Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II Enhanced Editions Announced

[Sargallath Abraxium]

...aye, Mum...

 

 

...WHO LUVS YA, BABY!!...

[meomao]

Its one full tool kit and half a game. Any comparison with BG, Torment, Fallout and any later BW RPG, even KOTOR, is a joke.

 

Well, I agree, but we must admit that at the end the chore idea behind NWN was the multyplayer: good or bad, it was all about user content and in that sense it was a good game imho and one of the few risks Bioware has ever taken. The game wasn't developed to be played as a SP game and the community that grew up around NWN was brilliant.

 

Then only a minority of players experienced the MP part. I don't remember the figures but it was something like 20%. Considering that NWN+expansions have sold more or less 1,5 milion copies we're not talking of a lot of people and it would be hard to call it a a success. If it was a success, we would have seen a sequel from Bioware and not Obsidian.

 

Those numbers were given by Bioware's devs themselves during the development of DA:O and DA2 as a justification for the lack of effort on the DA tool-kit.

 

NWN was not a good SP game. Bioware exploited it with expansion and such (that were way better than the OC) just because there was a large majority of NWN player-base who could not care more about the MP and who just wanted another BG, imho.

Edited April 14, 2012 by meomao

[Drowsy Emperor]

Updates from Beamdog forums:

 

 

Friends of Baldur's Gate is the reddit and Cam can sign you up. We're trying to use it to build a clear priority list for features you would like to see included. Send us a feedback (using the side buttons on the Beamdog site) and I'll get Cameron to set you up.

- I don't understand this stuff about reddit.

 

We screwed up on the update and didn't allow enough lead time for approvals. My fault. No update again this week.

We are planning on making mods work on the iPad, but we aren't there yet. With multiplayer, I agree the issues really bog down game play. Concurrent store usage is high on our fixes list.

As for original BG sound bugs, if you only knew what the original code was trying to do you'd be amazed it worked at all. BG was multi-threaded before the team really understood what threading was. The end result, a ton of critical sections and a crazy amount of no-ops as different threads stall out trying to access the same memory. That's been Machete'd away now, so the code is much easier to follow. Cam's been joking about cutting the UI code from 10,000 lines to 400 and he's making good headway on the screens.

 

With rebuilding all the content not an option, we examined over-painting the existing backgrounds. We were unhappy with the cost vs the quality, so we made the decision to focus our content creation on new content and attempt procedural content filtering on the old stuff. We're still experimenting with the filtering. I have high hopes, but only time will tell.

Edited April 14, 2012 by Drowsy Emperor

[Monte Carlo]

It's all sounding good so far, thanks for posting the updates Drowsy. I've played BG2 to death but haven't played BG1 for a long time so am looking forward to this immensely.

[Volourn]

"Considering that NWN+expansions have sold more or less 1,5 milion copies we're not talking of a lot of people and it would be hard to call it a a success. If it was a success, we would have seen a sequel from Bioware and not Obsidian."

 

L0LZ So.. KOTOR was a failure too?

 

P.S. NWN + expansions sold 3mil+. Boith BG games + exapnsions sold 5mil combined. Why do people make up lies?

 

P.S.S. After KOTOR, BIo simply wanted a break from others' IPs.

[Drowsy Emperor]

New twitter stuff, nothing big here.

 

...compression technology has come a long way since#baldursgate shipped. The audio quality will be superior

 

We are generating the background art in 3DS Max [for the new content]and rendering to 2D background images. Poly counts are obscene

 

 

We've looked at the enemy AI in #bgee. We won't mess too much with the default difficulty settings. For our new content they are nasty

 

Crazy run time patching. We'll fix some of the bugs, but some of the changes such as armor equip in combat maybe not

 

Heading into the office for some undisturbed 3D modeling time on the new temple interior

Edited April 14, 2012 by Drowsy Emperor

[meomao]

 

L0LZ So.. KOTOR was a failure too?

 

No, infact they developed TOR MMO.

 

P.S. NWN + expansions sold 3mil+. Boith BG games + exapnsions sold 5mil combined. Why do people make up lies?

 

Because they aren't lies. The whole NWN franchise sold 3+ million copies: NWN2, MOTB and SOZ included. Btw, the 1,5 million copies number was reported by some Bioware devs in the forums.

 

P.S.S. After KOTOR, BIo simply wanted a break from others' IPs.

 

But they dropped the entire idea of end user content. Why if it was such a success? Sadly, it wasn't.

[Zoraptor]

NWN +expansions sold 3 million*, at least according to Bioware's old website, same for KOTOR. Up to their sale to EA they had sales figures on their site for all games (except those which sold poorly, like Jade Empire, where they just talked about how critically acclaimed it was).

 

BG1/2 5 m

NWN (inc expansions) 3 m

KOTOR 3 m

Jade Empire a bit over a million, given its NPD figures.

ME1 2 mill (would have been after ~six months, so probably around 2.5 m lifetime)

(DAO 3.5-4 m

ME2 2.5 m

DA2 1.6 m

ME3 2 m+ after a month)

 

Really though, all of the BGs/ NWN and KOTOR would have been highly successful financially.

 

*Best guess for NWN2 would be 2 million+. Certainly sold more than a million in 2006 as 1 million+ was cited in their results by the german investors who kicked in a lot of funding (BVT; not quite so successful with their Arcania funding). Everything I've seen suggested that Bioware abandoned D&D because they hated the new morality clauses and nannying from Hasbro and had pretty much decided on Dragon Age being their owned fantasy franchise same as ME became their owned space fantasy franchise.

[Delfosse]

...compression technology has come a long way since#baldursgate shipped. The audio quality will be superior

That's the first real thing that's gonna be an actual improvement. Although I really liked the old compressed voices in obviously low quality with gurgle noise. There was something about it.

 

Well, I agree, but we must admit that at the end the chore idea behind NWN was the multyplayer

Not at all. It was added as an extra feature, and they've said it themselves. It showed too. It was so buggy, the server could never hold for more than 2 hours, at which point memory leaks would lead to constant swap-ins/swap-outs and consequently huge time response, 2000-4000 ms wasn't anything unusual. The server had to be restarted all the time. It also used to just crash all of the sudden, quite often, and then everyone would have to wait till the admin got home.

And they couldn't care less. They didn't fix it in their numerous (20? 30?) updates.

Edited April 14, 2012 by Delfosse

[Volourn]

"No, infact they developed TOR MMO"

 

Not a sequel. tahtb was KOTOR2 which was developed by Obsidian. BIO passed on it. If your silly theory about NWN is true, KOTOR1 must of been a fialure since BIO passed on it. And, opted instead to make their own SWlike frnachise in ME which has been way more successful since theyd eveloped TWO sequels to it. L0LZ

 

 

"Because they aren't lies. The whole NWN franchise sold 3+ million copies: NWN2, MOTB and SOZ included."

 

No. NWN1 sold 3mil+ with the two expansions. BIo made it clear that NWN was their most successful game... until DA/ME series came along. That's right. more successful than either BG game or KOTOR. Take that sucka!

 

"But they dropped the entire idea of end user content. Why if it was such a success? Sadly, it wasn't. "

 

 

No, they didn't. DA1 has it. But, it sucked so much and unpopualr that it belongs in the garbage. NWN toolset and PM are some of the precursers to modern DLC. LMAO

 

 

"Not at all. It was added as an extra feature, and they've said it themselves. It showed too. It was so buggy, the server could never hold for more than 2 hours, at which point memory leaks would lead to constant swap-ins/swap-outs and consequently huge time response, 2000-4000 ms wasn't anything unusual. The server had to be restarted all the time. It also used to just crash all of the sudden, quite often, and then everyone would have to wait till the admin got home."

 

You on crack? NWN MP was very stable. I played it for eyars, and the servers are still running and still working fun 9albeit not quite a spopular as NWN's prime obviously since it's a near 10 year old game). The MP was not an added feature for NWN. Are you on crack? they had a live time dedciated to it, the toolset, and everything else. Lots of the patches and parts of ther expansion were also decidated to online play and modules.

 

LONG LIVE NWN DEATH TO BG!

[Bos_hybrid]

Not at all. It was added as an extra feature, and they've said it themselves.

 

No that was the SP campaign. The SP campaign was included after much crying from the Bio forums.

[Volourn]

No, the SP campaign was alreayd there. They were just seperate sample mods that they decided to connect into one big campaign. the thing that whining got was henchmen. They weren't going to have any joinable npcs at all becuase they were aiming for MP. That's why the npc quests are connect strictly by fetch quests. the characters themselevs have interesting backgrounds, and personality but the storylines are gipped due to the way it's put together.l

[Drowsy Emperor]

Dunno how many more nails Vol needs in NWN's coffin, but there's that: "From the creators of Baldur's Gate" on every NWN box and who here doesn't believe that sold the game more than the game sold itself?

[Monte Carlo]

God this is dull. Put Vol on ignore. I've had him there for two years. I've fond memories of the little scamp but the same thing in stereo *forever* was driving me nuts. I know he's in the thread somewhere because you're all replying... but why?

[Volourn]

"Dunno how many more nails Vol needs in NWN's coffin, but there's that: "From the creators of Baldur's Gate" on every NWN box and who here doesn't believe that sold the game more than the game sold itself?"

 

NWN sold because of BIo and the DnD license not BG.

[Bos_hybrid]

Dunno how many more nails Vol needs in NWN's coffin, but there's that: "From the creators of Baldur's Gate" on every NWN box and who here doesn't believe that sold the game more than the game sold itself?

 

 

So..... You're claiming BG players are a bunch of dumb sheep?

Edited April 15, 2012 by Bos_hybrid

[Drowsy Emperor]

Dunno how many more nails Vol needs in NWN's coffin, but there's that: "From the creators of Baldur's Gate" on every NWN box and who here doesn't believe that sold the game more than the game sold itself?

 

 

So..... You're claiming BG players are a bunch of dumb sheep?

 

No I'm making a perfectly logical assumption that the huge popularity of BG, that put Bioware on the map - had an impact on NWN sales. Haven't you ever bought a game without waiting for reviews because you trust the developer?

[Drowsy Emperor]

NWN sold because of BIo and the DnD license not BG.

 

Really? And which game made the Bioware name be worth a damn to most gamers?

 

Ah.

Edited April 15, 2012 by Drowsy Emperor

[Bos_hybrid]

No I'm making a perfectly logical assumption that the huge popularity of BG, that put Bioware on the map - had an impact on NWN sales. Haven't you ever bought a game without waiting for reviews because you trust the developer?

 

Devs don't get my trust, they get my money. And only if I like what I'm seeing, not some journalist behind a desk. Normally I can tell long before a review if I'm going to get a game. And of course I still get burned. (Witcher/Two worlds for examples)

 

So your opinion is that most of NWN buyers were BG people that didn't read previews or know what the game was when they purchased said game? Don't know about you but there is a lot of assumption in that idea. Sure there would of been some, but not the majority of purchasers. I tend to think, that many were drawn to said game because of BG, but bought/didn't buy based on what they knew about NWN.

 

Now if we were talking about BG>BG2/ME>2>3, I would be more inclined to agree with you.

Edited April 15, 2012 by Bos_hybrid

[Aedelric]

Different people are influenced by different things, some by a developer name, some by previous works, some by critics, some by friends. The smart ones make up their own opinion based solely of what they see of the game at hand.

 

Neverwinter was a solid game, it had faults in multiplayer and singleplayer, but at the time their was not much quite like it.

 

I loved BG just like everyone else at the time, but and enhanced edition can not solely rely on the name and content of the original to sell, the improvements/additions/fixes have to be worth a new purchase.

Edited April 15, 2012 by Aedelric

[Sargallath Abraxium]

...hehehe...ye kids gotta quit lettin' the dwarf bait ya's...ya want 'im ta quit the foolishness an' go play in traffic, quit feedin the Troll an' he'll waddle off ta an easier meal; take it from one...we all knows that the NeverWorkin' Right SP sucked shyte an' that Biowaaahnia been gettin' away wit' sellin' crap jus' cuz it carrries the "From the creators of Baldur's Gate" tag e'er since...an' it ain't like theys alone in that model; hells, Fergie & Co. still be livin' off the memory o' our precious Isle, Gods rest 'er...

 

 

...WHO LUVS YA, BABY!!...

[meomao]

No. NWN1 sold 3mil+ with the two expansions. BIo made it clear that NWN was their most successful game... until DA/ME series came along. That's right. more successful than either BG game or KOTOR. Take that sucka!

 

 

http://www.warcry.co...ights-2-Expands

 

Read the article. It's an official announcement by Atari (2007). 3 millions counting NWN2 and all the expansions to NWN1 but not MoTB and SOZ.

 

http://www.gamevorte...ights-2-pc.html

 

Read this one: another official announcement by Atari (2004). 2 millions for NWN1 + expansions.

 

Btw, it's not a contest . You don't have to troll me. I loved both games for different reasons. I would be glad to see a NWN3 with a good toolset.

Edited April 15, 2012 by meomao

[Volourn]

It say more than not the exact number. It's a fact that NWN1 and expansions have sold 3mil+. Yours econd link says NWN had sold 2mil PLUS before NWN2 was even released. You suggesting NWN hasn't sold a copy since then or that NWN2 + expansions sold less than a mil? Come on now, don't be silly.

 

I trust BIO and Atari more than you and your fantasy land. Only one trolling here is Boo.

 

 

"And which game made the Bioware name be worth a damn to most gamers?"

 

Who made that game? BIO. BIO earned their customers by making games people want to play, and they are still doing it despite the whining. That's why JE was considered a 'poor' seller despite reaching 1.5-2mil sales. Are you claiming KOTOR was so horrible that people avoided BIO's next game because of it? Come on now, don't be ridiculous. And, that JE was soa wesome that it convinced 3milish people to purchase ME1 DESPITE SELLING LESS THAN 2MIL ITSELF? LMAO

[meomao]

You suggesting NWN hasn't sold a copy since then or that NWN2 + expansions sold less than a mil? Come on now, don't be silly.

 

I suggest that NWN2 had sold 1+ million copies (wich is fair for a PC exclusive: same as the glorified TW2). The links above talked about the sales of the franchise before MoTB and SoZ (it was Atari's announcement of Mask of the Betrayer). And I suggest that NWN1 sales after 2004 are not that relevant considering that it's a game of 2002. Having said that, maybe I'm wrong: so if you can find me some piece of info about sales that contradicts my links above I will admit being wrong without any problem.

Edited April 15, 2012 by meomao

[Tigranes]

NWN2 definitely sold over a million.