The game looks and feels abysmal in every way

[Azrael Ultima]

@Sensuki true, but most of those projects have had a good deal smaller bestiaries, or many of the beasts have shared rigs (e.g. small, medium, large humanoids).

A tried and true technique since the 8-bit days. After 20 hours of killing green skull faced underground monkeys i am now finally strong enough to challenge blue skull faced underground monkeys.

[Monte Carlo]

And when you wonder in the future how come there are no deep RPG games anymore, you can think of the nostalgia idiots who worship at the altar of false dichotomy.

 

 

Kiddo you are getting better. I like altar bit, a lot.

 

C+

 

Carry on. Seriously.

[ManifestedISO]

I'm saying he's a Germanic hedge troll variant, the only species that puts effort into precisely accurate spelling. 

[Lephys]

Troll. Why feed?

Because trolls are people, too.

 

Really, though, I don't think he's trolling. I just think he's arbitrarily obsessed wit his own opinion, and is allergic to objectivity.

 

He's like an advanced graphic zealot or something. "Why should there be advanced graphics in the game? BECAUSE ADVANCED GRAPHICS!"

[HoonDing]

[illathid]

 

According to Wikipedia, Fallout's budget was $3,000,000 in 1997, which when adjusted for inflation gives us $4,445,831.

 

However, animating sprites takes a lot less work than trying to do the same thing with 3d models.

 

Incorrect.

For low-res, tiny sprites, it may not take long (but more than you'd think)

 

Large sprites are usually renders of 3D models (meaning you had to make and animate a 3D model anyway)

 

 

Would you classify Fallout 1's sprites as low-res, tiny sprites? I may be wrong, but I strongly suspect that for any given death animation present in Fallout 1, it would take longer to do an equivalent animation in PoE.

[Jon of the Wired]

 

 

According to Wikipedia, Fallout's budget was $3,000,000 in 1997, which when adjusted for inflation gives us $4,445,831.

 

However, animating sprites takes a lot less work than trying to do the same thing with 3d models.

 

Incorrect.

For low-res, tiny sprites, it may not take long (but more than you'd think)

 

Large sprites are usually renders of 3D models (meaning you had to make and animate a 3D model anyway)

 

 

Would you classify Fallout 1's sprites as low-res, tiny sprites? I may be wrong, but I strongly suspect that for any given death animation present in Fallout 1, it would take longer to do an equivalent animation in PoE.

 

 

Fallout's sprites are renders of 3D models, so they were animated in much the same way PoE's models are.

[StrangeCat]

I have to wait a month more before I can really give an opinion on the game.  Are they going to have the same ugly stupid UI.  It lacks charm, it's just a bunch of boxes, it's pretty unprofessional to me.

 

And I could list a lot more but I think that list is on the Devs list and it's on the end, way at the end.  I am sure they will get to it when they are done squashing major bugs and fixing the battle system.

 

 

Trolls?  really everyone who says your just trolling... your showing you lack of intelligence in a conversation to even have a correct conversation with someone who doesn't agree with your opinion. 

Real Trolls are psychological psychopaths released on the web.

[solamon77]

I'd rather them focus on things that matter, like an amazing story and great tactical combat, than needless things like ragdoll physics. 

[solamon77]

 

What's particularly endearing about Malignacious's <cough> critiques is that most of them go directly against the concept of the game. This was made for us annoying nostalgia people, and at least I'm enjoying his upset at us a great deal. We've had enough ragdolls thrown at us at the expense of choice and consequence, writing in both quality and quantity, depth and breadth of lore, variety in bestiary, number and variety of classes and so on and so forth that it's positively delicious to have the boot on the other leg for once.

 

This attitude greatly saddens me. It will lead to the complete failure of this game and any future classic RPG games with depth.

You can't have just story and deep combat mechanics, you have to have amazing animations, combat flow, physicality, and adequate graphics. 

 

And when you wonder in the future how come there are no deep RPG games anymore, you can think of the nostalgia idiots who worship at the altar of false dichotomy.

 

This isn't meant to sound rude, but no you don't have to have these pointless things. You see, the great thing about Kickstarter is, we don't have to cater to people with your opinions on this subject anymore. It was the chase for better graphics, realistic physics, and more action oriented gameplay that had publishers believing traditional cRPGs weren't worth their time anymore.  

 

The people who backed this game get to decide whether or not this is the kind of game we want. All 78,000 of us have spoke up clearly, put our money where our mouths are, and made this game happen. I don't know if you follow these sort of things, but 3 of the top 5 highest grossing Kickstarter video game projects have been for games like this one: traditional cRPGs. So as far as which person here is arguing on a false premise, it seems like that person is... wait for it... you. :-D

[illathid]

 

 

 

According to Wikipedia, Fallout's budget was $3,000,000 in 1997, which when adjusted for inflation gives us $4,445,831.

 

However, animating sprites takes a lot less work than trying to do the same thing with 3d models.

 

Incorrect.

For low-res, tiny sprites, it may not take long (but more than you'd think)

 

Large sprites are usually renders of 3D models (meaning you had to make and animate a 3D model anyway)

 

 

Would you classify Fallout 1's sprites as low-res, tiny sprites? I may be wrong, but I strongly suspect that for any given death animation present in Fallout 1, it would take longer to do an equivalent animation in PoE.

 

 

Fallout's sprites are renders of 3D models, so they were animated in much the same way PoE's models are.

 

 

Well this death animation looks like it was mostly hand drawn, not modeled:

[Amelyssan The Blackhearted]

Wow you can really tell the difference between the new kids of gaming and the people who backed this game due to it's Infinity Engine background. All the new kids have the typical modern attitude of " gameplay is secondary to looking good it's all about art and animation" while the BG fans are all It's a tribute game it's supposed to look old. And for *uses self control* "people" like Malignacious talking about this game "Ruining Obsidian's Reputation" because of it's graphical quality. You need to think about who the audience is for the game (in this case the major audience was fans of Infinity Engine Games) The game was advertised as a turn back to the days of BG IWD and PS:T. It would be more likely to ruin Obsidian's reputation to add all the modern features you're talking about than not because that would be false advertising conflicting with what was described on the Kickstarter and Obsidian pages. 

 

btw considering all this was in the description if you don't like that type of thing why did you back this game? or didn't you read the description?

Edited October 2, 2014 by Amelyssan The Blackhearted

[rheingold]

Wow you can really tell the difference between the new kids of gaming and the people who backed this game due to it's Infinity Engine background. All the new kids have the typical modern attitude of " gameplay is secondary to looking good it's all about art and animation" while the BG fans are all It's a tribute game it's supposed to look old. And for *uses self control* "people" like Malignacious talking about this game "Ruining Obsidian's Reputation" because of it's graphical quality. You need to think about who the audience is for the game (in this case the major audience was fans of Infinity Engine Games) The game was advertised as a turn back to the days of BG IWD and PS:T. It would be more likely to ruin Obsidian's reputation to add all the modern features you're talking about than not because that would be false advertising conflicting with what was described on the Kickstarter and Obsidian pages. 

 

btw considering all this was in the description if you don't like that type of thing why did you back this game? or didn't you read the description?

 

This x1000. I think the problem is people just don't damn well read. Obsidian were obvious about what they wanted and where they were planning to take the game. It's not about the animations - or graphic fidelity, or combat - its about the story, the backdrop and the companions. If the game does not deliver with that - then I will be irate at Obsidian.

[Ink Blot]

Wow you can really tell the difference between the new kids of gaming and the people who backed this game due to it's Infinity Engine background. All the new kids have the typical modern attitude of " gameplay is secondary to looking good it's all about art and animation" while the BG fans are all It's a tribute game it's supposed to look old. And for *uses self control* "people" like Malignacious talking about this game "Ruining Obsidian's Reputation" because of it's graphical quality. You need to think about who the audience is for the game (in this case the major audience was fans of Infinity Engine Games) The game was advertised as a turn back to the days of BG IWD and PS:T. It would be more likely to ruin Obsidian's reputation to add all the modern features you're talking about than not because that would be false advertising conflicting with what was described on the Kickstarter and Obsidian pages. 

 

btw considering all this was in the description if you don't like that type of thing why did you back this game? or didn't you read the description?

This has been pointed out to him time and time again and he just doesn't get it. We're all just a bunch of "nostalgia idiots who worship at the altar of false dichotomy" and we're going to be responsible for there being no future CRPGs. So yeah, don't bother.

[constantine]

 

 

Yup.. I'm not gonna argue with you about standards. Sorry that this game ain't for you, but hey, there's always Titan Quest right.

 

Are you gonna make an actual argument or observation about anything anytime soon?

 

Higher content per post ratio, please.

 

I've got one for you:

 

Guys, stop feeding the troll ! Let'im wither and die in misery, alone !

[Lephys]

I hate to tell you, but, technically, jumping in and telling people to stop feeding the troll is actually still feeding the troll. It's like a delightful snack between meals.

 

Anywho, the biggest thing I don't understand is why Malignacious seems to think that nostalgia and quality visuals are somehow two combatants in the thunderdome.

 

There are different types of quality graphics. Hell, there are purely 2D games that look AMAZETASTIC, without any physics or "advanced graphics."

 

The nostalgia is mainly for the mechanical aspects of the game -- the class system setup, the leveling, the narrative, the application of character factors to dialogue, the ability to explore, etc.

 

Really, the most significantly graphical nostalgic aspect would be the approach to the graphics -- the hand-done 2D environments and such, a component of which is the fixed camera perspective.

 

Also, a game with a fixed camera perspective probably gains the least from ultra-advanced 3D visuals and physics. Especially with things like projectiles, etc. You're watching some people fire bolts and arrows from like 50 yards up in the sky, from the same angle all the time. What difference would there be between perfect physics simulations of projectiles striking people and/or people getting knocked about, and simple animations of the same things happening? Not much.

 

Lastly, if the game "looks and feels abysmal in every way" then what good would it do to "fix" the graphics? "Oh, the rest of the game is still horrible, but at least you blew several million more dollars on eye candy."

 

Making a graphical "improvement" that in no way supports the gameplay/mechanics is like making a cake out of plastic; who cares how pretty it is if you can't even use it?

[Bryy]

Obsidian, please cancel this project

... what?

 

Like...

 

Seriously?

[BAdler]

Hey, guys. The OP has stated his opinion and it is noted. I am closing this thread because I don't see anything constructive coming out of it.