the-gang-rape-of-a-brazilian-teen-the-the-video-made-it-online/

 

 

Which is actually uncommon.

 

As I said:

 

 

I was reading on Wikipedia about the series of Rotherham child rape committed by Muslims against British women.  Then I reached the end of the article and see a list of similar rape cases - all committed by Muslims (mostly Pakistani Muslims) against the local white women.   The Muslim rape gang problem in the UK (or just in Europe in general) is just like the mass shooting problem in the US - i.e., they have common occurences.  Except in the UK and Europe, the government and the media have long  refused to report the rape cases due to political correctness and fear of being labeled as racist and Islamophobic (until the recent Colonge incident in Germany, which has really changed climate in Europe.)    

 

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal#See_also

 

Which is a pattern.  Which is a culture of Islam.

 

FYI: the founder of Islam himself was a bandit warlord in his late life who was going around pillaging, plundring, raping and abducting women as sex slaves.  That was what Mohammad did.  That is what Islam was founded on.  And that is what Islam is.   Mohammad was a brutal warlord; he was not a hippy who renounced violence and went around preaching non-violence; he was not a prince who renounced power and wealth to pursue enlightenment.  Mohammad was not a peaceful man in his life.  So what makes you think Islam is any different from the behaviors of its founder?

Edited June 25, 2016 by ktchong

[Mamoulian War]

And what do you think Christian UN soldiers have done in Kosovo or Allies soldiers in Germany during World War 2?

[ktchong]

And what do you think Christian UN soldiers have done in Kosovo or Allies soldiers in Germany during World War 2?

 

In time of war, murders and rapes become common occurences.  That is how wars are.

 

So, are you saying Muslims living in Europe are waging a war on Europeans?   That certainly seems like it.  I suppose that is why people are saying Muslims in Europe are waging a Rape "Jihad" on Europeans.

Edited June 25, 2016 by ktchong

[Mamoulian War]

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, because wikipedia is the right place to link to

 

/facepalm

 

So you think Wikipedia just created those cases out of thin air? That none of those rape cases happened and Wikipedia made them up?  BTW, those are all cases that have been investigated, put on trial, and the Muslim rapists were convicted. So it was not like Wikipedia just invented them.

 

 

Because raping is solely a muslim business .... riiiiiiiiiiiight... give me a break...   *sighs*

 

 

Rape gangs and sexual grooming are Muslim businesses.  I have not heard of any other demographic group that do those things on such a large scale.  For example: Chinese or Koreans do not have rape gangs targeting white women.  Chinese or Koreans do not groom little girl for sexual slavery.  Yet we keep reading about how Muslims - in particularly Pakistanis (who are unfortunately called "Asians" by the British media) - consistently commit those atrocities.

 

 

Here you have and example of Christian performed gang rape

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/05/27/dozens-of-men-took-part-in-the-gang-rape-of-a-brazilian-teen-the-the-video-made-it-online/

 

 

Which is actually uncommon.

 

As I said:

 

 

I was reading on Wikipedia about the series of Rotherham child rape committed by Muslims against British women.  Then I reached the end of the article and see a list of similar rape cases - all committed by Muslims (mostly Pakistani Muslims) against the local white women.   The Muslim rape gang problem in the UK (or just in Europe in general) is just like the mass shooting problem in the US - i.e., they have common occurences.  Except in the UK and Europe, the government and the media have long  refused to report the rape cases due to political correctness and fear of being labeled as racist and Islamophobic (until the recent Colonge incident in Germany, which has really changed climate in Europe.)    

 

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal#See_also

 

Which is a pattern.  Which is a culture of Islam.

 

FYI: the founder of Islam himself was a bandit warlord in his late life who was going around pillaging, plundring, raping and abducting women as sex slaves.  That was what Mohammad did.  That is what Islam was founded on.  And that is what Islam is.   Mohammad was a brutal warlord; he was not a hippy who renounced violence and went around preaching non-violence; he was not a prince who renounced power and wealth to pursue enlightenment.  Mohammad was not a peaceful man in his life.  So what makes you think Islam is any different from the behaviors of its founder?

 

 

 

Ok let's judge now all Christians by Bible verses, too:

 

You may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT

 

Whosoever … hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God. For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach: a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose, or any thing superfluous, Or a man that is brokenfooted, or brokenhanded, Or crookback, or a dwarf, or that hath a blemish in his eye, or be scurvy, or scabbed, or hath his stones broken … He shall not go in unto the vail, nor come nigh unto the altar, because he hath a blemish; that he profane not my sanctuaries. Leviticus 21:17-23 KJV

 

But if [a girl wasn't a virgin on her wedding night] and evidence of the girl's virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her father’s house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against God’s people by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst.  Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB

Edited June 25, 2016 by Mamoulian War

[Malcador]

Still amused at this independence talk by the English of all people. Not only of it being overdramatic by a small power but just from history's view

 

Shame the next time I visit the lady in the sandwich shop will be a scummy chav rather than a cute Pole.

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

 

Uh oh Brits... now look what you've done! http://www.vocativ.com/333176/calls-for-texas-independence-surge-in-wake-of-brexit-vote/

I was hoping for this

 

 

Why would you  be hoping for this, Texas is never going to secede  from the USA....surly people arent serious about this?

 

I'm willing to give Trump a chance to fix things before we secede.

 

 

 

 

 

Uh oh Brits... now look what you've done! http://www.vocativ.com/333176/calls-for-texas-independence-surge-in-wake-of-brexit-vote/

They don't get to leave. The US will remain united until the end of history.

 

I'm just very surprised that it's Texas and not the South lol

 

Been there... done that... didn't work out so good.

 

Actually in all seriousness, state secession COULD actually happen but it would be precipitated by some very heavy handed action by the Federal Government. As in a lot more than anything Barack Obama even considered doing. I'm no fan of Obama's it's true. But he is not the tyrant that suspends the Constitution and starts ordering Americans in death FEMA camps. Neither is Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump for that matter. It would take something like that to do it.

 

It might just take banning all guns, which is something Obola would dearly love to do, and which Dems will be able to do if they get one more seat on the Supreme Court. Our governor already said "Come and take it".

 

 

 

 

"Maybe not, but it is the perception that EU does that matters."

 

Sure, that's why either you don't hold referenda on such complex matters or you use a 2/3 majority.

 

Why not?  Better than the the undemocratic EU that is run by unelected, appointed officials, i.e., the European Commission in particular, who  routinely  overturn local laws passed by locally elected officials.

 

 

Yeah Yeah, Because House of Lords in UK is full of elected individuals

 

ROFLMAO

 

This is exactly why the Brits shouldn't be made to comply with the wishes of East Europeons. Edited June 25, 2016 by Wrath of Dagon

[Mamoulian War]

Or dear ktchong, speaking of Gang rape:

 

Judges 19:22-30

 

 Now as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, beset the house round about, and beat at the door, and spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him.

   And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, nay, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into mine house, do not this folly. Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing.  But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go.  Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light.  And her lord rose up in the morning, and opened the doors of the house, and went out to go his way: and, behold, the woman his concubine was fallen down at the door of the house, and her hands were upon the threshold.  And he said unto her, Up, and let us be going. But none answered. Then the man took her up upon an ass, and the man rose up, and gat him unto his place.  And when he was come into his house, he took a knife, and laid hold on his concubine, and divided her, together with her bones, into twelve pieces, and sent her into all the coasts of Israel.  And it was so, that all that saw it said, There was no such deed done nor seen from the day that the children of Israel came up out of the land of Egypt unto this day: consider of it, take advice, and speak your minds.

[Valsuelm]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, because wikipedia is the right place to link to

 

/facepalm

 

So you think Wikipedia just created those cases out of thin air? That none of those rape cases happened and Wikipedia made them up?  BTW, those are all cases that have been investigated, put on trial, and the Muslim rapists were convicted. So it was not like Wikipedia just invented them.

 

 

Because raping is solely a muslim business .... riiiiiiiiiiiight... give me a break...   *sighs*

 

 

Rape gangs and sexual grooming are Muslim businesses.  I have not heard of any other demographic group that do those things on such a large scale.  For example: Chinese or Koreans do not have rape gangs targeting white women.  Chinese or Koreans do not groom little girl for sexual slavery.  Yet we keep reading about how Muslims - in particularly Pakistanis (who are unfortunately called "Asians" by the British media) - consistently commit those atrocities.

 

 

Here you have and example of Christian performed gang rape

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/05/27/dozens-of-men-took-part-in-the-gang-rape-of-a-brazilian-teen-the-the-video-made-it-online/

 

 

Which is actually uncommon.

 

As I said:

 

 

I was reading on Wikipedia about the series of Rotherham child rape committed by Muslims against British women.  Then I reached the end of the article and see a list of similar rape cases - all committed by Muslims (mostly Pakistani Muslims) against the local white women.   The Muslim rape gang problem in the UK (or just in Europe in general) is just like the mass shooting problem in the US - i.e., they have common occurences.  Except in the UK and Europe, the government and the media have long  refused to report the rape cases due to political correctness and fear of being labeled as racist and Islamophobic (until the recent Colonge incident in Germany, which has really changed climate in Europe.)    

 

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_scandal#See_also

 

Which is a pattern.  Which is a culture of Islam.

 

FYI: the founder of Islam himself was a bandit warlord in his late life who was going around pillaging, plundring, raping and abducting women as sex slaves.  That was what Mohammad did.  That is what Islam was founded on.  And that is what Islam is.   Mohammad was a brutal warlord; he was not a hippy who renounced violence and went around preaching non-violence; he was not a prince who renounced power and wealth to pursue enlightenment.  Mohammad was not a peaceful man in his life.  So what makes you think Islam is any different from the behaviors of its founder?

 

 

 

Ok let's judge now all Christians by Bible verses, too:

 

You may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT

 

 

Apples and Oranges at best.

 

a) Leviticus is Old Testament. Most Christian denominations put oodles more emphasis on the New Testament than the Old, if they even refer much to the Old at all. Hence they are Christians, not Jews.

b) It was Christian nations that abolished slavery (the overt form anyways) first within their own nations, and then campaigned to abolish it worldwide. Not Muslim, not Jewish, not Animist, Buddhist, Hindu, or whatever else. Christians.

c) It was almost exclusively Christians (albeit not all of them, for quite some time), mostly of the Protestant flavor that fought tirelessly, bled, and died for the liberties which you now enjoy. Not Muslims, Not Jews, not Animists, Buddhists, Hindus, or whatever else. Christians.

d) Actions speak louder than words. There is indeed a problem with many of the immigrants in Europe, as well as elsewhere. Many of these problems are via Muslims.

e) Actions speak louder than words. If a book you believe in to at least some degree saying to do X or X is ok is one thing, actually doing it yourself is another.

f) Many modern Muslims do indeed believe they are at war with 'the west' and Christianity. Some of them do live within the borders of western nations. That is a problem. Likewise it would be a problem if the roles were reversed (and occasionally they have been).

 

I could go on... possibly all the way through the alphabet even.... but, the point should already be made.

[Mamoulian War]

 

 

 

Apples and Oranges at best.

 

a) Leviticus is Old Testament. Most Christian denominations put oodles more emphasis on the New Testament than the Old, if they even refer much to the Old at all. Hence they are Christians, not Jews.

b) It was Christian nations that abolished slavery (the overt form anyways) first within their own nations, and then campaigned to abolish it worldwide. Not Muslim, not Jewish, not Animist, Buddhist, Hindu, or whatever else. Christians.

c) It was almost exclusively Christians (albeit not all of them, for quite some time), mostly of the Protestant flavor that fought tirelessly, bled, and died for the liberties which you now enjoy. Not Muslims, Not Jews, not Animists, Buddhists, Hindus, or whatever else. Christians.

d) Actions speak louder than words. There is indeed a problem with many of the immigrants in Europe, as well as elsewhere. Many of these problems are via Muslims.

e) Actions speak louder than words. If a book you believe in to at least some degree saying to do X or X is ok is one thing, actually doing it yourself is another.

f) Many modern Muslims do indeed believe they are at war with 'the west' and Christianity. Some of them do live within the borders of western nations. That is a problem. Likewise it would be a problem if the roles were reversed (and occasionally they have been).

 

I could go on... possibly all the way through the alphabet even.... but, the point should already be made.

 

 

About Old Testament:

 

Words of Jesus:

 

Matthew 5:17-18 (NKJV) "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

 

EDIT: And one more about Old Testament:

 

Luke 16:16-17

 

The law and the prophets were until John; from that time on the kingdom of God has been proclaimed, and everyone is urgently pressed into it.

But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one stroke of a letter of the law to become invalid.

Edited June 25, 2016 by Mamoulian War

[Tel Aviv]

Bit silly this, but I find the outcome kinda depressing. No disrespect intended - I understand the reasoning of most Leave voters - but it's a bummer. We've turned our backs on refugees and the rest of the international community. Cynicism won. A sign of the times, I guess. But I can't grumble too much! It'll be an interesting few months/years/decades at least.

Edited June 25, 2016 by Tel Aviv

[redneckdevil]

 

Or dear ktchong, speaking of Gang rape:

 

Judges 19:22-30

 

Now as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, beset the house round about, and beat at the door, and spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him. And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, nay, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into mine house, do not this folly. Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing. But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go. Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light. And her lord rose up in the morning, and opened the doors of the house, and went out to go his way: and, behold, the woman his concubine was fallen down at the door of the house, and her hands were upon the threshold. And he said unto her, Up, and let us be going. But none answered. Then the man took her up upon an ass, and the man rose up, and gat him unto his place. And when he was come into his house, he took a knife, and laid hold on his concubine, and divided her, together with her bones, into twelve pieces, and sent her into all the coasts of Israel. And it was so, that all that saw it said, There was no such deed done nor seen from the day that the children of Israel came up out of the land of Egypt unto this day: consider of it, take advice, and speak your minds.

I'm lost here. Are u saying that this is an example of Christian gang rape?

[Raithe]

Bit silly this, but I find the outcome kinda depressing. No disrespect intended - I understand the reasoning of most Leave voters - but it's a bummer. We've turned our backs on refugees and the rest of the international community. Cynicism won. A sign of the times, I guess. But I can't grumble too much! It'll be an interesting few months/years/decades at least.

 

There is a point that for a chunk of the Leave group wasn't about isolationism. It was about not focusing on Europe so they could connect with the global market at large. There were a few arguments over how being in the EU prevented the UK from establishing trade connections and building other treaties with non-EU countries.  So while yes, some of the Leave was about huddling behind the borders, it wouldn't be fair to say that they all were.

[HoonDing]

Replace UK with Australia - they were in Eurovision right?

 

Also a convenient place to dump all the rapefugees.

[Mamoulian War]

 

... But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her ...

I'm lost here. Are u saying that this is an example of Christian gang rape?

Correct me if I am wrong, but to me this passage from the text seems like something very similar, to what we call in current age a gang rape.

[Meshugger]

- Google "Christian Gang Rapes" 1 800 000 results. Top three results are christian women in Pakistan getting raped by muslim men.

 

- Google "Muslim Gang Rapes" 2 310 000 results. Top three are about muslims gang raping women in Sweden, UK and the rest of Europe.

 

Those guys sure get around all over the world.

[HoonDing]

Abrahamic religions are all the same.
 

When's the last time a Buddhist gang rape happened?

[Rosbjerg]

I realize this is a hard topic not to derail with everyone's all time favorite subject "How Muslims are the reason for everything bad in the world" ...

 

But let's try shall we? 

[Meshugger]

I realize this is a hard topic not to derail with everyone's all time favorite subject "How Muslims are the reason for everything bad in the world" ...

 

But let's try shall we? 

 

Fair enough. 

 

RUUUUULE BRITANNIA, RUUUULE THE WAAAVES; BRITONS NEVER WILLLL BE SLAAAAVES!

 

amirite fellas?

[213374U]

c) It was almost exclusively Christians (albeit not all of them, for quite some time), mostly of the Protestant flavor that fought tirelessly, bled, and died for the liberties which you now enjoy. Not Muslims, Not Jews, not Animists, Buddhists, Hindus, or whatever else. Christians.

 

Historical context, please. The forward Christian thinkers that fought for religious tolerance and the separation of Church and state were a product of the aftermath of the incredibly bloody massacres that were perpetrated in Europe by Christians, for -on the surface- religious reasons, for over a hundred years. It is not possible to understand modern Western culture without the religion wars of the 16th and 17th centuries.

 

So yeah, Christians. But only after they figured out that maybe, maybe, burning the heretic, killing the mutant, purging the unclean wasn't the best way to go about it.

 

How about we try to foster the same kind of self-reflection within Islam rather than going full-on Der Stürmer at the drop of a hat?

 

---

 

Regarding the Muslim rape gangs. While appalling, it's a drop in the ocean, sadly. Look up the numbers of child sex trafficking involving Eastern Europe. Hint: the mafias controlling that trade are run by white kingpins, and directed mostly at Western European white customers.

 

edit: sure guv'nor, no more talk of Muslims. For all the good it does anyway...

Edited June 25, 2016 by 213374U

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

Uh oh Brits... now look what you've done! http://www.vocativ.com/333176/calls-for-texas-independence-surge-in-wake-of-brexit-vote/

I was hoping for this

 

 

Why would you  be hoping for this, Texas is never going to secede  from the USA....surly people arent serious about this?

 

 

You're my friend, so I'm holding this intervention out of love.

 

surly adj 1. Sullenly ill-humored; gruff

 

Surly people are always serious. Ask me how I feel about religion or Barti how he feels about mayonnaise, you will get a surly response.  

 

 

Thanks Mani, I have no issue with people correcting me who mean well and you always mean well but I want to share something interesting about these mistakes I make 

 

You may think this is just excuse but I am well aware my grammar is shocking, I still dont know the difference between their and there and at times I can see some overall structures problems in my posts

 

Its not that I dont try to make posts grammatically correct its just that its not a big deal if they not

 

For me only one thing matters when someone makes  a post  on a forum like this, can I understand them?

 

If you think about it why would anything else matter, so spelling and grammar why is that a factor?

[Meshugger]

[Nonek]

Personally I always preferred Jerusalem, or maybe something by Vaughan Williams or Elgar:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8VH0sbEU20