Party too weak?

[baldurs_gate_2]

Atm i playing on normal difficulty and with Ranger + Lion / Fighter / Paladin / Druid with Cat / Priest.

 

But this party seems fairly weak. I'm at the woodend plains. At the bottom of this map, there are a bunch of enemies 4 Pwgra and 2 Trolls, i can not beat them. Is this normal for this game, that you meet enemies, you can not beat with the current level or am i doing somehting wrong?

 

Maybe you can give ma another party suggestion. Actually i want to get a Wizard as 6th.

[Blades of Vanatar]

What level are you? What weapons, abilities, talents and tactics are you using? Any disabling spell makes your melee team viable....

Edited December 14, 2015 by Blades of Vanatar

[baldurs_gate_2]

My ranger is level 5, all others are level 4. I'm using melee weapons with fighter / paladin and range weapons with the other members. I don't have a special tactic. I just send my fighter and paladin in, and see how the fight goes.

 

Ranger: Vicious Companion, Swift Aim, Swift and steady, Stalkers'link

Paladin: Deep Faith, flames of devotion, enduring flames

Fighter: rapid recovery, guardian stance, hold the line

Druid: Fire element, catform

Priest: Brilliant Radiance

[Boeroer]

Your level is too low, come back later. And: you need to play more tactical. You should use buffs & debuffs. But basically you're too weak to face these enemies.

[rheingold]

As said above sounds like you need a couple more levels. If I recall correctly those Pwgra's have some nasty druid spells. Bear in mind that Pillars is fairly open, once you do the stronghold you can pretty much go anywhere. Doesn't  mean you should.

There are some tough areas - and you don't really get hints that the encounters are way above your level - (which is a good thing.)

[Heijoushin]

Ha, those pwgra are lethal! Almost finished me off during my iron-man playthrough. Don't worry, I think it's normal. Just avoid them until you level up a bit. Then you come back for revenge. 

 

I don't see anything inherently wrong with your party. Though a wizard or rogue might add a little more attacking power. 

Edited December 14, 2015 by Heijoushin

[Blades of Vanatar]

Go to Raedric's Hold, Caed Nua (1st 2 levels only!) and then Defiance Bay. You will level up and get some needed tactical experience.

[PugPug]

You could also get a sixth party member.

[yupper]

I did that battle on hard a couple of days ago, level 4. I had only story companions but 6 of them. The one thing that made the battle a cake walk as opposed to a painful exercise in reloading was that I had Aloth slicken the pwgras repeatedly. My character was a fighter with a two wielder, along with Eder, and both had apprentice sneak attack. So they inflicted pretty decent damage once the pwgras were prone. Durance opened with bless, than cast suppressed afflictions against the maggots, followed by consecrated ground. Once Aloth ran out of slicken, my fighters used their knockdowns. Since you have no mage in the party, you can try having your druid CC the battle.

Edited December 15, 2015 by yupper

[Boeroer]

Good tactics. CC is king!

[baldurs_gate_2]

I did that battle on hard a couple of days ago, level 4. I had only story companions but 6 of them. The one thing that made the battle a cake walk as opposed to a painful exercise in reloading was that I had Aloth slicken the pwgras repeatedly. My character was a fighter with a two wielder, along with Eder, and both had apprentice sneak attack. So they inflicted pretty decent damage once the pwgras were prone. Durance opened with bless, than cast suppressed afflictions against the maggots, followed by consecrated ground. Once Aloth ran out of slicken, my fighters used their knockdowns. Since you have no mage in the party, you can try having your druid CC the battle.

What is "CC"?

[Gfted1]

CC = crowd control (IE: sleep, paralyze, etc.)

[baldurs_gate_2]

Yeah, i won the fight, but i could not say, the druid was any help. He is the only one, that died in that battle.

 

His tanglefoot was kinda useless.

Hold beasts does not work against them?

 

It seems, he does have not more CC spells? Maybe Nature's Mark, but that only decreases reflex by 10.

 

Druid seems kinda useless to me. Isn't it better, to get 2 Wizards instead of druid / wizard?

[Boeroer]

Depends. The wizard has some nice spells early on, that's true - but the quality of druid spells becomes better and better the higher the level. Some of the most powerful spells are druidic. Like Returning and Relentless Storm for example.

 

By the way: Hold Beast only works against, well... beasts. Like lions, bears, dragons and so on. Those guys you faced were primordial foes.

[baldurs_gate_2]

How important is survival as ability? Cuz i haven't skilled it at all.

[Blades of Vanatar]

It will help usable item duration like potions.

[Boeroer]

If you don't want to use consumables like food and potions you don't need it at all. If you want to benefit from them for a looong time, you should put points into it. You really don't need more than 4 athletics by the way. And only one char has to have a high mechanics skill. Stealth is also overrated. You don't need a lot if you don't want to sneak around every second encounter.

Lore and survival are great skills if you are willing to use scrolls and food/potions. They make the game way easier.

Edited December 15, 2015 by Boeroer

[mosspit]

How important is survival as ability? Cuz i haven't skilled it at all.

 

Useful for characters who takes alot of consumables. The good thing about Survival is that unlike Mechanics, Lore and (to a certain extent) Athletics, there isn't a hard breakpoint for Survival. Meaning to say, you don't need a specific level in Survival to utilize certain consumables. So it is pretty flexible in that regards.

 

There are some conversations that check on Survival though.

[baldurs_gate_2]

What does make more sense: Creating a charakter and get it as high as possible and then recruit your allies (i guess, you can get until level 4 b4 your stronghold solo?) or gather your party members quick?

[yupper]

Sorry, I wasn't sure if this was your first run. CC = crowd control (as Gfted1 said). There are a number of spells for mages that do this, like slicken, sleep, confusion--basically knocks out the enemy mobs and temporary takes them out of combat while your damage dealers clean up the battlefield. Mages are particularly suited for this, and you are right that druids are not great at it compared to mages. Although druids do have some fantastic area damage spells, some of which can cause stun.

 

- I've also noticed that you've specced your fighter to be a tank. Personally, I've found fighter tanks to be pretty lackluster as opponents in this game habitually run past them to attack my backrow party members. From my understanding, based on what I've read in the forum, they were much more useful as tanks prior to a particular game patch. Since then, paladins have become better suited to tanking in comparison to fighters. Particularly due to their zealous aura, it pays to make sure they are the "last person standing" on the battle field (even though my fighters are always the last ones standing in those situations due to high endurance/health and constant recovery). I now always spec my fighters to be damage dealers, either dual wield or two handed. Just a suggestion you might consider.

 

- I always pick up apprentice sneak attack for my non-rogue melee damage dealers and cipher (in fact, I even give it to my dedicated spell casters). IMHO it is one of the best talents. It's a passive talent so is always in use if your character is inflicting melee or range damage when opponents have any of the listed afflicted status. By mid game, my party is usually armed with arqebus and arbalest (all enchanted or unique by end of Act II), and the opening volley benefits from this and can take out 2 or even 3 enemies before they can react (which leads to my next suggestion).

 

- I've read that 4 athletics is sufficient for all party members (notwithstanding benefits of higher athletics for dialogue purposes, etc.), so that's pretty much what I've done with skill points distribution. I also raise all my party members stealth to at least 4 or 5. This allows me to sneak close enough to enemy mobs so I can target their backrow spell casters with my opening missile volley, which usually takes them out. After that, I will devote the remaining points to survival or lore. Lore for one front row melee party member--usually the tank, since they aren't dealing much damage anyway, might as well have them cast scrolls to do damage, heal, paralyze, etc.--and survival for melee damage dealers so they can make good use of potions of power, etc. There are enough points before reaching the level cap, such that I can do this and still max either lore or survival for each character. Only need to have one character specialize in mechanics.

 

- You can pick up all the party companions by level 4. Your character is level 2 by the time s/he leaves the tutorial dungeon, level 3 when you talk to the innkeep at the Black Hound Inn in Gilded Vale, and would be level 4 after meeting Mearwald. After you build the western barbicon, you would be able to pick up the remaining story companions, without doing any of the quests in Gilded Vale and its surrounding areas. I generally go this route if not soloing. Having a full (and well rounded) party does make combat easier. I would recommend this if this is your first playthrough.

 

- druids are great as their high level spells are pretty good (as Boeroer said), and they are "multipurpose." On my last playthrough, I dropped Aloth for Hiravias after Act I. I usually had Hiravias in the backrow casting spells and using range attacks, but whenever the party is in open space or enemy mobs manage to surround the backrow (ie teleporting spirits), I shapeshift the druid and have an instant melee damage dealer.

Edited December 15, 2015 by yupper

[baldurs_gate_2]

Sorry, I wasn't sure if this was your first run. CC = crowd control (as Gfted1 said). There are a number of spells for mages that do this, like slicken, sleep, confusion--basically knocks out the enemy mobs and temporary takes them out of combat while your damage dealers clean up the battlefield. Mages are particularly suited for this, and you are right that druids are not great at it compared to mages. Although druids do have some fantastic area damage spells, some of which can cause stun.

 

- I've also noticed that you've specced your fighter to be a tank. Personally, I've found fighter tanks to be pretty lackluster as opponents in this game habitually run past them to attack my backrow party members. From my understanding, based on what I've read in the forum, they were much more useful as tanks prior to a particular game patch. Since then, paladins have become better suited to tanking in comparison to fighters. Particularly due to their zealous aura, it pays to make sure they are the "last person standing" on the battle field (even though my fighters are always the last ones standing in those situations due to high endurance/health and constant recovery). I now always spec my fighters to be damage dealers, either dual wield or two handed. Just a suggestion you might consider.

 

- I always pick up apprentice sneak attack for my non-rogue melee damage dealers and cipher (in fact, I even give it to my dedicated spell casters). IMHO it is one of the best talents. It's a passive talent so is always in use if your character is inflicting melee or range damage when opponents have any of the listed afflicted status. By mid game, my party is usually armed with arqebus and arbalest (all enchanted or unique by end of Act II), and the opening volley benefits from this and can take out 2 or even 3 enemies before they can react (which leads to my next suggestion).

 

- I've read that 4 athletics is sufficient for all party members (notwithstanding benefits of higher athletics for dialogue purposes, etc.), so that's pretty much what I've done with skill points distribution. I also raise all my party members stealth to at least 4 or 5. This allows me to sneak close enough to enemy mobs so I can target their backrow spell casters with my opening missile volley, which usually takes them out. After that, I will devote the remaining points to survival or lore. Lore for one front row melee party member--usually the tank, since they aren't dealing much damage anyway, might as well have them cast scrolls to do damage, heal, paralyze, etc.--and survival for melee damage dealers so they can make good use of potions of power, etc. There are enough points before reaching the level cap, such that I can do this and still max either lore or survival for each character. Only need to have one character specialize in mechanics.

 

- You can pick up all the party companions by level 4. Your character is level 2 by the time s/he leaves the tutorial dungeon, level 3 when you talk to the innkeep at the Black Hound Inn in Gilded Vale, and would be level 4 after meeting Mearwald. After you build the western barbicon, you would be able to pick up the remaining story companions, without doing any of the quests in Gilded Vale and its surrounding areas. I generally go this route if not soloing. Having a full (and well rounded) party does make combat easier. I would recommend this if this is your first playthrough.

 

- druids are great as their high level spells are pretty good (as Boeroer said), and they are "multipurpose." On my last playthrough, I dropped Aloth for Hiravias after Act I. I usually had Hiravias in the backrow casting spells and using range attacks, but whenever the party is in open space or enemy mobs manage to surround the backrow (ie teleporting spirits), I shapeshift the druid and have an instant melee damage dealer.

 

With Zelous Aura you mean Zealous Endurance? Is one tank (the paladin) enough? How much CON for a tank paladin? Which talent / ability should i get with an DD Fighter? Guradian stance and hold the line are for a defensive fighter i guess. Or is it better, to get an barbarian instead?

Edited December 16, 2015 by baldurs_gate_2

[Blades of Vanatar]

Fighter abilities that draw more enemies aren't necessarily defensive. A 2-hander wielding Fighter will dish the pain out to more enemies as he won't have to chase one down after killing another. Of course it also keeps the enemy engaged instead of them slaughtering your back row squishcasters.

[yupper]

1) Any of the zealous auras will benefit the party, but either zealous endurance or barrage are the ones I find most useful. I typically go with endurance when I make the paladin a defensive tank since zealous endurance is a defensive ability. There are some items that will increase the AOE of the paladin's abilities that you can pick up in Act I. The rationale here is that since party members in the aura AOE benefit from its effects as long as the paladin is alive, you make the paladin a defensive tank so they will last as long as possible in the battle. This is particularly useful path for Pelegina since her stats makes her a poor melee damage dealer in comparison to a min/maxed fighter, and even Eder. Although her flames of devotion can ensure she holds the record for the highest or second highest single target damage well into Act II (if only using the story companions, that is), her overall cumulative damage output will never compare to a 2-handed or dual wield fighter (since flames of devotion is only 2 use per encounter), especially after fighters get armoured grace, and they will outpace her single target damage record eventually at high levels (rogues will do even higher single target damage but that is an entirely different discussion).

 

2) I would not bother with a defensive fighter build in the current patch (so would never take something like guardian stance), for all the reasons I previously listed about their lack of usefulness. At best, my fighters might spend a talent on superior deflection (and you will probably find some players who would argue it could be better spent on another talent). My rationale is that if you use a mage or even a cipher (paralysis) to CC effectively, you wouldn't need to concern yourself with all that engagement stuff. That's just my opinion though, it's your game.

 

3) barbarians are great damage dealers as well, and as Beoreor said in another thread, their damage output for the bulk of the game essentially revolves around carnage. There are a couple of cool barbarian builds you can find in this forum, and they are definitely fun to play. To maximize the damage output, you might want a weapon with reach (ie pikes like Tallgrass) so you can hit more mobs per swing.

 

I've tried barbarian (and all the classes) but still prefer fighter. Fighters are the most resilient and reliable damage dealers in this game, even if not the "best" or "most powerful." They can take damage and dish it out with almost no supervision. There have been a couple of tough dragon battles where my fighter and Eder (or just Eder, when I played a barbarian) were the only ones standing at the end of the fight. Essentially, fighters will be tanking for the party even if you don't build them as defensive tanks. At one point, I had one 2 hander fighter specialize in estoc and another specialize in great sword (so I could split the unique two handers between them), but then I had both specialize in great sword and arquebus (soldier group weapons), since there are more than enough unique great swords (ie Tidefall, Hours of St. Whatever) to go around and I don't need to switch weapon around pierce-immune blights. They were doing so much damage late game that the estoc's DR bypass was just overkill anyway.

Edited December 16, 2015 by yupper

[evilcat]

My ranger is level 5, all others are level 4. I'm using melee weapons with fighter / paladin and range weapons with the other members. I don't have a special tactic. I just send my fighter and paladin in, and see how the fight goes.

 

Ranger: Vicious Companion, Swift Aim, Swift and steady, Stalkers'link

Paladin: Deep Faith, flames of devotion, enduring flames

Fighter: rapid recovery, guardian stance, hold the line

Druid: Fire element, catform

Priest: Brilliant Radiance

 

It seems that you lack some crowd control.  So adding 6th party member with some CC would help. You can go with classic wizzard or cipher (story companions are good enought) or Barbarian with tripping weapon or Chanter with stun and pets. Generally pets are always a option to draw some agro and attacks before we snipe that casters.

 

Of course just ignoring this encounter and leveling up somewhere else (this is higher level area) is good enought.

[baldurs_gate_2]

I read some of the class builds here, but why do all builds of the ranger have the lowest perception of 3? That's for accuracy right? I don't understand that. And why such a high amount of CON? For a ranged class?