tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 I want a RPG in a world as seen in GTA: San Andreas: huuuge, no loading times, detailed and pretty. Huuuuuuuuuuge worlds are up there right next to physics when it comes to dumb features in games. No developer has enough resources to populate such big world in any sort of sensible manner, so in the end all you get is lot of reused graphics that doesn't serve anything, one significant building every 1-2 km and people running everywhere to cut down on travel time... which totally breaks the immersion, hardly a good thing for the RPG. GTA gets away with it because with all the cars, bikes and whatnot it has you don't travel much on foot in it...
Astatine Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 Oh gods no. They don't need a shooter engine for qa CRPG. I rather see them make an original engine designed specifically for a CRPG. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I hope they don't. Writing your own engine takes a lot of time, time that would be better spent on the game itself... The engine's just a way of displaying the game world, it has no connection with the game's genre whatsoever. Shouldn't have, anyway. I'd like to see a big party-based game (6 PCs, like the IE games?) done in a good 3D engine (like Unreal 3), to see that it can be done...
mkreku Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 I want a RPG in a world as seen in GTA: San Andreas: huuuge, no loading times, detailed and pretty. Huuuuuuuuuuge worlds are up there right next to physics when it comes to dumb features in games. No developer has enough resources to populate such big world in any sort of sensible manner, so in the end all you get is lot of reused graphics that doesn't serve anything, one significant building every 1-2 km and people running everywhere to cut down on travel time... which totally breaks the immersion, hardly a good thing for the RPG. GTA gets away with it because with all the cars, bikes and whatnot it has you don't travel much on foot in it... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Play Gothic/Gothic 2 before you say anything. Ok, they're not huuuge, but they're big worlds filled with details and everything you wish to find in a RPG. Oh, and about GTA.. Well, I kind of hope Obsidians next project has vehicles in it.. Preferrably upgradable vehicles I've always hated the perfectly square, tiny maps of the IE games and Neverwinter Nights. A loading screen every time you enter a one room building, now that's an immersion breaker. "Oh gods no. They don't need a shooter engine for qa CRPG. I rather see them make an original engine designed specifically for a CRPG." This is so.. uninformed it's not even worth a real reply. Just a suggestion: read up on the difference between a graphics engine and a game engine. Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!
Nightblade Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 I want a RPG in a world as seen in GTA: San Andreas: huuuge, no loading times, detailed and pretty. Huuuuuuuuuuge worlds are up there right next to physics when it comes to dumb features in games. No developer has enough resources to populate such big world in any sort of sensible manner, so in the end all you get is lot of reused graphics that doesn't serve anything, one significant building every 1-2 km and people running everywhere to cut down on travel time... which totally breaks the immersion, hardly a good thing for the RPG. GTA gets away with it because with all the cars, bikes and whatnot it has you don't travel much on foot in it... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Horses! Lot's of space, wasteland, forest and a party travelling on horseback. With an eagle-view map you can guide the party around like you send your ship around in Sid Meier's "Pirates". Imagine clicking your party on horseback around on a map like this (with slightly less water, and more land of c.) If there is an encounter the game zooms in and you find yourself in the traditional top-angle Infinity Engine view. :cool: N.
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 "They don't need a shooter engine for qa CRPG." Stop with the nonsense! It's not a shooter Engine! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As far as I am concerned its a Shooter Engine. Name one solidly built and good CRPG that has ever came out using the Unreal Engine? Don't say Deus Ex because that game is a shooter.
Volourn Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 "I've always hated the perfectly square, tiny maps of the IE games and Neverwinter Nights" Um. Neither game has tiny maps except, of course, shops and houses for obvious reasons!. And, they don't have to be square! They can be rectangle as well! "Ok, they're not huuuge, but they're big worlds" They are huge. I'll give them and they are detailed pretty well too. And, we agree that Hades is being silly in regards to his engine comments. So, at least that's something. DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
CKinWoodstock Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 I really liked the concepts that were presented for TORN way back when. I remember Feargus later saying that TORN was killed because things just weren't working, but I can't remember if the reasons were all technical (couldn't get the engine to do what they needed, technology not up to the requirements, just taking too darn long, etc.) or if it was something deeper and the concepts and story just weren't coming together. If it was only technical reasons, is it possible that TORN could be revived at some point?
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 So, if Unreal is so good for a CRPG why hasn't there been a good CRPG to use it yet then? An engine is only as good as the games built on it.
kirottu Posted March 20, 2005 Author Posted March 20, 2005 Let This post is not to be enjoyed, discussed, or referenced on company time.
funcroc Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 http://nwn2forums.bioware.com/forums/viewd...417276&forum=99 from NWN2 forum Frank Kowalkowski Lead Programmer, Obsidian Entertainment KotOR 2 featured weather effects, put in by superstar Jay Fong (currently on assignment as Lead on Obsidian's other team). Brian is working on those systems in the coming months. Some of it should be shown by E3, so I think your concerns should be addressed when you see the first screens of the game. The whole team has gone through a lot of effort to upgrade the environments and how they are generated.
tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 As far as I am concerned its a Shooter Engine. Name one solidly built and good CRPG that has ever came out using the Unreal Engine? Don't say Deus Ex because that game is a shooter. Lineage 2? "Good" is obviously relative here, but the game does utilize all regular elements of typical crpg -- teams, fights, equipment, magic, stats upgrade and whatnot...
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 Lineage 2 is not a CRPG. Its a MMORPG. All MMORPGs suck.
Volourn Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 "Lineage 2 is not a CRPG. Its a MMORPG. All MMORPGs suck." If true, then why do you like MW? LOL DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 Its not a MMO. No annoying PKers screaming in elite speak.
tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 Lineage 2 is not a CRPG. Its a MMORPG. All MMORPGs suck. CRPG is rpg played on computer. MMORPG is rpg played on computer by massive amount of real people at once.... so yup, Lineage would be CRPG utilizing Unreal engine. (and if you think about it , there's very little difference between game like KotOR and Lineage when it comes to functionality... so there's nothing really the engine couldn't handle)
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 MMOPRGS are a totally different animal thana CRPG. A CRPG is Baldur's Gate 2, MW, ASrcanum, NWN, IWD, and the such. Lineage 2 is a MMORPG like Ultima Online, Anarchy Online, WoW, and Everquest. THEY ARE VASTLY DIFFERENT! Prime example what is the central story to Lineage 2. How long does it take to complete? Its a FREAKING MMORPG that only purpose is to level mill. Sorry, but that is not a CRPG. A CRPG has a definite beginning and a definite end where a story is told. MMORPGS do not have that therefore not CRPGs.
tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 MMOPRGS are a totally different animal thana CRPG. A CRPG is Baldur's Gate 2, MW, ASrcanum, NWN, IWD, and the such. Lineage 2 is a MMORPG like Ultima Online, Anarchy Online, WoW, and Everquest. THEY ARE VASTLY DIFFERENT! Prime example what is the central story to Lineage 2. How long does it take to complete? Its a FREAKING MMORPG that only purpose is to level mill. Sorry, but that is not a CRPG. A CRPG has a definite beginning and a definite end where a story is told. MMORPGS do not have that therefore not CRPGs. Geez. the whole point was, if i remember right, the question if it's possible to make CRPG game with Unreal engine. From the point of game mechanics the difference between 'crpg' and 'mmorpg' is next to null -- the "central plot" you mention is just a string of loosely arranged quests you do as your character keeps levelling up, with quests becoming available in sequence as you finish them one after another. MMO games have their quests not arranged in a sequence and thats' about it. All other elements that make the CRPG you can find in MMO game as well. So, if you can make the MMO game with certain game engine, then the same engine is perfectly valid as backbone for single player CRPG. Simple as that.
Volourn Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 "No annoying PKers screaming in elite speak." Maybe. But, it does have the large empty space, lack of story, and throwaway quests that MMOPRGs do. " DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 tmp, game mechanics is only a part of the game and that is all. Take a look at the total game, the game that you play. Nothing else matters. Bottomline, you lose.
tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 tmp, game mechanics is only a part of the game and that is all. With small catch being, the game engine handles this very part of the game -- the mechanics. and nothing else. Plot or lack thereof, characters and whatever else you throw on top of it to make the complete experience is up to the game creators, and quite detached from the code running behind the scenes. As for winning/losing... it's not a match. And even if it was one, then you'd still have yet to score a single point by giving just one example of single crpg mechanics that Unreal engine couldn't handle.
Briosafreak Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 For the first time i can post this: Good news It won`t be PA for sure, since i know they didn`t found a publisher interested in PA games, so what will it be? I really hope you don`t disapoint me this time, Obsidian... Planet Fallout
Gorth Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 As for winning/losing... it's not a match. And even if it was one, then you'd still have yet to score a single point by giving just one example of single crpg mechanics that Unreal engine couldn't handle. It would be interesting to see if it could handle npcs in your party and tactical combat well... “He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein
Judge Hades Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 As for winning/losing... it's not a match. And even if it was one, then you'd still have yet to score a single point by giving just one example of single crpg mechanics that Unreal engine couldn't handle. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Unreal engine has been made for primary shooters so it is a shooter engine. What ifs are irrelevant. Only what they have actually done withthe engine matters.
tmp Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 Unreal engine has been made for primary shooters so it is a shooter engine. What ifs are irrelevant. Only what they have actually done withthe engine matters. How do you make game engine a "shooter" engine, exactly? Here is a list of Unreal features. They're about as generic as it can get. Even according to the authors who instead of claiming "hey, our engine is the best thing for you if you want to make a shooter!" say instead: "Unreal Engine is suitable for many genres of 3D games targeting today's popular platforms." Perhaps what is actually irrelevant is "what they've actually done" with it, because it's hardly 'fault' of game engine that the most popular type of game at the moment happens to be FPS, so everyone and their dog tries to make one rather than risk money on something less "safe"...
jaguars4ever Posted March 20, 2005 Posted March 20, 2005 A RPG either based on wrestling or The Stand would be awesome. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The Stand was awesome - it would make a perfect RPG setting as there's a pretence for combat as well.
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