HBO Game of Thrones Season 6!

[Leferd]

 

 

I was talking to a guy at work about the show today. He has never read the books but he is really into the show. He is convinced Tyrion will turn out to be the third Targaryen. I have a hard time swallowing that one. The show, like the books, has laid a lot of foundation for R+L=J but Tyrion being a the 3rd Dragon seems like it would be coming out of nowhere. If any foundation has been laid for that I missed it.

There were some hints from Ser Barristan in A Dance With Dragons that the Mad King Aerys had a fancy for Tywin's wife and took certain unspecified "liberties" during the bedding ceremony. It's not much to go on but enough to fashion a theory that either Tyrion or Jaime and Cersei are actually secret Targaryen bastards.

 

It mostly focuses on Tyrion because Tywin said to him that he "is not his son" and while "he cannot prove that he isn't his son" he sure as hell can and will stop him from rightfully inheriting Casterly Rock, plus Tyrion has unusually bright blonde hair, even for a Lannister (noted as early as A Game of Thrones).

 

Tyrion being the bastard child of Aerys would be a lot less out of the left field than Aegon having been baby swapped and suddenly showing up. In the books, at least. The show dropped absolutely no hints at all so far other than Tyrion really liking dragons.

I never even considered that or even read about this theory before. Granted, I stopped reading Westeros.org and their forums well before A Dance with Dragons came out...

[majestic]

I generally avoid Westeros.org to be honest. Elio and Linda are bona fide nutjobs with a megalomaniac bent that has only gotten worse since they were allowed to contribute to A World Of Ice And Fire. Thanks, but no thanks.

 

It's one of the better fan theories. There are worse. Much worse. Like Varys being a Merman.

[Guard Dog]

 

I was talking to a guy at work about the show today. He has never read the books but he is really into the show. He is convinced Tyrion will turn out to be the third Targaryen. I have a hard time swallowing that one. The show, like the books, has laid a lot of foundation for R+L=J but Tyrion being a the 3rd Dragon seems like it would be coming out of nowhere. If any foundation has been laid for that I missed it.

 

There were some hints from Ser Barristan in A Dance With Dragons that the Mad King Aerys had a fancy for Tywin's wife and took certain unspecified "liberties" during the bedding ceremony. It's not much to go on but enough to fashion a theory that either Tyrion or Jaime and Cersei are actually secret Targaryen bastards.

 

It mostly focuses on Tyrion because Tywin said to him that he "is not his son" and while "he cannot prove that he isn't his son" he sure as hell can and will stop him from rightfully inheriting Casterly Rock, plus Tyrion has unusually bright blonde hair, even for a Lannister (noted as early as A Game of Thrones).

 

Tyrion being the bastard child of Aerys would be a lot less out of the left field than Aegon having been baby swapped and suddenly showing up. In the books, at least. The show dropped absolutely no hints at all so far other than Tyrion really liking dragons.

 

No I think Aegon is the "mummer's dragon" Quaithe warned Dany about. If he is a Targaryen at all I strongly suspect he is a Blackfyre Targaryen. But certainly not Rhegars son. There were hints in Iliyrio's comments about Varys that suggest he is connected to the Blackfyre branch. Plus GRRM went out of his way to get into the movements of the Golden Company as far back as book 3 and in book 4 starting bringing up the War of the Ninepenny Kings in a number of POV which suggests something important about it is coming up. It was the last of several Blackfyre revolts.

 

For all of you who only watch the show, see what you are missing out on? As complex as the show is, the books have a LOT more going on.  

[majestic]

Yeah, I'm a 100% positive that Aegon is the mummer's dragon, which also fits with her visions in the House of the Undying. The uncertainty here is simply the question of whether he is a mummer's dragon meaning he belongs to Varys who once was travelling with a theatre troupe or that he is fake, as in not a true Targaryen. Or maybe both.

 

If he is a Blackfyre he is only distantly related at best, unless there was some hidden heir to Maelys I. But yes, Ilyrio's comment about red and black dragons certainly suggests Aegon might be just that.

 

Oh, and I'm not entirely convinced that the "Quaithe" that Dany can see after she leaves Qarth is a real person. There is preciously little interaction between her and anyone that isn't Dany in Qarth (Jorah I think mentions that he's creeped out by her, but that's pretty much it) and Dany keeps seeing her without anyone else ever noticing or even hearing her.

 

Might just be as nuts as her father.

Edited April 28, 2016 by majestic

[Guard Dog]

I just looked it up in ADwD, Ilyrio said the Blackfyres were extinguished in the male line. It might be important that he distinguished the male line rather than just extinguished. 

[majestic]

I just looked it up in ADwD, Ilyrio said the Blackfyres were extinguished in the male line. It might be important that he distinguished the male line rather than just extinguished. 

 

There are theories that Aegon might be Illyrio's son and that his late wife was somehow related to the Blackfyres.

 

The entire storyline is a bit weird though. If Aegon is a specially groomed Blackfyre and Varys and Illyrio want him on the Throne, why bother with that entire Dothraki shenanigans? Why help Dany and Viserys in the first place?

 

I wish I could say time will tell but right now it doesn't look like all the time in the world is going to solve any of the mysteries here.

[Zoraptor]

Aegon is likely a back up in case Dany/ Visc didn't pan out. Either that or he's intended solely to sow discord for her eventual return.

 

You could solve most of the mysteries with a few monologues if GRRM wanted to. He only needs to give the characters he says knows too much (like daddy Reed) some booktime and the right person to ask questions/ talk to.

[Guard Dog]

 

 

I wish I could say time will tell but right now it doesn't look like all the time in the world is going to solve any of the mysteries here.

 

What do you mean? Book 6 is still coming.

[majestic]

In 2020 maybe.

[Vaeliorin]

The format is starting to grind on me a bit. Ever since the beginning it's been 15 mins here and 15 mins there with an occasional special episode like the siege of the wall and Kings Landing.

 

15 mins is long enough to yank you away just as you are starting to get interested in that storyline. I think I'll wait until I have a handful of episodes to catch up on.

 

That seems in keeping with what I've read of the books. It's also why I've only read about the first half of the first book. Changing characters every 5 pages does not a good reading experience make, as far as I'm concerned.

[Valsuelm]

Aegon is likely a back up in case Dany/ Visc didn't pan out. Either that or he's intended solely to sow discord for her eventual return.

 

You could solve most of the mysteries with a few monologues if GRRM wanted to. He only needs to give the characters he says knows too much (like daddy Reed) some booktime and the right person to ask questions/ talk to.

 

My money is on that conversation happening in book six, given where certain characters are heading and the direction the plot has gone.

 

In 2020 maybe.

'Winds of Winter' is looking to actually be out later this year or at the latest next. Book seven however, I'm guessing we will never see, as I frankly expect GRRM to croak before he finishes it at the rate he writes, and he's already said he's against anyone else writing anything in his world, so that precludes anyone else finishing it for him, a la Sanderson finished for Jordan.

[Guard Dog]

I figure the endings of the book and show will be very similar in the big picture. The details will be totally different but in general all the characters in the show and heading in the same direction as their book counterparts. The ultimate destination will be the same but the routes taken to get there will be very different.

[Leferd]

He is Risen.

[Guard Dog]

They are just an inch or two away from screwing up the Iron Islands plot line the same way they screwed up Dorne. If you have to abbreviate it so much that  you can't lay the foundation for who is who and what they are up to they're better off cutting it out entirely. 

 

But the rest of the episode was solid. 

 

And it looks like next week R+L=J will be addressed.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Guard Dog

[Leferd]

[Tower] O[f] Joy.

[Volourn]

Not as good as the 1st episode. The out of nowhere deaths are boring. What a waste of Roose. And, Greyjoy's  death is meaningless b/.c hard to care about a chaarcter's fate we haven't see for a few seasons. COME ON. This is storytelling 101.

 

Even Jon Snow's  expected revival was handled boringly. I should have been pumped up for this major event but it was blaisse.

 

Most of the rest of the show was good. King's Landing stuff was good, Sansa  saying goodbye to her old-new buddy, Tyrion's dealing with the dragons. All good.

 

 Yo, GOT,   surprising deathsa re good when they matter or handled well. You don't need a 'named' chaarcter to die every week to get people talk about the show.

[majestic]

They are just an inch or two away from screwing up the Iron Islands plot line the same way they screwed up Dorne. If you have to abbreviate it so much that  you can't lay the foundation for who is who and what they are up to they're better off cutting it out entirely. 

 

But the rest of the episode was solid. 

 

And it looks like next week R+L=J will be addressed.

 

The way I see it they needed the Dorne part to simply get a conflict going with the Tyrell/Lannister alliance in King's Landing, assuming there still is one, they have been curiously absent recently. Which kind of doesn't bode too well for Book!Aegon because he seems to be expendable in a way that a trashed Dorne storyline is not.

 

Euron needs to be there because Dany needs the Iron Fleet and he has a horn to do bind a dragon with. So apparently that is important enough to have her own fleet burnt down by the Harpy, which would have been completely unnecessary if they never had captured it off-screen to make Dany's decision to stay and rule more meaningful.

 

I'm not sure what the hell is going on there to be honest. It seems like George told them things they most likely need to do only after they decided to drop them from the show, particularily the Ironborn. They're also very clearly dropping characters that are of no particular use any more, like Roose, Bashir, Trystane and Hotah. I wonder if we get to see a bottle episode this season.

 

Also, hands up, who is surprised that Jon "He is really dead, we swear!" Snow is back?

 

So anyway I still really liked this episode even if it is a bit strange that Ramsay can take over like that and the resurrection ceremony that came straight out of the most tired fantasy clichés D&D could get their hands on. It does get bonus points for having SJWs knickers in a bunch because Ramsay uses Walda's baby and herself as dog feed.

 

I don't get it. Really. Book!Ramsay is just as bad, some of the things just happen "off-screen" and with implications (ahem, Fake!Arya and sex with dogs?) rather than having them happen on screen, but seriously, this is exactly what would happen to Lady Bolton and her son in the books IF Ramsay could actually come up with a way to do it. I don't think so, Book!Roose is too smart to let that happen.

Edited May 2, 2016 by majestic

[Zoraptor]

Roose was completely lol. He's supposed to be smart and calculating and goes out like an abject and utter moron. Completely out of character.

 

They probably didn't technically lie about Jon Snow being dead. He's clearly going to come back as either Jon Stark or Jon Targaryen via ToJ. Getting killed also, rather conveniently, absolves him of his Nights' Watch oath.

[Gorgon]

I was hopeful, untill I saw him all laid out like Frankenstein on the table, then it was obvious he was comming back with witch magic rather than as some sort of animal.

 

What I wouldn't give to have Charles Dance back and emo Lord Commander out.

 

Roose Bolton seemed like a thoroughly depraved individual, he was the one who orchestrated the red wedding, not someone who would not see a crude plot like that forming a mile away.

[ktchong]

If Games of Thrones was made in the 1980s...

 

Edited May 4, 2016 by ktchong

[Valsuelm]

The 80s were the best. The prevailing culture put a happy positive spin on just about everything, including incredibly dark stuff.

[Gorgon]

umm... as someone who has actually experienced the 80s I emphatically disagree with all the nostalgia. 

 

none or pathetic internet, stadium rock, converse,  svenskerhår ,  cassette tapes (those were cool though so nevermind) 

[Leferd]

Cool they took the Tower of Joy sequences word for word (going by my memory). Even if Gerold Hightower wasn't Arthur Dayne's companion, atleast he got the shout out from Pycelle. Didn't figure The Sword of the Morning to be a dual wielder.

 

Did we see Ice and Dawn?

[Volourn]

Better than episode 2. LMAO Though. John and Sansa are gonna miss each other it looks like. He leaves Castle Black this epi and she srrvives there next week. HAHAH. And, first time we see the youngest Stark and he is about to be tortured by scum. R00fles!

[ktchong]

Rickon is about to become Reekon.