Why do people play divinity: original sin?

[bugarup]

5 hours ago, Haljamar said:

 the story paths you can choose for DOS 2 are ****ing amazing 

 

[Sven_]

7 hours ago, Wormerine said:

If anyone cares here is my lengthy list of grievances with D:OS2.  

Those are similar concerns I have for DOS1, actually, which is a bit disappointing. I wouldn't have expected them to drop that items themselves have levels, and as such are that powerful; e.g. a dagger from Level 2-3ish does like twice-ish the damage than its level 1 counterpart.

However, perhaps in terms of exploration I would have them expected to do a bit more open. It's the same in DOS1 really, as you can see from These level maps. If damage/items scale this hard, it's no wonder that the game plays like it does. Possible spoiler inside: https://imgur.com/a/uK4zS#KEJXSrE

I'd like DOS1 probably better as a tactical combat experience akin to Blackguards. No less as the inventory management and looting is perhaps the most tedious I have ever seen in an RPG, personally -- and this includes pre-Infinity Era 1990s games. Each char has ist own inventory (being a co-op game) plus you are constantly going through all that stuff as your gear eventually breaks or is being outlevelled. I'd like to see a timer of how much minutes an average player spends on the inventory screen and compare that to your average RPG. I'm betting all I have it would go through the roof.

Good thing is that they seemed to have improved on their world building, that unlike the first part the freedom isn't as much about how you tackle combat due to reworked dialogue and quest systems -- and honestly, their presentations of it all in terms of "pen&paper like freedom" (which is their end goal) are amazing. All that praise they've received for the 2nd game in particular has to come from somewhere, which why I'm still interested (and have serious hopes for BG3). DOS1 was a make or break game developed on a budget; on BG3 they can go all-in now (plus have to stick to WOTC's rules).

Edited May 18, 2020 by Sven_

[Wormerine]

16 hours ago, Haljamar said:

It also helps that DOS 2 is written by Chris Avellone so you can always expect quality from his work.

Was he really? I mean I love the games the guy worked on in the past, but since leaving Obsidian I can't say he's been on a winning streak. That said, I don't mean to throw shade at him, afterall he is but a part of a much bigger machine and I don't think writing per-say to be a problem in D:OS1&2 - it's just narrative and character seem to be somewhere low on the food chain when. I don't see those great narrative paths you mention. None of them have a set-up nor a pay off to make them memorable. 

[Wormerine]

11 hours ago, Sven_ said:

It's the same in DOS1 really, as you can see from These level maps. If damage/items scale this hard, it's no wonder that the game plays like it does. Possible spoiler inside: https://imgur.com/a/uK4zS#KEJXSrE

Yeah, though due to how transparend DOS1 level content was, it didn't quite annoy me as DoS2. I don't remember ever having trouble figuring out where I am expected to go in D:OS1, while in Driftwood I found it to be really frustrating and it was possible to start on paths which you were underlevel for. However, That only happened in Driftwood for me (on both my playthrous). 
 

11 hours ago, Sven_ said:

and honestly, their presentations of it all in terms of "pen&paper like freedom" (which is their end goal) are amazing. All that praise they've received for the 2nd game in particular has to come from somewhere, which why I'm still interested (and have serious hopes for BG3). DOS1 was a make or break game developed on a budget; on BG3 they can go all-in now (plus have to stick to WOTC's rules).

Oh, they are with no doubt commited and talented bunch. I am just not sure if their commitment to coop design is compatible with what I desire from an RPG. They seem to be moving over a lot of things into BG3 (which is not bad by itself by anymeans) but I am not convinced is they will make course correction.

What I lacked in D:OS1&2 is reactivity, acknowledgment and response from the game. You get a freedom to do a lot, but without a buddy to react to what you do, none of that left much impact. 10h of coop D:OS1 are some of my findest memories in gaming ever. Single player experience - not even close.

Which is perfectly fine. Having a coop oriented RPG series is a valuable thing to do, and a lot of issues I have with the game, can be explained as coop design. Still, I would prefer if BG3 held up better as a single players experience due to IP. If it won't - that's fine really, as long as it's success won't stifle all other singleplayer RPG projects. I just wish someone could take this amazing engine they build and make a game I would enjoy  

Edited May 18, 2020 by Wormerine

[Haljamar]

3 hours ago, Wormerine said:

Was he really? I mean I love the games the guy worked on in the past, but since leaving Obsidian I can't say he's been on a winning streak. That said, I don't mean to throw shade at him, afterall he is but a part of a much bigger machine and I don't think writing per-say to be a problem in D:OS1&2 - it's just narrative and character seem to be somewhere low on the food chain when. I don't see those great narrative paths you mention. None of them have a set-up nor a pay off to make them memorable. 

With Ifan you find out that the very people who sent you to kill Alexander were the same folks who engaged in gas attacks against the elves you grew up with, so now you can get revenge. For the Red Prince you free your beloved by breaking the seal that binds her to a god so she may give you a dragon for a child, and you would later go on to repopulate the dragon population while leading the lizards into a new age against the corrupted Eternals known as Voidwoken. Lohse's story is her trying to free herself from an ancient demon who wants her to become a homicidal cannibal, and the demon acts like a chest burster who has killed countless innocents. You can free the souls of innocent people it has fed on already, and you finally purge the piece of garbage from your soul.  Fane's story is him finding out his species known as the Eternals have been split between gods and Voidwoken. You can give up your source to finally seal away the piece of garbage king that sealed you away in the first place, or fight your daughter to become divine and continue the fight without giving up your powers. Sebille has the option to sacrifice herself to a tyrant as the last Scion of the elves because she killed the rest, or kill the tyrant that controls her fellow elves and become the next leader to restore the elven homeland.  Beast's journey is just him trying to gather allies to finally kill his cousin who wishes to engage in genocide with the same toxin that wiped out Ifan's friends. Afterwards Beast becomes king, and if you aren't playing as him he will just sail away instead of leading his people against the Voidwoken.

[Wormerine]

I know what the story beats are (aside from Sebille and Beast). Those are really shallow and underdeveloped stories for a 80+ hour game. There are details one might add, but you pretty much summarise all characters arcs. Usually in one sentece. That's not very good. It's not that D:OS2 doesn't have occasional good, story bits, but they are underdeveloped, too disconnected and too few and far between and without a meaningful core to wrap around. 

Lohse extinguishing the candles to save herself, and encountering bodies of people whose life she has ended in the process? Good stuff. But irrelevant, and unexplored in the grand scheme of things beside couple lines of dialogue. Who is Lohse as a character? Or any other companion? How their choices affected them? How did the journey change them? No clue, they are just AI controlled empty bodies for Coop buddies. 

[HoonDing]

Larian try so hard, it's almost cute.

[Melusina]

On 5/18/2020 at 10:55 PM, Wormerine said:

I know what the story beats are (aside from Sebille and Beast). Those are really shallow and underdeveloped stories for a 80+ hour game. There are details one might add, but you pretty much summarise all characters arcs. Usually in one sentece. That's not very good. It's not that D:OS2 doesn't have occasional good, story bits, but they are underdeveloped, too disconnected and too few and far between and without a meaningful core to wrap around. 

Lohse extinguishing the candles to save herself, and encountering bodies of people whose life she has ended in the process? Good stuff. But irrelevant, and unexplored in the grand scheme of things beside couple lines of dialogue. Who is Lohse as a character? Or any other companion? How their choices affected them? How did the journey change them? No clue, they are just AI controlled empty bodies for Coop buddies. 

Come on! That's not fair thing to say.... especially since you can say that for many rpg stories.

[uuuhhii]

red prince and fane are actually pretty good character but in the end still not likable enough

possess by random powerful demon for no reason are not a good way to start a story

if the possession come from some stupid deal made with the demon the whole thing would be much more interesting

[Wormerine]

56 minutes ago, Melusina said:

especially since you can say that for many rpg stories.

Many? Sure, but those games land in mediocare RPG category, and don't get praised as a new gold standard for an RPG. Divinity2 is a mediocare campaign built in an excellent engine. And while I am willing to praise D:OS2 for quite a few things, story and characters aren't them. I have seen far worse, I have seen far better.