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Naith1

Differences between races (human and elf)

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it Tolkien who popularized tall-slim-pale-immortal-humanlike-folks-with-pointy-ears as "elves"? There were other differencies, but exterior was that. From Tolkien this image went into Forgotten Realms in several variations, and, well, into pretty much all rpgs PoE wants to look like, so it's okay by me.

 

Also, iirc elves from FR could breed with anyone willing to try, so it's a wonder there left some pure-blood species of a kind at all.

 

I'd feel insulted if I'd was a faery from German/Celtic ethnic tales. I think.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it Tolkien who popularized tall-slim-pale-immortal-humanlike-folks-with-pointy-ears as "elves"? There were other differencies, but exterior was that.

That's the explanation I've heard espoused many times, myself. I've never researched it but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Tolkien influenced a lot of things....

“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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As I recall in the original race update, Josh said elves and dwarves were included, because he thought a lot of fans of the original games would want to play an elf or a dwarf. This is also the reason, in my opinion, why they look like the dwarves and elves we all know, because it would defeat the point of their inclusion to make them radically different than they are in Dungeons and Dragons. Personally I would have rather had two more new races, but I understand the decision.

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Funnily enough they look most similar to NWN2 elves ... which were pretty ugly tbh

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it Tolkien who popularized tall-slim-pale-immortal-humanlike-folks-with-pointy-ears as "elves"? There were other differencies, but exterior was that.

 

That's the explanation I've heard espoused many times, myself. I've never researched it but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Tolkien influenced a lot of things....

 

 

Well the Lios Alfar were born of Ymir, and were described as tall, fair and playful in the sagas. While the Svart/Dokk Alfar were described as maggot pale, hideous and deformed. But both had strange powers and knew many secrets, Tolkiens Elves and Dwarves were probably born from these descriptions. The Dwarves however recieved far more attention in the Sagas, from the making of the treasures of Asgard to the Sigurdsaga. There's a little bit of Celtic Sidhe in most Elven descriptions as well.

 

I don't know why Elves in D&D have become midgets, or where this came from.

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Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.

I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin.

 

Tea for the teapot!

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I don't know why Elves in D&D have become midgets, or where this came from.

D&D Elves aren't midgets they just aren't super tall.  I think their average is like 5'8" - 5'10" area.

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About time they increased the height, they used to be around five feet in AD&D, if I remember correctly.


Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.

I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin.

 

Tea for the teapot!

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This would be the most... differing take on the Elf as a race in any game I think. Perhaps not a "good way" to depict the Elf, but it'd be a new take on a Player chosen race I think.

1_2D00_mage_2D00_a.jpg_2D00_500x400.jpg

The concept I have in my mind is inspired by this. Still human-like, and human-sized or shorter (or even taller), long thin arms. Sharp teeth and longer ears. I'm thinking of something like the Elvaan from Final Fantasy XI, but more sinister looking (One could combine the picture/head+nails+slenderness of the Dark Elf from FFIV above with the Elvaan body). A Slenderman Elf :p

EDIT: This post is a bit flirting with the question(s) "What hasn't been done before?" or "How can you innovate something that has been done before?" a la "Keep the core, but represent it differently".

Edited by Osvir

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EDIT: This post is a bit flirting with the question(s) "What hasn't been done before?" or "How can you innovate something that has been done before?" a la "Keep the core, but represent it differently".

I have to point out the irony here Osvir.  You are using that picture as an example of where you think elves could go, saying "something like Elvaan from Final Fantasy XI"...  I have to ask.  You do know that picture is concept art by Yo****aka Amano specifically for Final Fantasy 1 and is a "Dark Elf" right? ..... Okay so now a guys name is a curse word :p?  You go word filter, you go :p

Edited by Karkarov

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Did you read the post...? It's not where I think elves could go, but rather what I think could make elves "different" than what is commonly/traditionally perceived (a.k.a. Tolkien Elves).

And it is actually from Final Fantasy IV, and it is the Dark Elf that has stolen the Earth Crystal that you have to go after ;)

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I have to point out the irony here Osvir.  You are using that picture as an example of where you think elves could go, saying "something like Elvaan from Final Fantasy XI"...  I have to ask.  You do know that picture is concept art by Yo****aka Amano specifically for Final Fantasy 1 and is a "Dark Elf" right? ..... Okay so now a guys name is a curse word :p?  You go word filter, you go :p

 

Here, feel free to copy-paste it:

"Yoshi⁠taka Amano"

Edited by vv221

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Pratchett's Elves were also pretty boss.

 

I'm a fan of the Tolkein elf, and to a lesser extent the D&D/Warhammer derivatives.

 

I'm happy with the elves of PoE thus far, although a great deal will depend upon how they are explored in PoE's game itself.

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Its because Obsidian needs to be more politically correct in todays politically correct world and diminish the differences between all races that they can, otherwise it would appear racialist of them to suggest that elves are in any way different from humans. Because obviously they are just as good, not that they couldnt otherwise be as good in any other way than actually being just like humans :))))))))))))

I feel comfortable dismissing that theory in this instance. Pillars of Eternity has player option races that were created in-house that appear to be quite different from humans, so it is disingenuous to imply that Obsidian objects to obvious differences in general. My assumption is that elves are similar to humans in Pillars of Eternity because elves are physically similar to humans in most fiction and that there is little point in including elves at all if you're not going to be leveraging some of that familiarity. Honestly, I'm not even too fussed about whether the elves end up tall or short, since again, throughout various works you have elves that vary from Tolkien tall to Keebler tiny. The defining characteristics of elves in most fiction typically have less to do with gross anatomy and everything to do with lifespan and cultural differences, and we know rather little about what those differences will be in Pillars of Eternity.

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Elves can't breed? Is there a finite amount in the world?

 

Elves can't successffully breed with humans and vice versa, their union does not produce offspring it seems. Thus they are two seperate species rather than races of a species.

 

Of course Humans and Elves do have their own races within their species, can't remember the names right now, it'll be on the Wiki I assume.

 

So with an elf girl you are 100% sure it won't be your kid. Cool stuff :)

Edited by Killyox

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Elves can't breed? Is there a finite amount in the world?

 

Elves can't successffully breed with humans and vice versa, their union does not produce offspring it seems. Thus they are two seperate species rather than races of a species.

 

Of course Humans and Elves do have their own races within their species, can't remember the names right now, it'll be on the Wiki I assume.

 

On a semi-related note, the way it worked in Dragon Age: Origins was always odd as hell to me. If people don't recall, in the world of Dragon Age, elves can breed with humans, but the offspring is always human.

 

This is then promptly casually ignored by the marginalized and oppressed elven population in almost all regards, even though you'd expect to see the average elf vehemently opposed to human-elven unions, since it's practically racial suicide in a very pronounced way quite far from the "race"-mixing you see in most other settings or the real world.

 

The decision to exclude the whole half-everything mess from the world of PoE appeals to me not only because it makes a fair amount of sense (why'd dwarves or elves be able to breed with humans, but not with eachother, and why would they then be considered separate species' or races, and not just sub-races or ethnicities?) but also because it means that all those half-everything unions never even get to become an issue, bar arguably some pretty significant breeding-mumbo-jumbo such as performed by gods (see Godlikes, which are, awesomely, infertile).

 

In fact, I can see this being part of the excuse as to why certain comparatively different populations can live together in relative peace, such as Orlans, Humans, Elves and Dwarves living together amicably.

 

I can also see how it'd lead to an insanely successful bordello business.

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Elves can't breed? Is there a finite amount in the world?

 

Elves can't successffully breed with humans and vice versa, their union does not produce offspring it seems. Thus they are two seperate species rather than races of a species.

 

Of course Humans and Elves do have their own races within their species, can't remember the names right now, it'll be on the Wiki I assume.

 

On a semi-related note, the way it worked in Dragon Age: Origins was always odd as hell to me. If people don't recall, in the world of Dragon Age, elves can breed with humans, but the offspring is always human.

 

This is then promptly casually ignored by the marginalized and oppressed elven population in almost all regards, even though you'd expect to see the average elf vehemently opposed to human-elven unions, since it's practically racial suicide in a very pronounced way quite far from the "race"-mixing you see in most other settings or the real world.

 

The decision to exclude the whole half-everything mess from the world of PoE appeals to me not only because it makes a fair amount of sense (why'd dwarves or elves be able to breed with humans, but not with eachother, and why would they then be considered separate species' or races, and not just sub-races or ethnicities?) but also because it means that all those half-everything unions never even get to become an issue, bar arguably some pretty significant breeding-mumbo-jumbo such as performed by gods (see Godlikes, which are, awesomely, infertile).

 

In fact, I can see this being part of the excuse as to why certain comparatively different populations can live together in relative peace, such as Orlans, Humans, Elves and Dwarves living together amicably.

 

I can also see how it'd lead to an insanely successful bordello business.

 

 

Would you consider becoming a sociologist, sir? I can hook you up with some of the cool guys at Lund!

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