Journalism and Bias in the Gaming Industry

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Remember the article from Erik Kain calling out FF on their tropes a few pages back? 

 

 

I would like to thank the mods for allowing continued discussion about this on the Obsidian-boards

This one?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2015/05/31/why-feminist-frequency-is-dead-wrong-about-the-witcher-3/

 

Seems fairly mild IMO.

[Meshugger]

 

Remember the article from Erik Kain calling out FF on their tropes a few pages back? 

 

 

I would like to thank the mods for allowing continued discussion about this on the Obsidian-boards

This one?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2015/05/31/why-feminist-frequency-is-dead-wrong-about-the-witcher-3/

 

Seems fairly mild IMO.

 

 

I think that they cannot handle the part where Erik calls them out on wanting art to serve a political agenda.

[GhoulishVisage]

https://soundcloud.com/totalbiscuit/masterpiece-theatre-presents-games-journalism

Totalbiscuit does a dramatic reading of Colin Campbell's already infamous Rock Band 4 article.

[Zoraptor]

There's nothing inherently wrong with having games serve a political purpose, things like America's Army are pretty overtly political- overtly enough that I don't even dislike it as propaganda. It's when you start trying to enforce a particular brand of political purpose across the board that it becomes a problem.

 

Erik Kain is good quality, even if he is 'only' a Forbes contributor and even when I rarely disagree with him. He and Tim Stone are probably the best games journalists out there at the moment, though Stone's stuff is a lot more, er, targetted and narrow in scope.

 

Stiller, Myers and Sandler all deserve to be sent to a labour camp.

 

Can't agree with Stiller, Tropic Thunder earns him a Get Out of Labour Camp Free Card so far as I am concerned.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

 

http://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

 

Steam is now offering refunds for games played less than 2 hours. What do you guys think?

[BruceVC]

 

 

Remember the article from Erik Kain calling out FF on their tropes a few pages back? 

 

 

I would like to thank the mods for allowing continued discussion about this on the Obsidian-boards

This one?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2015/05/31/why-feminist-frequency-is-dead-wrong-about-the-witcher-3/

 

Seems fairly mild IMO.

 

 

I think that they cannot handle the part where Erik calls them out on wanting art to serve a political agenda.

 

Well technically he doesn't say that, he says that art shouldn't only be about pushing a political agenda. He does say art can have elements of a political agenda 

 

I agree with that, and that Forbes article he wrote is a good read and addresses my issues with some of the criticism that the W3 received 

[kirottu]

http://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

 

Steam is now offering refunds for games played less than 2 hours. What do you guys think?

A reasonable indie response:

 

Not so reasonable indie response:

 

Let's let Brad Wardell to tie things together:

 

It's uncanny how many anti-GG seem to be against this. Should we simply start to call them anti-consumer?

 

And WTF is a 30 second game?

[Meshugger]

 

http://store.steampowered.com/steam_refunds/

 

Steam is now offering refunds for games played less than 2 hours. What do you guys think?

A reasonable indie response:

 

Not so reasonable indie response:

 

Let's let Brad Wardell to tie things together:

 

It's uncanny how many anti-GG seem to be against this. Should we simply start to call them anti-consumer?

 

And WTF is a 30 second game?

 

 

Yup, no surprises there about them being anti-consumer since the consumers themselves have the power to make them feel ungoodfeelz with their opinions and reviews.

 

The 30 second game is usually being naked with the woman of your dreams.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

30 second game? I'd ask for a refund If I spent more than a dollar on something like that.

 

If anything, wouldn't gamers be more likely to buy a game from Steam if they knew they could return it if they didn't like it or it doesn't work on their PC?

[NWN_babaYaga]

I love the new elite of the gaming industrie becoz they have so many interesting thoughts. Never did me know i will tell someone but the declaration of self importance of those clowns never done anything good in terms of quality... which is not a matter of an oppinion - is such a boring and exhausting thing. Why cant someone finaly tell them to f*** off and never return!

 

Whenever you try to enjoy your passion there is a new story about the same old bull****. I played ik+ on amiga and have great memories of it and there were lots of games that sucked which i dont remember. And that is common. The only thing they want is attention and money and they know it. Not even EA is more greedy and sinister then those maggots!

Edited June 3, 2015 by NWN_babaYaga

[Keyrock]

30 second game...

 

 

Out of curiosity, how much does one charge for a 30 second game?  I know time is not a perfect measurement of the value of a game and that 1 hour of "holy **** that is great" is worth a lot more than 3 hours of "meh", at least to me, but 30 seconds is a bit extreme, methinks.  That better be a mind-blowing 30 seconds to be worth anything more than a nickle.

[Amentep]

And WTF is a 30 second game?

I think they're those story based games. Viginette games I think they're called. Never played them but always imagined them to be like semi-interactive short stories.

 

Nina Freeman is credited on two games on Steam, "How do you Do It?" http://store.steampowered.com/app/353360/ and "Freshman Year" http://store.steampowered.com/app/364450/?snr=1_7_7_151_150_1

 

Both appear to be free, so I'd imagine Ms. Freeman is thinking hypothetically about a future game that she might make which may be longer, and thus have a minimal purchase fee, but also short compared to other games. I believe her website indicates the next game she is to work on is called "Cibele".

Edited June 3, 2015 by Amentep

[Nonek]

Very good new for the consumer, and ethical developers whom want to harness the good will of the public. I still find myself relying more and more on GOG than Steam however.

 

Edit: I do seem to remember a European ruling requiring this years ago however.

Edited June 3, 2015 by Nonek

[Hurlshort]

That little Kung Fury game is about 30 seconds.  Granted it is super replayable, but it would be hard to imagine spending two hours on it.  But it's only $2, so I can't imagine droves of people returning it.

[Fighter]

I can see how the 2 hour thing can be a problem for a Gone Home sized game.

[Keyrock]

I think 2 hours is reasonable.  You're never going to find a one size fits all solution that works for every game, it will always be unfair to somebody and there will always be people that abuse the system, but some kind of standard needs to be in place.  In the end, I think the argument for this is the same as the anti-DRM argument.  If you make a good game that people like then the amount of people asking for refunds will be relatively low and while you may lose some sales to people abusing the system, the amount of good will (which should hopefully translate to interest in and sales of future titles) you generate from providing a good product will outweigh what you lose from people abusing the system.

[Blarghagh]

Superbunnyhop (ridiculous channel name, great and smart critic) has about the definitive feature on Game Length as far as I'm concerned.

 

[GhoulishVisage]

Some more Polygon lampooning:

http://www.p4rgaming.com/i-went-to-a-fallout-4-press-event-and-ignored-it-because-i-didnt-feel-like-writing-about-it/

[Blarghagh]

So the problem is Steam's arbitrary 2 hour limit? Make it "5% of average playtime" or something instead, wouldn't that mostly fix it?

[Amentep]

So the problem is Steam's arbitrary 2 hour limit? Make it "5% of average playtime" or something instead, wouldn't that mostly fix it?

5% of a 30 second game is like a second and a half. Did someone even register the game had loaded by that point?

[Blarghagh]

Good point. Some kind of curve, possibly?

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

So the problem is Steam's arbitrary 2 hour limit? Make it "5% of average playtime" or something instead, wouldn't that mostly fix it?

Not if you want a refund on a 30 second game.

 

2 hours is fairly reasonable, you have plenty of time to get a feel for gameplay and have a better idea if this is something you want to play for a while. My problem with your suggestion is that with multiplayer mainly games that have a 4 hour single-player campaign, 5% can be eaten up by cinematics and tutorials.

[Blarghagh]

That's why it's average consumer playtime, not average campaign length. But I just realized it's a dumb idea anyway, since that means nobody can refund it until there's an average.

 

EDIT:

 

 

Boogie's opinion: Anyone who thinks this policy bad is probably delusional or trying to get clicks.

Edited June 3, 2015 by TrueNeutral

[Amentep]

I don't think its a bad policy. If I was an indie developer making short games I might be worried that the policy disincentives people trying my game particularly if they can't get 2 hours of play out of it.

 

BUT, you could argue this is where you'd need to get creative pricing and find that point which - based on cost vs length - a person would feel foolish not to try it.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

That's why it's average consumer playtime, not average campaign length. But I just realized it's a dumb idea anyway, since that means nobody can refund it until there's an average.

Yeah, and then there's the method of determining average.

 

EDIT:

 

 

Boogie's opinion: Anyone who thinks this policy bad is probably delusional or trying to get clicks.

So games journalists.