Journalism and bias in the gaming industry

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

I take back the lying accusation, you are at times guilty of spewing rhetoric and grandstanding and your opinion is sometimes woefully misinformed but that's not the same thing as intentionally lying. I believe you believe what you say is true

 

Sorry for the  misplaced lying accusation

 

 

Your apology is accepted. You may choose to believe that I spew rhetoric and grandstand, though voicing ones opinions in a clear, concise fashion is neither, however that is subjective so i'll let it pass.

 

However you accused me of pursuing a false agenda and now being woefully misinformed, please provide factual evidence to corroborate this.

 

Nonek I don't want to derail this thread with a debate that basically is just about you and me

 

But next time I see you doing it I will raise it

[Nonek]

No please provide factual evidence, or retract and apologise again.

 

Edit: You insisted that you debate only based on facts, so do so.

Edited June 9, 2015 by Nonek

[Blarghagh]

Guys, this has nothing to do with journalism, bias, sexism or whatever in the game or entertainment industry. Please tackle the ball and not the player and don't derail this any further. If you guys have personal problems, work them out in a private way like e-mail, private messages or smoke signals.

[Oerwinde]

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

[Calax]

So.. would the various articles about games refunds hurting Indie devs being full of **** be part of this situation or are we just focusing on the sexism thing?

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

So.. would the various articles about games refunds hurting Indie devs being full of **** be part of this situation or are we just focusing on the sexism thing?

It's definitely part of it.

 

Did anyone else notice that most indie devs against belong to a certain clique?

[Amentep]

 

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

 

 

Doesn't terribly look like the 1980s in the Marvel U right now.

[Calax]

 

So.. would the various articles about games refunds hurting Indie devs being full of **** be part of this situation or are we just focusing on the sexism thing?

It's definitely part of it.

 

Did anyone else notice that most indie devs against belong to a certain clique?

 

Part of me thinks that the outrage is an extension of the idea that Indie's should get something akin to a "free pass" critically because they're just starting in the industry and are where most of the innovation happens. You shouldn't be able to refund for a bad indie game because that developer still needs to eat! (etc etc)

[Oerwinde]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

Doesn't terribly look like the 1980s in the Marvel U right now.

I didn't say time passes at that rate, just that characters age at that rate.

[Nonek]

There's quite a few methods of extending game life beyond the refundable period, especially for those whom cater to the more completionist sort of gamer: Unlockable difficulty levels, achievements, required repeat runs to assure the best ending, choice and consequence so that the game can be approached in different fashions, making a game good enough that the player wishes to keep it. For instance though my playthrough time of Volgarr the Viking is now quite short, I initially took a long time to master the game, and I know that i'll occasionally return to the game from time to time.

 

I'd prefer that developers utilised some of these methods, rather than trying to overturn such a basic pro consumer right as Steam have finally implemented. Then again I expected nothing else from the anti consumer, pro corruption press.

[Amentep]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

Doesn't terribly look like the 1980s in the Marvel U right now.

I didn't say time passes at that rate, just that characters age at that rate.

Then Magneto is an 80 year old with the body of a 50 year old. It doesn't alter the problem that WWII makes him 80 (if you consider it a problem.)

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

 

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

 

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

 

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

 

Doesn't terribly look like the 1980s in the Marvel U right now.

 

I didn't say time passes at that rate, just that characters age at that rate.

 

Then Magneto is an 80 year old with the body of a 50 year old. It doesn't alter the problem that WWII makes him 80 (if you consider it a problem.)

 

Wasn't he de-aged in some arc?

[Calax]

 

Wasn't he de-aged in some arc?

 

I forget the specifics, but he got de-aged by an alien(?) and then Moira and Professor X tried to raise him "right" which failed. This was all in the 70's.

[kirottu]

 

 

 

Wow such progress. 

 

 

Hurr durr. 

Edited June 10, 2015 by kirottu

[Oerwinde]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Call me crazy, but I find retconning established history, both real world and fictitious, for the purposes of being able to include a token characters so that you can trumpet how 'diverse' your work is and show off your ethnicity checklist a heck of a lot more offensive than creating a work that does not include a diverse cast but sticks to a cohesive theme.

In my opinion, it seems a bit insulting that instead of creating an interesting character of whatever ethnicity/race(black most of the time) they insist on changing a white character into a black character. Like putting on blackface and saying that's good enough.

I notice you guys have conveniently ignored my solution to this whole Magneto issue. Why can't he be a black Jewish character? You do get black Jewish people...yes I don't think any black Jews were kept in concentration camps but its a comic...we do allow artistic licence ?

Because your solution doesn't fix the perceived problem (which is that Magneto, tied to WWII concentration camps is at least in his 80s) that led to the suggestion to move the character to the 50s/60s and anchored by the US Civil Rights movement. However, as I indicated, this only swaps an 80 year old Magneto for a 70 Year old Magneto, so the issue of age and being tied to a specific point in time is still at play.

 

There are only a handful of WWII era characters around in the Marvel U, and all of them have backstory explanations for why they aren't 80 to 90 in their physicality (Captain America - frozen in ice, Spitfire - vampire, Human Torch - Android, Winter Soldier - Kept in stasis, Namor & Namora - Atlantean Physiology, GA Vision - alien from another dimension, the remainder of The Twelve - kept in stasis, Wolverine - can't age due to regeneration, Mystique - aging irrelevant due to powers, etc).

 

There are ways to deal with this issue that doesn't require changing Magneto into a different character, though.

 

Edit: wrote "Magento" at least once. Totally different character.

Characters age in the marvel universe at a rate of 1 year every 3 years real time. Magneto is in his 50s.

Doesn't terribly look like the 1980s in the Marvel U right now.

I didn't say time passes at that rate, just that characters age at that rate.

Then Magneto is an 80 year old with the body of a 50 year old. It doesn't alter the problem that WWII makes him 80 (if you consider it a problem.)

http://marvel.wikia.com/Marvel_Time

 

Convoluted. The age rule I was referring to is called the Pryde Scale, as it was devised by taking the time between publication of two issues where Kitty Pryde stated her age, and comparing her age within the comics, and the time elapsed in real life.

[kirottu]

CNN is calling paid company promotions as "news" in a product called "Courageous".

 

I don't know why, but while reading this I got a vivid image of advertisement jingle singing: "Fun with words! Now out for journalists and children."

[BruceVC]

CNN is calling paid company promotions as "news" in a product called "Courageous".

 

I don't know why, but while reading this I got a vivid image of advertisement jingle singing: "Fun with words! Now out for journalists and children."

 

Not sure why this is an issue? Its unusual I'll give you that but CNN has many different news shows so if you have an issue with advertisers creating stories on this particular series then just don't watch it. The rest of CNN will continue to provide interesting and pertinent news stories and documentaries 

[kirottu]

 

CNN is calling paid company promotions as "news" in a product called "Courageous".

 

I don't know why, but while reading this I got a vivid image of advertisement jingle singing: "Fun with words! Now out for journalists and children."

 

Not sure why this is an issue? Its unusual I'll give you that but CNN has many different news shows so if you have an issue with advertisers creating stories on this particular series then just don't watch it. The rest of CNN will continue to provide interesting and pertinent news stories and documentaries

 

 

Edit: TL:DW The whole point of native advertising is to masquerade as news. This is bad.

Edited June 10, 2015 by kirottu

[BruceVC]

 

 

CNN is calling paid company promotions as "news" in a product called "Courageous".

 

I don't know why, but while reading this I got a vivid image of advertisement jingle singing: "Fun with words! Now out for journalists and children."

 

Not sure why this is an issue? Its unusual I'll give you that but CNN has many different news shows so if you have an issue with advertisers creating stories on this particular series then just don't watch it. The rest of CNN will continue to provide interesting and pertinent news stories and documentaries

 

 

Edit: TL:DW The whole point of native advertising is to masquerade as news. This is bad.

 

 

But if CNN is open about the fact that this particular news unit is about there advertisers then there is no surreptitious behavior? 

 

Also this is about advertiser content that other companies like  the Wall Street Journal also uses. I can see you concern as there is a risk of news stories being influenced by advertisers but if its transparent then I don't see concern...and remember this is only one news unit that will probably feature once a day like the rest of there news stories 

 

So you will still get the other independent stories like Connect the World and Quest means Business  

[Amentep]

http://marvel.wikia.com/Marvel_Time

 

Convoluted. The age rule I was referring to is called the Pryde Scale, as it was devised by taking the time between publication of two issues where Kitty Pryde stated her age, and comparing her age within the comics, and the time elapsed in real life.

I understand the concept of the convoluted timescales in Marvel (and DC) comics. I also know that Kitty Pryde celebrated her 16th Birthday twice. This would all be well and good if it wasn't for the fact that WWII is a fixed point in time. The sliding age scale does nothing to decrease the amount of time between 1939-1944 and now. If there is a problem (if there is! As stated Magneto has been de-aged AND cloned to keep him youngish) with Magento being from WWII - as stated in the article that all of this was responding to - my point still stands that moving him from being born in 1931 to 1935-1945 (as the article suggested when suggesting they make him African-American and tied to the US Civil Rights movement) doesn't really change the "problem" with his age - you are swapping an 80 year old for a 70 year old.

Edited June 10, 2015 by Amentep

[Oerwinde]

True. And as the wikia article states, its not so much that its a problem with Magneto being old, its more a problem with Xavier's friendship with him being believable.

 

If they want to solve the "problem" have Magneto put in stasis by the Nazis and discovered by a team that includes Xavier. Then the Marvel Time sliding scale can work for him too. Keeps his connection to WW2, allows for his exit from stasis whenever the story needs him to.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Honestly, I'd prefer FF and X-Men stuff to have happened before the rest of the fictional universe. FF in the 60's and X-Men late 60's to the 90's.

[Calax]

Honestly, I'd prefer FF and X-Men stuff to have happened before the rest of the fictional universe. FF in the 60's and X-Men late 60's to the 90's.

That actually sounds kinda like it'd work socially, Although with the way comics are/were, I feel like X-men should almost be in their own universe given how big their crew are becoming.

[kirottu]

Seems like giant censorship push has started.

 

Reddit announcement.

 

"We’re banning behavior, not ideas." Unsurprisingly that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

KotakuInAction getting vote locked.

 

Twitter announcement. If you don't think this is bad, Twitter is working with Randi Harper who made the horrible block list based on guilt by association.

Edited June 11, 2015 by kirottu

[Hurlshort]

Oh no, where will all the people go to make fun of fat people?