Gaming subscription fees.

[Blank]

Oh, firstly, new smiley's, that's great.

 

Anyway, there are many popular games out there that charge you a fee for playing them online. Monthly, yearly, or whatever, it annoys the heck out of me. I just want to buy the game once, not five hundred times over.

 

The counterargument I hear is this: to play on good servers and get new features and junk, it costs a lot of money, and 20 bucks a month is little for that service. But seriously, unless you are the maintenance or feature guy that does that junk, you have no idea what it costs. I am guessing that these subscription game developers are grossing in far more than they give out to their gamers. Of course, one should be making a profit, but I doubt they need to make that much of a profit.

 

But hey, they are making the money, and only one guy is complaining, so I don't blame them for their decision. I just want some benevolence so I can play popular games with millions of people online. I'll buy the game for fifty dollars. I do that for any game I really want. I just want them to nix the fee.

 

Here's a solution too. It might be ugly, but so is the fee. I hate advertisements. However, I put up with them for TV. At least I don't have to pay for the TV show producers to make the programs and put them on my TV. The ads do that for me.

 

In fact, I played a trial version of the MMOFPS Planetside and saw Target commercials on billboards. It was hilariously out of place, and I thought, "If I were a paying customer, I would be so mad that I would have to see that." My point is that pitching the advertisement idea to businesses would be easy. You tell how many people see the ad and how many times and I'm sure they'd pay some money to get that billboard spot. Maybe during the loading screen or whatever. Have a little window that says, "You don't have to pay those stupid subscription fees because of these guys: <UR AD HEAR!!11>"

 

Maybe it does cost Planetside developers millions of dollars to host three servers and barely maintain them (the maintenance is pretty poor from what I hear), but I doubt that is true. I don't expect any changes from what I say now, but I still must say, c'mon you greedy subscription game developers, be nice to me.

 

What do you think?

[Lare Kikkeli]

i'm not really interested in mmogs so i dont care, but i do think that putting advertisements in games would be a good idea if they'd cut the prices. i doubt it'd happen though, the prices would stay the same and the publishers would get more money.

[Blank]

Exactly. That's why I'd be mad if I was a paying user of Planetside. I wouldn't want to see crappy retail store ads that take me out of the futuristic environment I'm paying to play in.

 

It adds to my point. How can servicing three servers take up all the revenue of subscription fees from the users, the money from people purchasing the game, as well as the money from the advertisements here and there?

 

Edit: Again, when I say all the revenue, I don't mean completely all, but after the surely substantial profit.

Edited November 11, 2006 by Blank

[angshuman]

Agree on all counts. Servers, schmervers, MMO, whatever, I don't care, I absolutely flat-out refuse to pay monthly fees for any game. And of course, if I have to look at ads in a game, it better be free.

[Dark_Raven]

I don't pay to play. I spent an ungodly amount for the bloody game, I am not going to spend more to play it online.

Edited November 11, 2006 by Dark_Raven

[Sand]

Right on. No pay to play!

[Atreides]

Mmorpgs seem pretty hit or miss to me. If they're hugely popular it's champagne time, but eventually if people start leaving (say game's a few years out or there's other games) then the low numbers can get depressing.

[Volourn]

"I spent an ungodly amount for the bloody game"

 

Yeah, $50 or so is an 'ungodly' amount.

 

 

R00fles!

[Enoch]

I've got nothing against pay-to-play, per se. I just don't enjoy the kind of gameplay MMOGs offer.

 

Really, paying a monthly fee to play a game is no different that paying for cable TV, or to join a bowling league, or any other kind of entertainment that comes with a periodic charge.

[Llyranor]

I'm opposed to the current pay-to-play games because their content is unappealing. I wouldn't say no to one for a game which I would actually consider worth playing - granted, of course, that the subscription would actually go towards actually providing more actual content on a regular basis.

 

If, say, Obs were to have a subscription system to which they would make new mods on a regular basis, I'd sign up. Of course, since they could charge for individual mods individually anyway just as Bio did, it doesn't really fit the criteria. In any case

 

:crazy:

:crazy:

 

[ramza]

No thank you, I will keep my money instead!

[Calax]

I can see the need for a subscription as they are also keeping a full development team working on the game to fix bugs, add new content and such.

 

the way mmo's are right now you either need to have a fee or go the guild wars route and have expansions coming out every year or so.

[Hurlshort]

First off, Planetside probably barely had enough paying subscribers to support itself. You can actually run the numbers on how much it costs to support a MMO for a year. You can figure that you have at least 15 employees with an average salary of $75,000. 15 employees is probably a bare minimum, with 2-3 IT guys, 2 artists, 2 programmers, 1 producer, 4 customer service reps, and support staff. Basically you are spending over a million $ a year just on staff, and that's about the lowest estimate you can get. These are educated or experienced folks, not minimum wage labor.

 

Then you have business expenses like a building lease, servers and computers, software licensing fees, phone network, business licensing fees, etc. My buddy runs a small computer reselling business, and he needs to make $20,000 a month just to break even on the monthly bills. So that adds up to about $240,000.

 

Advertising is extremely expensive, and I've seen Planetside everywhere. You also need a new employee to handle advertisements. I'm no expert, but I'd put all that at about $200,000 a year minimum.

 

So we have our small MMO company that costs $1.45 million a year to run...let's look at subscription fees.

 

It's important to note that most MMO's do not have 5 million subscribers. They are successful if they can break the 100,000 mark. According to this site, http://www.mmogchart.com/, Planetside dropped to about 20,000 subscribers. At $13 a month, that's $260,000 a month. That comes out to a nice $3.12 million.

 

So it looks like our tiny little MMO company is turning a decent profit. Of course, that $3.12 million is taxable, so that's another huge chunk. But honestly, a company making a million a year is not that huge. That money will mostly go right back into the business, with the CEO and other heads maybe getting a decent bonus. It's not a cash cow unless you get a huge amount of subscribers. And trust me, Blizzard is supporting way more than 15 staff members. I made up most of these numbers at a VERY LOW estimate. I'm sure I left out other expenses.

 

Also remember, the initial cost of $50 covers the initial cost of creating the game, and rarely any more. MMO's require a long development cycle that is usually on loan from a publisher, and when the game hits the shelves, it's the publisher that takes the lion's share.

 

Anyways, I fully support $15 a month for a MMO because the entertainment is worth it for me. But if you don't find MMO's entertaining, it's logical that you wouldn't pay money for it.

[alanschu]

The counterargument I hear is this: to play on good servers and get new features and junk, it costs a lot of money, and 20 bucks a month is little for that service. But seriously, unless you are the maintenance or feature guy that does that junk, you have no idea what it costs. I am guessing that these subscription game developers are grossing in far more than they give out to their gamers. Of course, one should be making a profit, but I doubt they need to make that much of a profit.

 

How much profit should they be making then? Making games isn't cheap, and if your game busts, you lose lots of money. Yeah, a game like WOW could probably charge less (not that it charges a whole lot), but why would they? They have millions of people playing right now, that find it perfectly okay to pay what they currently charge, so I see no reason why they should stop.

 

 

What do you think?

 

I think you're out of luck. I doubt I'd do any differently than any of those companies if I was in their shoes.

[Deadly_Nightshade]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Paying for a MMORPG = :crazy:

[Deadly_Nightshade]

I don't pay to play. I spent an ungodly amount for the bloody game, I am not going to spend more to play it online.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

QFT...

[kirottu]

Anyways, I fully support $15 a month for a MMO because the entertainment is worth it for me.  But if you don't find MMO's entertaining, it's logical that you wouldn't pay money for it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Teh Logic... It burns.

[ramza]

I don't pay to play. I spent an ungodly amount for the bloody game, I am not going to spend more to play it online. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

ditto! For once we agree, DR...

[Calax]

Anyways, I fully support $15 a month for a MMO because the entertainment is worth it for me.  But if you don't find MMO's entertaining, it's logical that you wouldn't pay money for it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Teh Logic... It burns.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll park myself behind hurl's argument.

[BicycleOfDeath]

Sometimes I feel like paying a monthly fee, sometimes I don't. That's why when I play WoW, I cancel my account right after I pay for a month so I don't end up getting charged for another month. Sometimes they charge me anyway, I call, complain, and get a month free.

 

I've other things to control my life besides a video game and the capital it costs to play MMO games. *points to his wedding ring*

[Blank]

I see what you are saying Hurlshot. I was just sad because I want free stuff.

 

What do you think about the advertisement idea though? Something rather unobtrusive, like in the load screen. I see it all the time on websites, so I wonder how much it would pay. I'm sure companies would spend tons to get their product on load screens for WoW or some other grossly popular game.

Edited November 11, 2006 by Blank

[Calax]

I see what you are saying Hurlshot. I was just sad because I want free stuff.

 

What do you think about the advertisement idea though? Something rather unobtrusive, like in the load screen. I see it all the time on websites, so I wonder how much it would pay. I'm sure companies would spend tons to get their product on load screens for WoW or some other grossly popular game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

depends... if it's modern like Matrix online or COH I can see it being done easily.

 

But in WoW? it'd be difficult because there aren't very many loading points and it's immersion breaking to see a coke banner strapped to ragnaros' chest.

[Hurlshort]

They could rig the advertisements to show while the game is loading, or maybe in between transitional areas. That's how TV shows do it, basically, and I never complain about a Ford truck commercial breaking my immersion in "LOST".

 

WoW is probably the only game that could actually support itself with advertisements though, as they have a huge audience. There is still a pretty large rift between the corporate world and the gaming world. That's why EA put in that tracking software in BF2142. It gives them some actual data to supply advertisers with.

 

A game that has 60,000 players is not going to be able to charge much in advertising. TV shows have millions of viewers.

Edited November 11, 2006 by Hurlshot

[Dhruin]

Hurlshot hit the nail on the head. Don't forget the significant possibility of failure...Microsoft lost $40M half developing Mythica, for example. Sure, Microsoft can afford that but what about the backers of Dark and Light, Wish and a dozen others. Matrix Online would have cost Monolith a bundle and so on.

[Oerwinde]

if I'm getting something I feel is worth it for my subscription fee, then I'm fine with paying the subscription. City of Heroes for instance added new archetypes, power sets, areas, villains, costume pieces, missions, mission types, etc. It was worth it more back when they shipped you a solid copy of the CoH comic rather than just making it available online, but yeah.