435 Discussion

[Ashen Rohk]

 

Just finished a video on ranger, they're a lot better than they were previously but they're outshone by everything else except rogue.

Is it up somewhere?

 

 

Uploading tonight, will make it first on the list

 

Got a bunch of stuff up at www.youtube.com/theonlyrpgshack , if you can wade through all the Guild Wars 2 stuff. Should be a playlist full of PoE stuff.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Ashen Rohk

[Ashen Rohk]

With the new intellect, I'm really wishing Godlike wasn't the only race with a +int bonus. I like getting my numbers rounded, 54% and 45% doesn't feel right, I want that 60/50! I think elves should get int considering their race description includes intelligence. Maybe Wood elves get the Dex, Pale get the Int or something. Or just give them +1 int/dex/per and -1 something else.

 

Another small thing I hope they manage to include is ability to name save games.

 

Not me.

 

 

Also, when did chanter ability acquisition get nerfed into the ground? The fire weapon chant is now 3rd level and a lot of the other abilities have been massively upleveled. Only found this out when playing with the IE mod.

 

Just recently in 434/5 - Chanter needed a nerf though.

 

Absolutely, but compared to how quickly you acquire other skills in other classes, the chanter's pace of progression is cripplingly slow in game now. I thought it was bad and I insta-leveled from 1 to 12 in 2 minutes.

[Sock]

My initial impressions:

 

I made a completely custom party. Sword and board ranger, sword and board paladin, dual wielding barbarian, hybrid melee/ranged chanter, ranged cipher (with blunderbuss), and ranged druid.

 

Ranger - Felt weaker than in previous builds, surprisingly. I think the change to accuracy from perception really hurt that build, but he still had the most crits, and of all my single target killers racked up the most kills. Over all, I liked the playstyle, but my poor wolf died too easily which left him crippled more often than not.

 

Cipher - As soon as I got Leadsplitter, it was ridiculous. Unlimited focus. I haven't really played with the class before now, so I made a lot of poor decisions for abilities. Still, I felt like there was something really OP about gaining full focus from a single attack.

 

Paladin - Initially underwhelming, but he quickly proved to be pretty solid and durable. Low on the damage end, but I did make him out to be a tank. However, a huuuuuuuge negative is the combat only aura. When the fight begins, and my front line was rushing ahead, he was lagging behind because he was applying his aura. For a main tank, that meant he was at a significant disadvantage when compared to any other class.

 

Druid - Only used a druid before while also have BB Priest in the party, so I never really looked at the druid's healing abilities. Found out quickly that their healing wasn't suited for a ranged role, so I made do without a real healer (aside from paladin's LOH and barbarian's defiance). Their spells are amazing, period.

 

Chanter - Felt like it was nerfed, almost to DnD bard levels. If not for Thice She Was Wronged, I wouldn't want one anymore. His accuracy felt crippled, and he was way more fragile than he was prior. Too many things were nerfed at once, and the sum total left him in a very different position. I don't argue that the chanter should've been left untouched, but I do think it was just a little too severe a nerf in sum total.

 

Barbarian - I wasn't impressed, but I could be. I think there's more potential in the class now; feels way less glass cannon than in previous builds, which is great for a melee class. I am planning to play with a few different barbarian builds and my next game has a 2h barbarian off-tank, and the game after that will have a barbarian main tank with a sword and board.

 

Over all, this party was pretty durable. Paladin went down once, Barbarian, Ranger, and Chanter all went down twice. I took on about 20 skaenites back to back without breaking combat. My chanter's ancient memory ability was vital for healing, since I didn't have a healer.

 

As far as bugs go, I did encounter a few instances where something felt really off, but I couldn't pin point it. For example, fighting the 20 skaenites... no one lost any endurance in that fight, it was bizarre. There were a few traps I triggered that seemed to do zero damage, too. I know I had a strong defensive group, but still. Also ran into graphical glitches with modal abilities. Paladin had defensive fighting and zealous focus active, while my ranger had savage blows active. Occasionally when switching between them, my ranger had messed up green outlines. I'll get screenshots and post them later.

[Sensuki]

So I've been giving Path of the Damned a try again. Good news, its not totally playable. Except for that damn ogre with his pack of 5 bears, two of which are elder bears.

 

Let me tell you about Elder Bears, those things are practically bossfights on their own. Going to have to figure out something for that fight, i can disengage and try luring stuff out one by one but honestly if I pull an elder bear its a good chance i wipe, if its an elder bear plus anything else its definitely just over.

 

That's because Elder Bears are OP on Hard too, I can't imagine how you would beat one on PotD lol. Edit: just spam Slicken over and over again (although that may not work due to increased stats).

 

Paladin - Initially underwhelming, but he quickly proved to be pretty solid and durable. Low on the damage end, but I did make him out to be a tank. However, a huuuuuuuge negative is the combat only aura. When the fight begins, and my front line was rushing ahead, he was lagging behind because he was applying his aura. For a main tank, that meant he was at a significant disadvantage when compared to any other class.

 

Chanter - Felt like it was nerfed, almost to DnD bard levels. If not for Thice She Was Wronged, I wouldn't want one anymore. His accuracy felt crippled, and he was way more fragile than he was prior. Too many things were nerfed at once, and the sum total left him in a very different position. I don't argue that the chanter should've been left untouched, but I do think it was just a little too severe a nerf in sum total.

 

They nerfed the Paladin too far in a previous build (don't remember which) and yeah the Chanter is nowhere near as good now. But yeah - a lot of these changes are due to the removal of Accuracy from the Attributes, and the fixing of quadratic damage mults. Now everything does less damage, it's a lot harder to punch through DT (although enemy creatures have no problem doing it to you) and you miss more and crit way less often, unless you're a Hearth Orlan.

 

Lead Splitter is a hilarious item, too. Probably the best Firearm?

 

And yeah, Rangers are still the worst class.

 

I might look into making a side-version of the IE mod with +1 Accuracy on Perception again, see if that does anything.

 

I also think that Constitution might be better off granting an integer bonus to Endurance instead of a percentage, at least then it would warrant putting a few points into.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Sensuki

[DigitalCrack]

Chanter - Felt like it was nerfed, almost to DnD bard levels. If not for Thice She Was Wronged, I wouldn't want one anymore. His accuracy felt crippled, and he was way more fragile than he was prior. Too many things were nerfed at once, and the sum total left him in a very different position. I don't argue that the chanter should've been left untouched, but I do think it was just a little too severe a nerf in sum total.

 

Super disappointed to hear the class is crippled.  I loved that you could have a bard-like character that could stand at the front and still be effective.  Made for a really interesting melee option.  I don't understand what the point is of obsidian stressing build diversity and playing classes anyway you want and then turn around and cripple a class, making it worthless to try and play certain ways.

[Ashen Rohk]

To me the biggest issue with chanter is that some of the skills have been shifted up level - the chanter has always been fairly weak in combat imho.

[Luckmann]

 

Chanter - Felt like it was nerfed, almost to DnD bard levels. If not for Thice She Was Wronged, I wouldn't want one anymore. His accuracy felt crippled, and he was way more fragile than he was prior. Too many things were nerfed at once, and the sum total left him in a very different position. I don't argue that the chanter should've been left untouched, but I do think it was just a little too severe a nerf in sum total.

 

 

Super disappointed to hear the class is crippled.  I loved that you could have a bard-like character that could stand at the front and still be effective.  Made for a really interesting melee option.  I don't understand what the point is of obsidian stressing build diversity and playing classes anyway you want and then turn around and cripple a class, making it worthless to try and play certain ways.

 

 

Sawyer is an extremely conservative person, and it has affected the development of the game throughout. PoE was built very restrictively rather than openly, mostly as a way to curtail ways to play the game "wrong". Combat Only abilities to prevent abuse and ease programming, Engagement to prevent movement and player battlefield control, no area transition in combat to prevent you from abusing it even though you could have legitimate reasons to attempt to flee, etc.

 

It's only natural that the approach is to nerf the powerful rather than buff the weak.

 

The chanter really was the sweet spot other classes should aspire to, but it's no surprise it was toned down for that very reason.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Luckmann

[Sedrefilos]

 

 

Just finished a video on ranger, they're a lot better than they were previously but they're outshone by everything else except rogue.

Is it up somewhere?

 

 

Uploading tonight, will make it first on the list

 

Got a bunch of stuff up at www.youtube.com/theonlyrpgshack , if you can wade through all the Guild Wars 2 stuff. Should be a playlist full of PoE stuff.

 

Nice. I checked up last night but it wasn't up yet. Will do again in a while

[aeonsim]

So I've been giving Path of the Damned a try again. Good news, its not totally playable. Except for that damn ogre with his pack of 5 bears, two of which are elder bears.

 

Let me tell you about Elder Bears, those things are practically bossfights on their own. Going to have to figure out something for that fight, i can disengage and try luring stuff out one by one but honestly if I pull an elder bear its a good chance i wipe, if its an elder bear plus anything else its definitely just over.

The elder bears weren't much of a problem for me this time on PoD, something to slow them down (web or the druids vines) and then paralyze them with mental binding or the mage spell and they died very quickly (didn't bother pulling them just wiped all the bears together then finished off the ogre), 392 PoD was much worse. With this build PoD is very playable with none of the one hit kills from 392 occurring. I've only had 3 party wipes and they were all from trying something stupid to see if it would work ( let's try killing all the spiders with out using spells sort of thing). Edited February 6, 2015 by aeonsim

[Sensuki]

If they actually hit you though, you're done for.

If you don't actually have access to a hard cc, then they'll still kill your party members very quickly. I think they do a bit too much per-hit damage. 

One of the good things about the Infinity Engine games was that there was always multiple solutions to every encounter, if the answer here to beat things is always "drop chain disables to win", then that's not very fun.

 

I think they would be more fun to fight if they maybe had more health but dealt less damage ? That way that encounter will actually feel like a proper boss encounter or something, rather than relying on pure crowd control and focus fire only because if you don't, you die in a couple of hits.

 

Their accuracy (97) is also too high for this build.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Sensuki

[Odd Hermit]

One of the good things about the Infinity Engine games was that there was always multiple solutions to every encounter, if the answer here to beat things is always "drop chain disables to win", then that's not very fun.

 

One thing I've noticed is that my characters rarely get significantly disabled in PoE. While in a pure 1vs1 damage/mitigation/avoidance often my PoE party would get wrecked by many of PoEs encounters, when you're able to freely disable without much worry about disables yourself it definitely gets to feeling formulaic.

 

Granted, many of the enemies in the BB aren't the type to be tossing around major CCs, maybe we'll see more in the finished product. But I breezed through hard mode every time once I learned/got a feel for the mechanics and classes. Even my first run through I only wiped on beetles a few times because I didn't expect I'd need to take them as a serious encounter worthy of spending serious spell slots on CC.

 

Probably the most worrisome moment was when a couple of my party got proned by a Skaen caster, but I just as easily CC the whole group with my remaining characters.

 

Perhaps the problem isn't really damage related as much as it is CC imbalance between players and AI.

 

 

 

Sawyer is an extremely conservative person, and it has affected the development of the game throughout. PoE was built very restrictively rather than openly, mostly as a way to curtail ways to play the game "wrong". Combat Only abilities to prevent abuse and ease programming, Engagement to prevent movement and player battlefield control, no area transition in combat to prevent you from abusing it even though you could have legitimate reasons to attempt to flee, etc.

 

It's only natural that the approach is to nerf the powerful rather than buff the weak.

 

The chanter really was the sweet spot other classes should aspire to, but it's no surprise it was toned down for that very reason.

 

 

My only big issue is that combat / non-combat divide feels gamey, and hit/run is a legitimate strategy.

 

That said, preventing abuse/cheese is something I support. I like being able to really optimize my group, strategies, spell / ability selection, etc. and not feel like I have to handicap myself to get a challenging experience. So I agree with/ can appreciate the "Sawyer approach". Maybe some unfortunate compromises had to be made but I'd rather have a genuinely challenging experience - on higher difficulty settings at least - when everything is factored in.

 

I don't think their whole approach can be boiled down to nerf the powerful rather than buff the weak though. We'll see how some of the nerfed classes end up post-release but I expect they're still going to tune the classes more and we'll see some over-nerfing amended.

[Sensuki]

Perhaps the problem isn't really damage related as much as it is CC imbalance between players and AI.

 

When an enemy monster can kill your character in 2 hits, that is a damage problem.

 

Contrast to the Infinity Engine games, unless you were literally right at the start of the game, this didn't happen. Especially around the mid levels. 

 

Cave Bears are pretty deadly in Baldur's Gate, and you do have to watch out if you get hit by them, but in Baldur's Gate it was harder to hit and there were no grazes - so a Bear attacking one of my characters might have been miss, miss, hit for 15 damage, miss - something like that.

 

Here, an Elder Bear with 97 Accuracy if left unchecked to attack any character will likely hit or crit for 50-80 damage twice in a row - that character dies, the end.

 

If Engagement didn't exist then this may not be as much of a problem, because you could switch aggro around - but it's not like that.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Sensuki

[Bazy]

Perhaps the problem isn't really damage related as much as it is CC imbalance between players and AI.

 Good point. Same goes with other buffs, potion use, etc. I hate when AI drop potions, but never figure out how to use them. 

[Odd Hermit]

 

Perhaps the problem isn't really damage related as much as it is CC imbalance between players and AI.

 

When an enemy monster can kill your character in 2 hits, that is a damage problem.

 

Contrast to the Infinity Engine games, unless you were literally right at the start of the game, this didn't happen. Especially around the mid levels. 

 

Cave Bears are pretty deadly in Baldur's Gate, and you do have to watch out if you get hit by them, but in Baldur's Gate it was harder to hit and there were no grazes - so a Bear attacking one of my characters might have been miss, miss, hit for 15 damage, miss - something like that.

 

Here, an Elder Bear with 97 Accuracy if left unchecked to attack any character will likely hit or crit for 50-80 damage twice in a row - that character dies, the end.

 

If Engagement didn't exist then this may not be as much of a problem, because you could switch aggro around - but it's not like that.

 

 

I phrased my point poorly. I should say that due to their limited control options as well as the player's abundant control options, damage ended up the only way for many enemies to be a threat to the player. Many enemies in the beta, if they didn't do crazy damage, would be trivial encounters.

[Sensuki]

Right, yes you could be right. And unfortunately that is a boring solution.

 

There are many ways they could improve Bears more fun to play against while having less powerful attacks. 

Higher health but lower damage, faster attacks but lower damage, higher interrupt, a DoT bleeding effect on a hit, a knockdown ability ... the list goes on

[Bazy]

 I should say that due to their limited control options as well as the player's abundant control options, damage ended up the only way for many enemies to be a threat to the player. Many enemies in the beta, if they didn't do crazy damage, would be trivial encounters.

 

Good AI targeting and abilities use also helps. Ramping up Damage/Health is indeed a terribly boring solution. AI that makes me react or make tradeoffs is far more interesting... 

 

The first beta build AI was awful... they attacked the first thing they saw and stuck to it (even if invulnerable) while a bunch of naked casters killed them from afar. It's def better now, not sure to what extent. 

Edited February 6, 2015 by Bazy

[Odd Hermit]

Right, yes you could be right. And unfortunately that is a boring solution.

 

There are many ways they could improve Bears more fun to play against while having less powerful attacks. 

 

Higher health but lower damage, faster attacks but lower damage, higher interrupt, a DoT bleeding effect on a hit, a knockdown ability ... the list goes on

 

I agree that if that solution was applied to all enemies it'd be boring. And in the BB it does apply to too many of the enemies, definitely.

 

But in this case, we're talking about bears. Bears aren't exactly the kind of enemy I'd expect to be subtle and manipulative. I don't think giant bears should be the kind of enemies where you figure you can tank their damage.

 

They could still have a knockdown, but I don't think that'd change the dynamic that much.

[Sensuki]

My problem is not that Bears have high per-hit damage. That is fine and makes sense. My problem is that the damage is *too* high. Being dropped in two hits is not fun and really limits the amount of approaches you can take against them.
 

The 97 Accuracy is also probably a balancing issue, as Accuracy is lower across the board in this build.

[Sensuki]

Man this new save system is so much better. No more accidentally overwriting my own saves!

[aeonsim]

My problem is not that Bears have high per-hit damage. That is fine and makes sense. My problem is that the damage is *too* high. Being dropped in two hits is not fun and really limits the amount of approaches you can take against them.

 

The 97 Accuracy is also probably a balancing issue, as Accuracy is lower across the board in this build.

 

I actually don't mind that so much, the high damage is ok it's just the accuracy that's potentially a problem and personally I'm not finding it a major one.

I think it makes it a lot more interesting if there are a few types of enemies that require a completely different tactic to fight against. As such having a few classes of enemies that will kill you in a couple of hits if you get into melee with them is fine especially in hard or PoD.

Considering this is Path of the Damned we're talking about I think the Elder bears at that level of difficulty are perfectly fine, especially seeing they're not on the critical path and you don't even need to fight them to complete the quest.

 

So I've been giving Path of the Damned a try again. Good news, its not totally playable. Except for that damn ogre with his pack of 5 bears, two of which are elder bears.

 

Let me tell you about Elder Bears, those things are practically bossfights on their own. Going to have to figure out something for that fight, i can disengage and try luring stuff out one by one but honestly if I pull an elder bear its a good chance i wipe, if its an elder bear plus anything else its definitely just over.

 

 

As it stands there are several different ways to kill them at the moment, even on PoD.

• Ignore the ordinary bears and use someone to distract or lock down the ogre then have everyone else charge in and focus on just one of them (using weapons they're weak against), a priest will help a lot or you'll need a lot of healing/regeneration potions and buffs like Ironskin to pull this off but it will work.
• Use a Druid or Cipher to charm or dominate one or more of the bears or elder bears and once they engage focus the party on the elders.
• Use the Druid, Rogue , Ranger or Wizard to slow them down and hammer them with ranged weapons or AoE.
• Use a Monk, Fighter, Cipher or Druid to knock them down or back while using ranged weapons to deal with them.
• Use a Cipher, Druid or Wizard to paralyse or Blind them and stack up the debuffs then just slaughter them.
• Use summons to provide disposable meat shields, this is a bit harder as most of them come from the Chanter and need a a fair bit of time to get ready.
• Use the protection spells send in a fighter or Paladin set up for max deflection (hatchet (+5) and large shield (+20), and sword/shield talent (+10)  before spells, abilities or potions) to attract and hold there attention while everyone else attacks then when you character's endurance gets low use withdraw or beetle's shell to protect them while they heal, allowing them to continue to distract the bears for a bit

The main reason the fight is challenging is because it's a boss fight with 2 (or is it 4?) normal bears, 2 Elder bears and Ogre on PoD. Individually I don't think the Elder bears are much of a problem unless the only way you know how to fight is to just charge up with everyone and try to beat them to death.

 

As far as I'm concerned PoD is probably a little too easy at the moment for Players who use a lot of crowd control and sit back. The fights are reasonably fun but they're not requiring me to sit back and think about exactly what strategies and tactics are needed to win each one.

Edited February 6, 2015 by aeonsim

[aeonsim]

 

One of the good things about the Infinity Engine games was that there was always multiple solutions to every encounter, if the answer here to beat things is always "drop chain disables to win", then that's not very fun.

 

One thing I've noticed is that my characters rarely get significantly disabled in PoE. While in a pure 1vs1 damage/mitigation/avoidance often my PoE party would get wrecked by many of PoEs encounters, when you're able to freely disable without much worry about disables yourself it definitely gets to feeling formulaic.

 

Granted, many of the enemies in the BB aren't the type to be tossing around major CCs, maybe we'll see more in the finished product. But I breezed through hard mode every time once I learned/got a feel for the mechanics and classes. Even my first run through I only wiped on beetles a few times because I didn't expect I'd need to take them as a serious encounter worthy of spending serious spell slots on CC.

 

Probably the most worrisome moment was when a couple of my party got proned by a Skaen caster, but I just as easily CC the whole group with my remaining characters.

 

Perhaps the problem isn't really damage related as much as it is CC imbalance between players and AI.

 

In this build on Path of the Damned I've seen a fair bit more ability use by the creatures, wood beetles poison is now ranged and they often start off combat with that before moving up to you. Ivory spinners are using their web ability from range to lock you down, some of the smaller spiders have petrify and are using it regularly (had half the party petrified at one point) though it has been toned down a bit compared to earlier builds. While the big crystal eaters are doing a better job of dropping the Ice/crystal attack on the party (that does a lot of damage!), and the wolves LOVE there knock down ability.

[Sensuki]

Just FYI, there are no AI differences between any of the difficulty settings, those are changes made for all difficulties. I like that the Wood Beetles now have a ranged attack, I recall suggesting it (along with others) way back in v257/278.

 

There still seems to be some issues with Ivory Spinners, they still seem to randomly cast webs everywhere, but that may just be what they do. The new Stuck FX looks horrible though hahah.

 

Path of the Damned is meant to be a byproduct of all difficulties, so in getting those right, PotD should feel right too, I imagine. 

 

 

 

I actually don't mind that so much, the high damage is ok it's just the accuracy that's potentially a problem and personally I'm not finding it a major one.

 

I think it makes it a lot more interesting if there are a few types of enemies that require a completely different tactic to fight against. As such having a few classes of enemies that will kill you in a couple of hits if you get into melee with them is fine especially in hard or PoD.

 

Considering this is Path of the Damned we're talking about I think the Elder bears at that level of difficulty are perfectly fine, especially seeing they're not on the critical path and you don't even need to fight them to complete the quest.

 

I'm talking about Hard difficulty. On Hard difficulty where stats are not modified they have 97 Accuracy and they do 50-80 damage. It may be higher on PotD. I find the fact that they can kill your party members in two hits really boring to play against, as it pigeonholes you into using CC tactics only. I don't find having to do that very fun, I'd prefer to be able to use a variety of different tactics to beat encounters like you could in Icewind Dale or Baldur's Gate 2. There are a bunch of ways to make them more interesting to play against and still be challenging rather than just giving them high per hit damage, high accuracy and calling it a day.

 

Using crowd control is not 'a lot more interesting', because it works on pretty much every encounter. It's interesting when there are multiple approaches that work against an encounter.

 

As it stands there are several different ways to kill them at the moment, even on PoD.

Ignore the ordinary bears and use someone to distract or lock down the ogre then have everyone else charge in and focus on just one of them (using weapons they're weak against), a priest will help a lot or you'll need a lot of healing/regeneration potions and buffs like Ironskin to pull this off but it will work.

Use a Druid or Cipher to charm or dominate one or more of the bears or elder bears and once they engage focus the party on the elders.

Use the Druid, Rogue , Ranger or Wizard to slow them down and hammer them with ranged weapons or AoE.

Use a Monk, Fighter, Cipher or Druid to knock them down or back while using ranged weapons to deal with them.

Use a Cipher, Druid or Wizard to paralyse or Blind them and stack up the debuffs then just slaughter them.

Use summons to provide disposable meat shields, this is a bit harder as most of them come from the Chanter and need a a fair bit of time to get ready.

Use the protection spells send in a fighter or Paladin set up for max deflection (hatchet (+5) and large shield (+20), and sword/shield talent (+10) before spells, abilities or potions) to attract and hold there attention while everyone else attacks then when you character's endurance gets low use withdraw or beetle's shell to protect them while they heal, allowing them to continue to distract the bears for a bit

The main reason the fight is challenging is because it's a boss fight with 2 (or is it 4?) normal bears, 2 Elder bears and Ogre on PoD. Individually I don't think the Elder bears are much of a problem unless the only way you know how to fight is to just charge up with everyone and try to beat them to death.

 

As far as I'm concerned PoD is probably a little too easy at the moment for Players who use a lot of crowd control and sit back. The fights are reasonably fun but they're not requiring me to sit back and think about exactly what strategies and tactics are needed to win each one.

You are theorizing. If you had actually tested all of those methods, you would find that Charm Beast is not working properly in this build

Edited February 6, 2015 by Sensuki

[bronzepoem]

 

 

Chanter - Felt like it was nerfed, almost to DnD bard levels. If not for Thice She Was Wronged, I wouldn't want one anymore. His accuracy felt crippled, and he was way more fragile than he was prior. Too many things were nerfed at once, and the sum total left him in a very different position. I don't argue that the chanter should've been left untouched, but I do think it was just a little too severe a nerf in sum total.

 

 

Super disappointed to hear the class is crippled.  I loved that you could have a bard-like character that could stand at the front and still be effective.  Made for a really interesting melee option.  I don't understand what the point is of obsidian stressing build diversity and playing classes anyway you want and then turn around and cripple a class, making it worthless to try and play certain ways.

 

 

Sawyer is an extremely conservative person, and it has affected the development of the game throughout. PoE was built very restrictively rather than openly, mostly as a way to curtail ways to play the game "wrong". Combat Only abilities to prevent abuse and ease programming, Engagement to prevent movement and player battlefield control, no area transition in combat to prevent you from abusing it even though you could have legitimate reasons to attempt to flee, etc.

 

It's only natural that the approach is to nerf the powerful rather than buff the weak.

 

The chanter really was the sweet spot other classes should aspire to, but it's no surprise it was toned down for that very reason.

 

 

Totally agreed

[constantine]

Can some1 plz post a a screen of character sheet so we can see the new derived stats from attributes ?

[Sensuki]

I posted one earlier in the thread Go back and have a look

 

Anyway its MIG + 3% Dam/Heal, Dex +3% Action Speed, Con +3% Health/Endurance, Per +6% Interrupt/+1 Deflection, Int +6% AoE/+5% Duration, Res 6% Concentration/+1 Deflection

 

Dexterity and Perception are currently broken too.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Sensuki