Wizard seem underperform compared to Cipher?

[Archaven]

I'm playing Cipher as PC and i'm loving it much. But Wizard on the other hand seems totally useless after he spent all his spells? For Aloth, the only thing he can do is do a close range slam on floor twice per encounter. When playing on Hard, the only way to continue is just go back to inn and restock the 2 camping supplies.

 

That's seems more like hassle than hard.

[Mungri]

Penetrating blast is a wizards friend.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Disclosure: I stopped playing after running into the equip bug.

 

In my experience, playing Aloth conservatively works fairly well. Admittedly I found my PC Cipher to be more effective with the AoE paralysis power, but Aloth works well as support.

 

That said, I do find Wizard a bit underwhelming.

[zephiris]

Disclosure: I stopped playing after running into the equip bug.

 

In my experience, playing Aloth conservatively works fairly well. Admittedly I found my PC Cipher to be more effective with the AoE paralysis power, but Aloth works well as support.

 

That said, I do find Wizard a bit underwhelming.

 

Mind telling more about the equipment bug (sorry if I hijack the thread). But I hate it when someone mentions something without putting in some more background information.

I hear some scary bugs on the forum... First the load bug where if you load in at certain locations where you picked up the companions and the companions have certain stat boosts they will be added permanently.

 

Now I hear something about a equip bug, which sounds equally terrible. I would like to avoid your misfortunate.

[Dark_Ansem]

they are because the spells are very few, per rest. and their per-encounter abilities are a bit lacking.

[Mazuo]

Yes, it's seeming to me that some of their less powerful spells should have been made per encounter and the better ones perhaps amplified slightly but restricted to per rest.

[Archaven]

they are because the spells are very few, per rest. and their per-encounter abilities are a bit lacking.

 

Playing on hard and higher difficulty without per encounter abilities and restricted camping supplies, wizard seems more like very underwhelming and it's a burden to the party. You will have to rest to refresh the abilities otherwise the wizard in battle is just totally useless to me. 

[GreyFox]

Wizards suck..we've been telling them that since like the first beta build...the lead designer hates wizards so we'll probably have to deal with it.

[Sherr]

what? his level 1 spell "Slicken" is like the most strongest ability in the game, bringing bosses and dragons on the floor in huge AoE and duration. I meaningly stop using this ability, because how overpowered wizard is.

[Mungri]

Wizards suck..we've been telling them that since like the first beta build...the lead designer hates wizards so we'll probably have to deal with it.

No they don't. They play the same yet are much more powerful than wizards in the IE games.

[Ansa]

Amigo, if you think Wizards are underpowered in this game, try BG1 with 1st level Wizard with 4hp and 2 spells, see how far you will get.

My money is on very first Wolf in the forest, they love dem Wizard chewtoys xD

Edited March 30, 2015 by Ansa

[tnc]

I believe wizard can be fixed with a change to bonus spell talents. Why not make a talent that gives 1 bonus spell on all levels instead of all those useless +1 bonus level 1 spell nonsense. Maybe not on level 6, because that petrify spell is op as hell :D I also think the aoe damage on wand attacks should be buffed too. It's a static crush damage, it'll suck on late game even more than early game. Make it percentage based and i'm happy.

[Arctic]

I'm playing Cipher as PC and i'm loving it much. But Wizard on the other hand seems totally useless after he spent all his spells? For Aloth, the only thing he can do is do a close range slam on floor twice per encounter. When playing on Hard, the only way to continue is just go back to inn and restock the 2 camping supplies.

 

That's seems more like hassle than hard.

 

Wizzard spells are stronger, and, at hight level the spell become 4 per encounter.

 

So .. i will say that wizard is great in hard fights. the good thing about cyper is that you fight full power all time . Just think that in that hard fight, when you are having a hard time hitting with weapons you almost cant get focus, and you cast 2-3 skills. but the wizzard can unleash all their spellbook.  Its not better or worse, just situacional.

[Dongom]

Wizard usually are  better in hard boss/named fights. (I say usually because some fights auto-start in a tiny room, making slicken possibly a detriment, but that is rare.)

 

But I'm not seeing many people main one, because auto-attacking a majority of the battles as someone called "Wizard" is understandably off-putting for some.

 

, at hight level the spell become 4 per encounter.

 

 

 

Do you know at what level?

Edited March 30, 2015 by Dongom

[Giantevilhead]

Wizard spells are pretty powerful. For example, Chill Fog is much better than Eyestrike and Slicken is better than Mindwave. They also have more elemental spells so they benefit from talents that increase elemental damage.

 

With Ciphers, you can throw around powers in every fight. With Wizards, you have to plan out encounters more. Scout the enemy to see if how many of them there are and how powerful they are to see if you need to cast spells.

[RunningWolf]

But Wizard on the other hand seems totally useless after he spent all his spells?

Wellcome to any classic rpg ever.

[Gallenger]

At least wizards get a cool scepter thing that shoots magicy stuff at people instead of a sling that only does 1d4 . 

Edited March 30, 2015 by Gallenger

[LastSoloer]

Wizards seem weak and kinda useless in the early game but as game progresses they should do fine considering the spells set they have.

[Whipstitch]

Wizards are actually pretty good, but they have some tight build tolerances to deal with--it's kinda hard to think of the "no trap options" goal as a success while wizards in their current state. Anyway, Aloth's build is borderline crippling--he has decent intellect and low might, but for some dumb ass reason they didn't give him Slicken, which is easily the best crowd control spell available at early levels. Passive damage and blast is a big part of a Wizard's contributions at low levels and Aloth simply lacks the sheer Might necessary to make his blast consistently poke through enemy DR. A PC or hireling Wizard with high Might fares considerably better and can cruise along rather comfortably once they've added Fetid Caress and Penetrating Blast to their bag of tricks.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Whipstitch

[Stargazer86]

Wizards are the best at AOE crowd control. Slicken is by far one of the best abilities at keeping your guys alive in bigger fights. Call to Slumber is just as awesome. They also get plenty of debuffing abilities that help the rest of your party kick butt. Confusion is good, Chill Fog, Blackened Sight, Miasma, you just get solid debuffing abilities all around. And their utility spells are fine too. Essential Phantom, Spirit Shield, and such.

 

Now, the issue as I find it is that their damage dealing potential is not exactly the greatest. Most of their attack spells just seem, well, useless. Rolling Flame is awful, Corrosive Siphon is bad, Necrotic Lance is okayish, the missile spells range underwhelming to bad, and anything that jumps from one target to another just doesn't seem to work. The only attack spells that I use on a regular basis are Fireball and Ray of Fire, and even then I'm not entirely sure about their effectiveness.

[Epsilon Rose]

 

But Wizard on the other hand seems totally useless after he spent all his spells?

Wellcome to any classic rpg ever.

 

And yet this is a problem that more modern RPGs have fixed. You give them the per day spells, but you also give them a buch of per encounter or at will abilities, so they're not useless after for most of the fight.

 

Wizard spells are pretty powerful. For example, Chill Fog is much better than Eyestrike and Slicken is better than Mindwave. They also have more elemental spells so they benefit from talents that increase elemental damage.

 

With Ciphers, you can throw around powers in every fight. With Wizards, you have to plan out encounters more. Scout the enemy to see if how many of them there are and how powerful they are to see if you need to cast spells.

I don't think anyone is arguing that the spells themselves are too weak (as a group), but that the class to which they are attached is poorly designed such that it feels too weak during most fights.

[ShadySands]

 

Wizards suck..we've been telling them that since like the first beta build...the lead designer hates wizards so we'll probably have to deal with it.

No they don't. They play the same yet are much more powerful than wizards in the IE games.

 

 

PoE Wizards are more powerful than IE Wizards in the early game but less so at higher levels. That said, the level cap for this game is somewhat low at 12 so I suppose it's possible for a high level PoE Wizard to pull ahead but I doubt it 

 

Wizard usually are  better in hard boss/named fights. (I say usually because some fights auto-start in a tiny room, making slicken possibly a detriment, but that is rare.)

 

But I'm not seeing many people main one, because auto-attacking a majority of the battles as someone called "Wizard" is understandably off-putting for some.

 

, at hight level the spell become 4 per encounter.

 

 

 

Do you know at what level?

Level 9 I believe for level 1 spells and level 11 for level 2 spells

Edited March 30, 2015 by ShadySands

[vistani]

I don't feel the wizard needs to be changed.  Did gandalf magic everything all the time or did he sit back and smoke his pipe as the lesser beings scurried around tirelessly until he had to act?  Point I'm making, no class can wtf destroy everything mercilessly like a wizard but if you try to do that to everything you fight, its going to suck but its nice to have the wild card avail when you need it.  Don't get me wrong, my pc is a cipher and I love it the most but my spells just aren't as strong as my wizards.  I got tons of CC and stuff but cipher seems most reliant on attacking will where wizards have flexability concerning resistances and cipher seems to have a lot of crowd control but the best crowd control of all is when everything suddenly explodes into flaming giblets.

Edited March 31, 2015 by vistani

[Viperswhip]

Wizards are the best at AOE crowd control. Slicken is by far one of the best abilities at keeping your guys alive in bigger fights. Call to Slumber is just as awesome. They also get plenty of debuffing abilities that help the rest of your party kick butt. Confusion is good, Chill Fog, Blackened Sight, Miasma, you just get solid debuffing abilities all around. And their utility spells are fine too. Essential Phantom, Spirit Shield, and such.

 

Now, the issue as I find it is that their damage dealing potential is not exactly the greatest. Most of their attack spells just seem, well, useless. Rolling Flame is awful, Corrosive Siphon is bad, Necrotic Lance is okayish, the missile spells range underwhelming to bad, and anything that jumps from one target to another just doesn't seem to work. The only attack spells that I use on a regular basis are Fireball and Ray of Fire, and even then I'm not entirely sure about their effectiveness.

Ya, it seems like his spells cap out at 50ish damage (Aloth at level 9), but in AoE, so he's basically a AoE control, damage turret. A couple of his best spells require plenty of positioning though, and he doesn't get as many foe only spells as the priest or druid. Since the cipher is kind of bugged I haven't played with Mother very much (some item that keeps her from gaining focus in combat).

 

The higher level wizard spells are pretty good CC, like Stargazer said Call to Slumber is a battle ender, 14+ seconds prone? And that's on Aloth with his poor stats.

[mrmonocle]

wizard doesn't have to charge, unlike cipher. wizard casts a lot faster, wizard has got infinite slikens on high level, and why not have both? one doesn't exclude the other.