Just bought the game

[Agent Crake]

Hello everyone,

 

After putting off the game after pre-release reviews, I had forgotten all about the game until yesterday when I spotted it in Tesco.

 

After finishing the first mission, I'm struggling to decide if its the worst game I have ever played this gen, or, if it deserves a sequal to allow the game to be made as it should have been.

 

Here are the things I like in the game so far...

 

The conversation system is the best I have ever seen. Even Mass Effect could take some influence in this.

The CQC works nicely enough, although a lung attack would have been nice, rather than having the player stuck to the floor from the first attack.

 

Ok, now the things I hate...

 

Whats with the gun combat? I'm facing guys 5 feet away and missing with torso or head shots. Its a good job the CQC is good, because gunplay is broke.

The main character has more shine than a barbie doll. TThe game is said to be an RPG, but I see no role play here as the mc is already chosen.

The actual animation is ok-ish, but should have been much better. The game feels like it could have been made for PS2.

Somehow the devs have managed to make hacking/unlocking mini games go back 10 years. These little games should be a nice break from the normal game, whilst also giving an exciting challenge. In your effort to be different, you have ruined this section.

 

But after everything that I hate about this game, I'm determined to see it through. Behind all this crap seems to be a great story, and should the gameplay been upto scratch, it could have been a contender to mass effect.

 

If I were to make a sequal for this game, here's what I would do....

 

Allow for full face customization of the mc's face. This would in turn allow for real role play through different playthroughs as well as add lots more community fun.

Get rid of the worst shooting system I have ever come across, and give it a proper one. When it comes to RPG shooters, I think mass effect can influence a good combat system.

[Sannom]

(1) The CQC works nicely enough, although a lung attack would have been nice, rather than having the player stuck to the floor from the first attack.

 

(2) Whats with the gun combat? I'm facing guys 5 feet away and missing with torso or head shots. Its a good job the CQC is good, because gunplay is broke.

 

(3) The main character has more shine than a barbie doll. TThe game is said to be an RPG, but I see no role play here as the mc is already chosen.

 

(1) You mean a "lunge attack", I presume? There is one, you just have to unblock it. I think it's around the fifth or seventh rank in CQC.

 

(2) Don't play it as a shooter, it's not intended to work that way. Pistols and Assault Rifles are meant to have their shots patiently lined up, and SMGs and shotguns are more 'in your face', so to speak. But even then, you would have to be cautious in their use and try to take profit of their Critical Hit mechanic.

 

(3) If we have to have a named protagonist, I've discovered that I prefer for the character to be fully named. It makes for more natural conversations instead of just having everyone call me by my last name.

[Flouride]

You can still make Thorton to be your Thorton and the choices you make actually matter in the game. Just because you can't fully customize his gender, face and name doesn't mean you can't fully play a role. And it gives the game more cinematic feeling when the npcs actually say your name instead of using different ways to circle around it (or leaving that out of the sentence...)

 

After all the best crpg ever made PS:T had a named character whose gender, name nor face you couldn't customize at all.

[kirottu]

(3) If we have to have a named protagonist, I've discovered that I prefer for the character to be fully named. It makes for more natural conversations instead of just having everyone call me by my last name.

 

I think it was in Rebel Assault 2 where some long lost friend called me "rookie one".

 

To OP:

 

With pistols and machine guns you have to aim for a moment. When the aiming circle thingy starts to shrink your bullets will hit what

[Agent Crake]

Yeah I know how the critical shot works, but the weapons in the game are pretty pointless.

 

What they should have done is allow for normal gunplay, shot to the leg stuns, arm shot drops weapons momentarily, head shot is a 1 hit kill unless wearing a helmet. Then give each gun a couple of kick arse perks....

 

Pistol :

Critical hit - Takes off a percentage of health depending where hit.

Multiple targets - Stops time and allows player to empty entire clip into desired targets (enemy & explosive cannister for huge damage combo).

 

Shotgun :

Extinction - Allows player to 1 hit kill enemies for a duration of 5 seconds or until load runs out.

Buck - Knocks everyone down within the blast zone.

 

SMG :

Incinerate - Causes fir damage.

Ripper - Destroys enemy armour.

 

Assault Rifle :

Sight beyond sight - Allow the rifle to zoom in for 10 seconds, causing critical hits to enemies ffurther away that couldn't otherwise be hit.

Genocide - Slows down time and gives player ability to cause devastating damage against enemy or destroy vehicle armour.

[Purkake]

If only you had been around 2 years ago, mate.

[C2B]

If only you had been around 2 years ago, mate.

 

Nothing would have changed as it was a design mandate by SEGA?

[Agent Crake]

Well I did join up a few weeks berfore the game was released. Iwas a 360 gamer back in those days...,ahh good times.

 

If it wasn't for gamers getting there pre-orders a few days earlier and sobbing at how let down they were by the game, I would have had it on day 1.

To be honest though, Pukake. I don't put all the fault towards Obsidian. Ever since the Dreamcast was released, SEGA have done nothing but fudge up with marketing.

 

If I remember correctly, AP was released very close to a highly anticipated game release. It may even have been Red Dead, but I remember favouring this game to buy first. The truth is though, that even if the actual gameplay of this game had been top notch, it still would have failed due to the fact that SEGA cannot market **** to a fly, simply because they don't know how to.

 

The game had next to no marketing, even a day before release people still didn't have a clue what the game was, as they were to concerned with the big game that had been all over the press. SEGA used to be the best, now they behave like they have to work with the lights off in fear of going over budget.

 

Alpha Protocol needed a budget the size of Mass Effect for this to be as big and well made as it deserved to be. Instead it feels like SEGA just slapped the logo on the game and hoped for the best. In doing so it did no favours to Obsidian, as well as kill off what should have turned into a franchise that could have rivaled Mass Effect, or eventually surpase it.

 

But there could still be hope for AP, just not this gen. Metal Gear Solid became one of the best series in the last 15 years, but when the very first game was made, wow was it ****ing ****!.

 

AP still has a chance to resurrect next gen, but on this gen its rep has been destroyed. You can fudge up a sequal to an amazing original, as people will have hope for the third to be better. What you can't do is fudge it up first time round, as gamers won't forgive or forget....

 

But there is always next gen.

Edited May 28, 2011 by Gorth
Bad language

[Purkake]

If only you had been around 2 years ago, mate.

 

Nothing would have changed as it was a design mandate by SEGA?

It's like you don't even know me, man.

 

Agent Crake can be excused for being new, I guess.

[Karl the Unfettered]

Just ignore Purkake, Crake, he has an intense loathing of everything Obsidian has ever done, Alpha Protocol in particular; makes a fellow wonder why he hangs out on Obsidian's forums, eh?

 

Anyway. Yeah, the weapons are pointless for the most part; I did a playthrough recently with Martial Arts and Endurance as my specialties, and it was hugely epic running around beating the tar out of bad guys with my bare hands while they shot futilely at me. The few shots you do have to take are easily accomplished with your pistol, even without the higher levels offered by specializing; fun times all around.

[Eternith]

I have finished Alpha Protocol JUST NOW! And I have one thing to point out to the people at Obsidian...

Thank you for the Deus Ex of the 21st century! ...and blame SEGA for the bugs, those bastards...

Truly a shining jewel among the other games today... To bad that shine is being buried by all the crap from more and more "true" RPGs that have less RP in them than Grand Theft Auto...

Anyway, THANK YOU!

[Purkake]

Just ignore Purkake, Crake, he has an intense loathing of everything Obsidian has ever done, Alpha Protocol in particular; makes a fellow wonder why he hangs out on Obsidian's forums, eh?

That's somewhat unfair, Mask of the Betrayer was great, as was most of KotOR II. Liking stuff just because Obsidian made it seems a bit... fanatic.

Edited May 29, 2011 by Purkake

[Dabu]

Liking stuff just because Obsidian made it seems a bit... fanatic.

Maybe because their games are just the best cRPGs this generation...? Role-playing elements are the main feature and they're better comparing to any other title made during last 10 years.

 

It's all about role-playing and many RPG-fans like Obsidian.

Edited May 29, 2011 by Dabu

[Purkake]

Sometimes being the best of the worst still isn't good enough. But I guess we just have different standards.

 

Anyway, my point was that Karl was selling me short.

[Tale]

Anyway, my point was that Karl was selling me short.

I always have imagined you as somewhere around 5' to 5'6", myself.

[Nightshape]

Anyway, my point was that Karl was selling me short.

I always have imagined you as somewhere around 5' to 5'6", myself.

 

Likewise I imagine you as a 2' something rabbit.

[Alpha]

Gunplay isn't broke...the problem is that you don't understant how the weapons system work. You need choose the weapons that you want to after and learn their pros and con. Once you realize that you will find that the game is not a regular TPS where you can go ala Rambo killing enemies. In this game you need take your time or think before shoot.

[Agent Crake]

Gunplay isn't broke...the problem is that you don't understant how the weapons system work. You need choose the weapons that you want to after and learn their pros and con. Once you realize that you will find that the game is not a regular TPS where you can go ala Rambo killing enemies. In this game you need take your time or think before shoot.

 

I understood the shooting right from the start as I read the instructions. This is why I am in the opinion that the gunplay is broke. Whilst you cannot do much damage by having the cursor over the enemy, the enemy takes off your health with every hit.

 

But enough about the gunplay as the game is dead to most. Instead, why the hell was this ever considered an RPG?

[Purkake]

Ouch, this is the third "why is X considered an RPG" in as many days. It is beginning to look like a conspiracy.

[Agent Crake]

Ouch, this is the third "why is X considered an RPG" in as many days. It is beginning to look like a conspiracy.

 

There seems to be quite a few games that claim to be RPG's, yet show no sign of roleplay.

 

AP doesn't even allow for gender or name change so how is that roleplay?

 

Games I would consider to be RPG's on console...

 

Mass Effect series.

Elder Scrolls.

Fallout series.

Dragon Age series.

 

So with AP having no name or gender change, the same face and no choice to be good, bad or nuetral. What is it that makes it an RPG? Is it it due to poor animation, bugs and glitches and the ability to carry objects that people think thats what roleplay means?

[Dabu]

So with AP having no name or gender change, the same face and no choice to be good, bad or nuetral. What is it that makes it an RPG?

Choices and consequences? Relationship with others? Geez, from the titles you mentioned Alpha Protocol is the biggest role-playing game and it don't have to show your alignment on a fancy bar. So - according to your thinking - also Planescape: Torment isn't an RPG. Cool.

[Agent Crake]

So with AP having no name or gender change, the same face and no choice to be good, bad or nuetral. What is it that makes it an RPG?

Choices and consequences? Relationship with others? Geez, from the titles you mentioned Alpha Protocol is the biggest role-playing game and it don't have to show your alignment on a fancy bar. So - according to your thinking - also Planescape: Torment isn't an RPG. Cool.

 

I've never heard of Planescape..which console is that for?

 

Are you a PC gamer by any chance?

[Dabu]

I've never heard of Planescape..which console is that for?

 

Are you a PC gamer by any chance?

Yea, Torment is on PC. I'm not a PC gamer though. I have Xbox 360, but I played the most important titles on PC.

 

RPGs are not necessary mainly about creating your own character from a scratch, they're also about role-playing that character, having an influence on the universe, relationship with NPCs and your reputation with them.

 

And let's take The Elder Scrolls for an example - where do you have role-playing your character in them? Yes, of course - you can create one, choose your own gender, race and class. But what else? The only *choice* you get after that is which quest will you choose to do first. You don't *role-play* your character and it doesn't even matter who you are, what race you are, what gender you are and everything is opened to you. It's meaningless, 'cause it's all about statistics, not role-play.

 

So, Alpha Protocol went into the opposite direction - in exchange for choosing your own gender and race it gave you possibility to have a real influence on the world and other characters.

 

Of course you don't have to like that, but it's an RPG.

[Agent Crake]

I've never heard of Planescape..which console is that for?

 

Are you a PC gamer by any chance?

Yea, Torment is on PC. I'm not a PC gamer though. I have Xbox 360, but I played the most important titles on PC.

 

RPGs are not necessary mainly about creating your own character from a scratch, they're also about role-playing that character, having an influence on the universe, relationship with NPCs and your reputation with them.

 

And let's take The Elder Scrolls for an example - where do you have role-playing your character in them? Yes, of course - you can create one, choose your own gender, race and class. But what else? The only *choice* you get after that is which quest will you choose to do first. You don't *role-play* your character and it doesn't even matter who you are, what race you are, what gender you are and everything is opened to you. It's meaningless, 'cause it's all about statistics, not role-play.

 

So, Alpha Protocol went into the opposite direction - in exchange for choosing your own gender and race it gave you possibility to have a real influence on the world and other characters.

 

Of course you don't have to like that, but it's an RPG.

 

I get where your coming from, but that would make every single game fit in the RPG category.

 

As for Oblivion. It becomes roleplay when you don't stick to the main plot. The amount of ways you can roleplay in that game is amazing.

 

AP is just a game that has a great conversation system. Everything else is linear in what it offers.

[Dabu]

I get where your coming from, but that would make every single game fit in the RPG category.

So in every single game there are multiple ways to talk to the people, gain their trust, make friendships and allies and have a big influence on the plot? : ) I don't think so.

 

AP is one of the three games where I am surprised every time I play it, 'cause there are so many alternatives.

As for Oblivion. It becomes roleplay when you don't stick to the main plot.

Where? "Go everywhere you want and kill mobs"? : D