Ginny Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 I finished the game today as a light side female sentinel watchman. I enjoyed the game. My Revan was a female lightsider as well which alters the story of the Exile, I think. ENDING The ending was confusing and I felt that it detracted a bit from the ending in the first game because it turns out the my Revan has not been seen in years and is apparently out trying to face a threat from, according to Kreia, the 'real Sith.' Whoever they may be. I love happy endings and for me, Kotor 1 was a happy ending. I thought that perhaps Revan would go on more adventures but would settle down with Carth and the business of strengthening the Republic (and having Carth's babies). The second game settles all of this in a most discouraging fashion. And although I recognize that happy endings are not always possible, I feel some loss at coming so far with Revan and now the Exile to have such an indeterminate conclusion. One comment: I think the ending would have been far more palatable if I could have simply gone back and talked to my friends about everything that had happened (through dialog). ROMANCE Also, I had hoped to have a relationship of some kind with Atton and tried everything possible even to making a spectacle of myself (flirting, batting my eyelashes, accidentally rubbing up against him with my bosoms while passing in the halls in the Ebon Hawk, falling onto him when we came out of hyperspace due to faulty stabilizers no doubt); but nothing, no dialog options or anything I tried worked. The silly game seemed only interested in pairing me up with Mr. Pearly White Caps himself, Disciple. And then it was only hinting at it. There was never any real romantic dialog. NOTE: I do not know-- there may be romance with Atton but I was unable to bring it about in my game. And I tried, oh I tried... My greatest moment of shame was intentionally getting close to a vacuum intake valve in the Hawk engine room which ripped my shirt off revealing my womanhood to Atton. I do not think he even noticed... I guess counting pazaak cards in his head kept his mind off of me and my failed attempts at catching his eye UNSATISFYING CONCLUSION? It just seems to me that so many things were in place for a very satisfying ending and it just kind of fizzled. It is a great game and fun but I felt that the incredible characters and story foundations were not developed to their potential. Without a doubt, it is still good story with good characters. I just wanted the Exile and Revan to have a happy ending. This is probably just the hopes of a girl who feels they had seen so much suffering and done so much good that they had earned a happy ending and not one fraught with such uncertainty and doubt. But such is life... CHARACTER DIALOG And I kept going back to the characters to get new dialog options, but past a certain point, nothing changed in that respect. Now this is probably because I did not get much influence with anyone (except losing some with Kreia, but if you do not pull wings off butterflies for her, you are going to lose influence). In the first game, I was able to systematically get every dialog option and character side quest--for light side, dark is just gross I loved that part of Kotor 1 and always wanted to get as much story and background from each character as possible. In this game, I couldn't--but this may be my silly mistakes. Also, I did not feel like I had too much influence over my characters alignment because nothing changed dialog wise. Do you have to just pick 2 characters and go the whole way through with them to get all of their options (if there are more)? Also, if anyone is so inclined could you tell me what other story options are available in the game? Or link them if you have a thread or something. I know this is rambling and long, but I just finished and am awash in bittersweet emotion.
The Great Phantom Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 Well, I'm not sure if that's another Optimist to join our ranks, or another short-sided fool... Lucas Arts forced the deadline, which led to some of the best stuff to be cut... Try to 'play around' with everybody... If you want a walkthrough site, I could give you a few... Play as an LS Male, if you want (Revan LS Male, too)... This leads to some of the cooler dialogue (Bastila included )... Do you have any specific questions? I'd be glad to answer them to the best of my humble (AND BETTER ) abilities... Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
Master Dahvernas Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 As mentioned, there is a TON of content that had to be cut that actually finishes this game in every sense of the word. As for replaying the game its *current* state... Create a character (M/FM; LS/DS doesn't matter) with high INT (Intelligence) at around 16 from the start. Also, every time you level-up, put points into Persuade and Awareness before anything else. Most of the hidden backstory is triggered by Awareness, Persuade and Intelligence (as well as INT being a modifer for other skills) and I gurantee you'll get a better, more fleshed out... As fleshed out as an incomplete game can be... Experience. Those not worth gaining influence with because their subplots were literally cut out: All of the droids, more or less: HK, Goto and T3. You won't miss anything if you don't even bring these guys along (you really have no incentive in this version to even rebuild HK-47 if not just to have his musings about "love" and other sarcastic comments to break up the brooding atmosphere of the game). T3 has a Holovid regarding Revan/Bastila... But again, this kind of screws with the story MORE than helps it in my opinion depending on what side you play.
AlanC9 Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 Your feelings are shared by many, Ginny. (Some of Atton's romance-related dialog is part of the cut ending, btw) While you can influence your companions' aligment, their dialogs don't seem to change. This is a design oversight, I think. The best way to approach influence is to not try to metagame it, I think. Keep people who your character is compatable with in the party, and behave as you should. The influence will come naturally. However, some characters have place-specific requirements for influence. Without going spoilerish, you want to keep Atton in your party on Nar Shaddaa. I'd recommend doing that world first in any event. And Bao-Dur needs to be on-planet to gain influence.
ShadowPaladin V1.0 Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 While you can influence your companions' aligment, their dialogs don't seem to change. This is a design oversight, I think. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'm not so sure that it dosnt have something to do with the character you play... I have to agree with Volourn. Bioware is pretty much dead now. Deals like this kills development studios. 478327[/snapback]
witchzenka Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 ROMANCE Also, I had hoped to have a relationship of some kind with Atton and tried everything possible even to making a spectacle of myself (flirting, batting my eyelashes, accidentally rubbing up against him with my bosoms while passing in the halls in the Ebon Hawk, falling onto him when we came out of hyperspace due to faulty stabilizers no doubt); but nothing, no dialog options or anything I tried worked. The silly game seemed only interested in pairing me up with Mr. Pearly White Caps himself, Disciple. And then it was only hinting at it. There was never any real romantic dialog. NOTE: I do not know-- there may be romance with Atton but I was unable to bring it about in my game. And I tried, oh I tried... My greatest moment of shame was intentionally getting close to a vacuum intake valve in the Hawk engine room which ripped my shirt off revealing my womanhood to Atton. I do not think he even noticed... I guess counting pazaak cards in his head kept his mind off of me and my failed attempts at catching his eye <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This part made me LOL. That was disheartening - I agree... I even tried chatting with Atton in the dancer's outfit - it that doesn't get a comment out of a red-blooded male it's time to check his pulse, ime. -Zenka The Evil Cow http://kotorsocial.suddenlaunch3.com/index.cgi
The Great Phantom Posted March 11, 2005 Posted March 11, 2005 I think that atire should have more affects, like it did with the Handmaiden post dueling. Atton should stutter, and Visas could remain oblivious, with no eyes... Kreia could call you a fool, and Disciple could say: "A Jedi should not do that... but it's working for me!" That way, he'd get a little bit more notice... Now, I'm a Male PC, sooo... Just suggesting something for you modders! Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
LadyCrimson Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Atton has so much to say in the beginning of the game, and then he becomes almost silent. On my 2nd time through the game, so far I've noticed a couple dialogues from him I missed the first time, in the beginning. Nothing interesting tho. Someone should write up all the dialogue lines they've seen (insert favorite NPC here) say, so people can compare. hehe But that'd be a big project maybe. “Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Ginny Posted March 12, 2005 Author Posted March 12, 2005 Thank you for the great replies, you all! The Great Phantom: I would love some links to complete walkthroughs, if possible; especially, if they show dialog options. This way when I complete a planet/area, I can see if I missed anything story wise. Master Dahvernas: I will start with 16 Intelligence this time and put points into Presuade and Awareness first. As you suggest, I will avoid the droids as well. Though, not using HK-47 is a crime! He was absolutely hysterical in Kotor 1, even as a staunch, card carrying, lightsider. What are the other skills/attributes that are important to the story? AlanC9: It is good to know there is a cut ending for Atton. But as you mentioned, I will make sure I have Atton on Nar Shaddaa and Bao-Dur out on the planet as well. ShadowPaladin V1.0: Maybe other character/alignment combinations do have dialog as you influence them. I just know it did not seem to make any difference in my game. Though, I did notice that some of them started neutral and then went lighter. Honestly though, I do not think it made a whit of difference for characters like Kreia (for obvious reasons) and HK or Mandalore. LadyCrimson: I know! Atton was a flibbertigibbet at the beginning and then not a peep the rest of the game!!! He even noticed my rather unflattering jammy/undies. Once you hit the hawk, it is rare to get a comment out of him. And oh my goodness, someone write up all of the dialog so we can see what we missed! That does sound like a huge project, but maybe some of the computer whizzes here can extract the dialog from the game or something. Witchzenka: Noooooo, I had planned on trying the old
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Visas stops after the first 1 or 2 convo's, but has a cool clip at the end or nearby... Handmaiden has 'nudist' dueling (in her underwear that cover less than the Dancers Costume)... Plus, her conversion story is really cool... Take Bao with you on Dantooine, into the cave after you get the swoop quest. Influence gains a few new options on several characters, in fact. My first play through LS Male, I got full influence with Kreia... I don't see the problem. All you have to do is go along with a FEW of her things, or just say "I will think about this." over and over, and she'll be content, even if you've read spoiler forums and know who she is already. Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
Gorth Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Also, I had hoped to have a relationship of some kind with Atton and tried everything possible even to making a spectacle of myself (flirting, batting my eyelashes, accidentally rubbing up against him with my bosoms while passing in the halls in the Ebon Hawk, falling onto him when we came out of hyperspace due to faulty stabilizers no doubt); but nothing, no dialog options or anything I tried worked. Actually, I don't think you are supposed to have Jedi romances in Star Wars games. The entire thought of emotions and passions is abhorrent to Jedi and should not be there, if it were to be strictly Star Wars. Even Luke found out in the original movies, that love has no place in a Jedi's heart (that he was considering an incestous relationship with his sister might also have had something to do with it). Romances just aren't a jedi thing “He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein
LadyCrimson Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 I have a side question - how many positive influences does it take to reach the full influence? Four? Six? etc? I certainly maxxed out Atton's influence pretty early in the game. Edit: and the only FAQ/walkthru that I saw that went into extensive dialogue only deals with the dialogues that relate to influence or DS/LS point gains or plot puzzles. I think there are tools to extract the dialogue but I wouldn't know how to use them. If someone does, it'd be really nice to put them in a file somewhere.... :cool: Then I could stop taking all these screenshots of the text... “Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 The romances were allowed pre-Exar Kun. Then the Jedi restructured against humanity... The Male Revan/ Bastila romance was actually a key focus of Kotor I, and I would like them to die sharing one last embrace, with Bastila promising Revan to hold true to the LS, and finish his work... Now that would be an emotionally fulfilling ending! Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
Gorth Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 The romances were allowed pre-Exar Kun. Then the Jedi restructured against humanity... Well, Kotor 1&2 are sort of post Exar Kun, aren't they ? “He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 I know. But the Bastila/Revan is still a key to my liking the Kotor series in the first place... Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
SteveThaiBinh Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Does anyone know if the new patch is to fix bugs or is it to add in some of the removed story material? *crosses fingers* <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Although there's been no official announcement, most people are assuming that the removed story material won't be restored by the patch. There are plenty of bugs to keep the programmers busy. Some fans are working on a mod to restore as much as possible. However, it's not clear how much can be reconstructed from the remnants left on the disks. Revan's romance with Bastila was against official Jedi rules, as she told us, again and again and again before completely caving in and entering into a relationship with someone with a proven history of falling to the dark side. "An electric puddle is not what I need right now." (Nina Kalenkov)
Wycked Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 The romances were allowed pre-Exar Kun. Then the Jedi restructured against humanity... Well, Kotor 1&2 are sort of post Exar Kun, aren't they ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I feel bad for the Jedi Order if guys like Atton the Fool (Come on, if he was a Jedi, the whole damn galaxy would be filled with lying pazaak-playing, twi'lek-flirting, whining Jedi-wannabies), or Handmaiden (She's weak! Face it! She's WEAK! I dont care how much Sith that sounds, she's weak! ), or Desciple (Need I even comment? <_< ) were to raise the new Jedi order. Exile is far from being Jedi (what's worse than Atton-type Jedi is Exile-type, life-consuming, Nihilus-mimicking, catastrophe-causing Jedi who cant even feel the force, and flirt with WEAK Handmaidens or Twi'lek-flirting Attons! ). Visas always has that veil on her face. Do we /really/ want to know why she has that veil? Hmmmm? So, as my point goes, aside from my much-unneeded comments, few are really a Jedi in KotOR II. Romance is clearly a valid option Jedi on KotOR II really have issues, and are a fitting targets for HK-47-type mockeries in KotOR III.
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 BUT... and again: BUT... It also was key to pulling her back. Revan gave her a taste when she saved him, and as LS, he fixes his own errors, and redeems them both. I think that if their love was forbidden, that would just be stupid. Love in their sense is 'pure', and helps them both, even after the side affects. Besides, they both left the Order shortly after Kotor I, Revan to find the Darkness, Bastila to hunt down Revan. Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 The romances were allowed pre-Exar Kun. Then the Jedi restructured against humanity... Well, Kotor 1&2 are sort of post Exar Kun, aren't they ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I feel bad for the Jedi Order if guys like Atton the Fool (Come on, if he was a Jedi, the whole damn galaxy would be filled with lying pazaak-playing, twi'lek-flirting, whining Jedi-wannabies), or Handmaiden (She's weak! Face it! She's WEAK! I dont care how much Sith that sounds, she's weak! ), or Desciple (Need I even comment? <_< ) were to raise the new Jedi order. Exile is far from being Jedi (what's worse than Atton-type Jedi is Exile-type, life-consuming, Nihilus-mimicking, catastrophe-causing Jedi who cant even feel the force, and flirt with WEAK Handmaidens or Twi'lek-flirting Attons! ). Visas always has that veil on her face. Do we /really/ want to know why she has that veil? Hmmmm? So, as my point goes, aside from my much-unneeded comments, few are really a Jedi in KotOR II. Romance is clearly a valid option Jedi on KotOR II really have issues, and are a fitting targets for HK-47-type mockeries in KotOR III. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I want to point something really odd out now. When 'flirting' with Visas, if you talk with Kreia she says something similar to the following: "Did you not ever wonder if the rest of her body beneath her robes was as pure and unblemmished as her face?" That made me nauseous at first, but then it sounded kinda... hot... Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
Ginny Posted March 12, 2005 Author Posted March 12, 2005 Thank you all for the great--and entertaining--replies! 1. I am still looking for the most comprehensive walkthrough possible. So if anyone knows of a really extra complete one, then please give me a link 2. The mention of the game being rushed and incomplete by Lucas Arts makes me sad. My question is: has anyone pieced together the story from these extra parts? I do not mean modders, I am just wondering if the whole story has been solidified based on the unused portions that people have found on the CD (as mentioned a post above)? And if so, where can I read about it? :cool: 3. What would be a story oriented class/prestige mix? My last game I played a Sentinel/Watchman. Maybe I should stick with something close to this to have lots of skills that seem to be used in the story? Any suggestions? 4. This may have been answered above somewhat, but I want to be sure: which NPCs are the most bang for the buck storywise? Example: Visas, while interesting, did not have any new dialog and I played with her a lot. I checked her options over and over and was unhappy that they never altered. I want NPCs that have changing dialog as the story evolves. Which are the best NPCs in this respect? Thank you again!
LadyCrimson Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 In my initial run my impression is that most of the NPC's don't have much to say towards the end of (their part of) the game, or once you've made them Jedi or have full influence etc. - they all make the occasional comment here and there but the dialogue options don't change. There was a giant thread on these forums about the original plot ending, comlpete with the dialogue lines that still remain in the sounds folder...I don't have the link for it tho. “Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
phiont Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Thank you all for the great--and entertaining--replies! 1. I am still looking for the most comprehensive walkthrough possible. So if anyone knows of a really extra complete one, then please give me a link 2. The mention of the game being rushed and incomplete by Lucas Arts makes me sad. My question is: has anyone pieced together the story from these extra parts? I do not mean modders, I am just wondering if the whole story has been solidified based on the unused portions that people have found on the CD (as mentioned a post above)? And if so, where can I read about it? :cool: 3. What would be a story oriented class/prestige mix? My last game I played a Sentinel/Watchman. Maybe I should stick with something close to this to have lots of skills that seem to be used in the story? Any suggestions? 4. This may have been answered above somewhat, but I want to be sure: which NPCs are the most bang for the buck storywise? Example: Visas, while interesting, did not have any new dialog and I played with her a lot. I checked her options over and over and was unhappy that they never altered. I want NPCs that have changing dialog as the story evolves. Which are the best NPCs in this respect? Thank you again! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> 1. GameBanshee has the best KotOR II walkthrough I've been able to find. Their KotOR I walkthrough is pretty good too. 2. For a good read into the cut content check out this thread and then maybe this thread too. 3. However you choose to replay, I recommend accumulating at least 14 - 16 attribute points for Intelligence. Higher INT opens up tons of additional dialog options and it also lets you build skills like Awareness, Comp and Rep more quickly which also open up additional dialogs. 4. Maybe try taking Bao-Dur with you for his tech support and conscience. HK-47 is also very funny to have along for his lack of conscience. :D
The Great Phantom Posted March 12, 2005 Posted March 12, 2005 Shan beat me to the Gamebanshee link... IGN has a detailed walkthrough, last time I checked... I'll dig up a link. Geekified Star Wars Geek Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" -Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom) "The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."
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