Dragon Age

[Monte Carlo]

^ FWIW, the gameplay videos shown above rather prove my point.... the muscle-bound warrior in comedy plate (straight outta Diablo) and the cleavage-tastic mage (something Bio suggested they were moving away from, part of my snobby elitist tastes include a growing disdain for casual sexism in games).

 

Which is a shame because apart from that as a tactical combat engine in a CRPG it looks very much like my cup of tea. The charge of vanilla, cookie-cutter high fantasy however remains on the record, and that video is exhibit 'A.'

 

Cheers

MC

[Kaftan Barlast]

I'm not going to defend my taste in anything, because it's subjective.

 

 

Im just going to put it out there blatantly and honestly: my taste is better than yours.

[Monte Carlo]

I'm not going to defend my taste in anything, because it's subjective.

 

 

Im just going to put it out there blatantly and honestly: my taste is better than yours.

 

[Kaftan Barlast]

 

[Slowtrain]

I hope Obsidian is paying attention and is smart enough to put some cleavage in Alpha Protocol. Probably an extra hundrd thousand potential sales RIGHT THERE.

 

LCD, ftw.

[Morgoth]

Combat of the provided videos looks awful. I can't believe Bioware worked secretly the last 7-8 years (?) on that game and all they've managed to do is making the combat look exactly like Kotor/NWN/JE, just with more delay. The more I see from this game, the less excited I'm getting about it.

Edited April 6, 2009 by Morgoth

[Volourn]

"Lowest common denominator isn't necessarily pejorative, is it?"

 

Yes, it is.

 

 

"So, call me an elitist snob in petty ad hominem insults if you wish"

 

Referring to people as the 'lowest common denominator' is the very defintion of ad hominem.

 

 

P.S. The fact that the combat looks like previous BIO games is awesome.

[Monte Carlo]

Referring to people as the 'lowest common denominator' is the very defintion of ad hominem.

 

Huh? Try reading the post for a change before hitting the add reply button. I described the setting as lowest common denominator. No single person.

 

Alternatively, you could apologize for getting the wrong end of the stick, but I suspect that's too much to ask for.

[Azure79]

Combat of the provided videos looks awful. I can't believe Bioware worked secretly the last 7-8 years (?) on that game and all they've managed to do is making the combat look exactly like Kotor/NWN/JE, just with more delay. The more I see from this game, the less excited I'm getting about it.

 

I think it looks worse than the previous games. At least in KoTOR lightsabers would clash and there were fancy parries and things that made the combat interesting to watch. In the combat video none of those things seem to really happen.

 

Hopefully, they'll add more combat animations before final release. Its not a major point for me since I expect to play most of the game in isometric view, but still better animations would be welcome.

[Niten_Ryu]

Animations in general should get more resources in modern game development. Too many developers focus on adding latest shaders or other graphical blizz but at the same time animations are like from 10 years ago.

[Meshugger]

Combat of the provided videos looks awful. I can't believe Bioware worked secretly the last 7-8 years (?) on that game and all they've managed to do is making the combat look exactly like Kotor/NWN/JE, just with more delay. The more I see from this game, the less excited I'm getting about it.

 

I think it looks worse than the previous games. At least in KoTOR lightsabers would clash and there were fancy parries and things that made the combat interesting to watch. In the combat video none of those things seem to really happen.

 

Hopefully, they'll add more combat animations before final release. Its not a major point for me since I expect to play most of the game in isometric view, but still better animations would be welcome.

 

Good point. And Niten_Ryu scores the same as well.

 

What these animations need are parrying with either weapon or shield of choice, counter-strikes for a successful block and so on. These ideas should also be implemented for spells and other factors that can change the players attributes, such as nullifing a spell with strong resistance, countering a fear spell with strong will etc. Critical strikes would imply extra blood and gore....I think that I could go on for all day.

 

All of these might be considered as superficial fluff, but it is that kind of fluff that many people would appriciate. Even the lowest common denominator!

[Magister Lajciak]

I think the game-footage looks awesome. I really don't know what kind of expectation people had for this game if they expected even better.

[Gromnir]

"Lowest common denominator isn't necessarily pejorative, is it?"

 

Yes, it is.

 

 

"So, call me an elitist snob in petty ad hominem insults if you wish"

 

Referring to people as the 'lowest common denominator' is the very defintion of ad hominem.

 

 

P.S. The fact that the combat looks like previous BIO games is awesome.

 

vol's latin sucks... or his logic sucks.

 

*shrug*

 

am not sure how the internet screwed up the ad hominem logic fallacy for so many people.

 

ad hominem, w/o the "argumentum" prefix, simply means "to the person/man". ad hominem does not = insult.

 

an argumentum ad hominem Logic Fallacy ain't = insult neither. Gromnir can call vol a yutz and a schnook every day and twice on sunday and we ain't necessarily ever gonna be making an argumentum ad hominem logic fallacy. is only an argumentum ad hominem if you is claiming that an argument fails BECAUSE of some defect in the arguer.

 

if Gromnir could track down the clown who pied-piper-of-Hamlin'd you peoples into following his infernal tune, we would beat him to death with our copy o' Der Wille zur Macht. (nietsche had a kinda genius for insulting his detractors w/o ever resorting to argumentum ad hominem... is kinda our role-model.)

 

regardless, don't be using stuff if you not know what it is meaning.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

btw, vol is the guy we is responding to, but is more a matter o' coincidence than anything else. am seeing "ad hominem" used wrong so ubiquitous that am guessing that more folks use wrong than does right.

Edited April 7, 2009 by Gromnir

[Volourn]

wut?

[Tigranes]

Gromnir smash stupid people for their lateen.

[Hurlshort]

wut?

 

Seconded.

 

But I never understand anything Gromnir posts.

[taks]

<rant>

yup.

 

btw, i've seen the screwed up ad hominem references referred to as the "ad hominem fallacy fallacy."

 

taks

[Maria Caliban]

For those of you who are still confused.

 

Maria: Dragon Age is awesome

taks: Maria is an idiot. Dragon Age is crap.

 

Not an ad hominem

 

Maria: I love Dragon Age.

taks: Dragon Age is crap and everyone who likes it is an idiot.

 

Still not an ad hominem

 

Maria: Dragon Age = Best RPG ever?

taks: **** you, you *****!!

 

Nope, not an ad hominem

 

Maria: There's nothing wrong with romances in RPGs.

taks: Of course you'd say that. You're a BioFanboy! You would defend everything they have in their games.

 

That's an ad hominem.

 

An Argumentum ad hominem only applies when someone states another person's opinion is wrong because of who they are. Merely insulting someone and saying they're wrong is not an ad hominem.

 

If you see someone use the term improperly, link them to this: examples.

Edited April 8, 2009 by Maria Caliban

[Hell Kitty]

I'm hankering after a game a bit more Michelin star than BK drive-thru.

 

So you'd prefer steak from a gourmet restaurant to a burger from a fast food chain. Okay, that's a popular analogy but it doesn't really clear anything up. What is it that makes a game a steak rather than a burger? What is it that makes a company a five star restaurant rather than a cheap burger joint?

 

Is Bioware really the McDonalds of the gaming industry? Wouldn't a better fit be the casual game studios that make small, cheap, easily consumed games with minimal system requirements?

[Meshugger]

Gromnirs post are pure poetry.

 

Those who do not understand his insightful use of linguistics are the lowest common denominator.

 

This post was an argumentum ad hominem.

Edited April 8, 2009 by Meshugger

[Meshugger]

I'm hankering after a game a bit more Michelin star than BK drive-thru.

 

So you'd prefer steak from a gourmet restaurant to a burger from a fast food chain. Okay, that's a popular analogy but it doesn't really clear anything up. What is it that makes a game a steak rather than a burger? What is it that makes a company a five star restaurant rather than a cheap burger joint?

 

Is Bioware really the McDonalds of the gaming industry? Wouldn't a better fit be the casual game studios that make small, cheap, easily consumed games with minimal system requirements?

 

Of course Bioware should be the McDonalds of the RPG-genre. Most people like burgers done well, me included.

 

A five-course meal at a fivestar restaurant would of course more preferable, but it is often 1)expensive, and 2)Relatively exotic compared to a hamburger beef.

 

There are no gamestudios that are equivalent of a five star restaurant. In the film industry, there are of course actors and directors (now and before) that could be considered as a five star restaurant, but no filmstudio though. The same can be found in the music industry; some artists might be (or have been) considered a five star restaurant, but no music distributor is a five star restaurant.

[Hell Kitty]

Of course Bioware should be the McDonalds of the RPG-genre. Most people like burgers done well, me included.

 

So, most people like burgers, most people like Bioware games, therefore Bioware is McDonalds? Genius! Or utter rubbish that shows just how pointless such a comparison is. Fast food is served and prepared quickly at a low cost. A game like IWD2 is a better fit as "fast food" than any of Bio's titles. Use of a popular setting, developed at a low cost in as short amount of time as possible.

 

A five-course meal at a fivestar restaurant would of course more preferable, but it is often 1)expensive, and 2)Relatively exotic compared to a hamburger beef.

 

There are no gamestudios that are equivalent of a five star restaurant.

 

So there are no studios that produce five star games? This is nonsense. All five stars means is quality, and just because something is expensive or exotic something doesn't mean it's a quality product*. Anything and everything can be given the label five star if it's judged as being high quality.

 

*Although people will often confuse a high price with quality, just like gamers often confuse what they like with quality.

Edited April 8, 2009 by Hell Kitty

[Meshugger]

So, most people like burgers, most people like Bioware games, therefore Bioware is McDonalds? Genius! Or utter rubbish that shows just how pointless such a comparison is. Fast food is served and prepared quickly at a low cost. A game like IWD2 is a better fit as "fast food" than any of Bio's titles. Use of a popular setting, developed at a low cost in as short amount of time as possible.

 

Nah, it has nothing to do about how fast the production-cycle is. Or some clever use of recycling the argument, i'm not that smart. The point was that being the McDonalds is to cater to the taste of the general public. Everyone loevs hamburger. The problem lies of course in finding something that the general public would want, which Bioware has done pretty well.

 

So there are no studios that produce five star games? This is nonsense. All five stars means is quality, and just because something is expensive or exotic something doesn't mean it's a quality product*. Anything and everything can be given the label five star if it's judged as being high quality.

 

*Although people will often confuse a high price with quality, just like gamers often confuse what they like with quality.

 

I think that we got a case of being lost in translation; you, me or maybe both at the same time. What i meant is that there's no gamestudio that only serve the food of a certain higher standard, thus the five star rating.

 

It might be troublesome though if we start disagreing on which is of better a quality: A pack of bananas, or a filet mignon flamb

[Pidesco]

Bioware is more like Starbucks than Mcdonalds. People go there thinking they're going to get fine coffee, and they leave thinking they're urbane and smart and have good taste, but actually they just had a bit of overpriced, crap coffee, draped in marketing and flavours of the day, custom designed to make them feel smug about themselves.

[Slowtrain]

Bioware is more like Starbucks than Mcdonalds. People go there thinking they're going to get fine coffee, and they leave thinking they're urbane and smart and have good taste, but actually they just had a bit of overpriced, crap coffee, draped in marketing and flavours of the day, custom designed to make them feel smug about themselves.

 

 

Starbucks is all right. But they went down hill a great deal when they introduced the pushbutton espresso machines. Autogrinding and then pushing a button will never make great espresso. It will never even make a good one. But its probably cheaper than training baristas how to do it right.

 

edit: I am a coffee elitist.

Edited April 8, 2009 by CrashGirl