Whats better, deadfire or Baldurs gate?

[Hafenguy]

Hi Folks I will finish POE 1 in a few Day and now im figuring out, what game I will start next. 

Baldurs gate 1 + 2 or Deadfire. 

I started playing iso RPGs after I finished watching Game of Thrones and wanted to play a game that gives me the same feeling of experiencing a epic Story with a Group of different Charakters. 

 

Which would you think will be better? 

I now in this forum will probably not everyone have played Baldurs Gate but I guess most of the people who play POE will even now Baldurs Gate. 

[kanisatha]

I don't see why it need be one or the other. Since you've just played PoE1, I would suggest PoE2 to follow up. And you can (and should) play BG1&2 later on. But I can also see some people recommending the opposite because they like taking a break from what they just played. I, however, favor continuity over taking a break from something.

[Chaospread]

Epic story (and similar environment of GoT) --> go for BG1, but I'd do what @kanisatha told you, playing Deadfire just after Poe1 makes it to be more appreciated, I suppose

[xzar_monty]

Given that there aren't that many good titles in the genre[*], you're likely to eventually play both Deadfire and Baldur's Gate 1 & 2 and then see for yourself which one is better, in your view. Since you've just played PoE1, Deadfire seems the obvious choice for your next game.

 

[*] I mean, BG1&2, PoE1&2, Pathfinder: Kingmaker and Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous just about covers it.

[thelee]

To me, it's very very hard to compare the games. They're basically separated by decades. BG1 & 2 are great games, but even the enhanced editions really show their age. BG1's writing is pretty torturous (a lot of faux-middle-ages dialogue), and you'll do tons of aimless wandering through identical-looking and vast, empty wilderness (i basically keep a walkthrough open so i know where to go on any map for the interesting stuff). BG2 has much better writing and better area design, but the system is just creakingly dated compared to more modern CRPGs.

 

to the actual meat of the question, you should just go for Deadfire for now. Then if you're still hankering for more party-based iso-style CRPGs, I would do Wrath of the Righteous or Kingmaker. And if you're still trying to scratch the itch, then go for Baldur's Gate 1 & 2. like xzar_monty said, even if you play a lot of these games to death, there's only a handful of them with no time horizon for more, so you'll probably eventually find your way to Baldur's Gate 1 or 2 in the end. though personally I would skip straight to 3 unless you really want the isometric experience.

[xzar_monty]

In my view, BG2 still works remarkably well, but I do agree that BG1 is essentially rubbish, pretty much for the reasons you describe.

[omgFIREBALLS]

Systems-wise I'd say Deadfire is the best RTwP party-based RPG out there. The mechanics are good (and I like to partially attribute this to "not forced to imitate some tabletop rules") and your character can be fairly nuanced. I could really do without the Polynesian archipelago setting and the gods behaving the way they do though.

Since you're looking for story, go with BG1/BG2.

[De_jesus]

To respond properly: BG2 is a great game. Very dated, and will feel like it. If you love CRPGs, you'll adapt fairly quickly. It has been years since I played it, but one thing I remember, I think, is the tedium with spellcasters early in the game. Especially as it relates to the rules for DnD at the time.

Edited February 28 by De_jesus

[thelee]

3 hours ago, De_jesus said:

From a production standpoint, it is hard to even compare them. Far and away Baldur's Gate wins in that regard. Combat also offers more "versatility"; not necessarily better, but the ability to leverage your terrain, shove, fly, etc. is a big plus. I would LOVE to see Deadfire with the same production value.

note - OP is asking about BG1 and 2, not BG3.

[De_jesus]

8 hours ago, thelee said:

note - OP is asking about BG1 and 2, not BG3.

Ha! Well, that is embarrassing.

[SenSx]

I'm not going to make friends with hardcore c-rpg fans, but I tried Baldur's Gate late, and did not find it very entertaining.

Combat is dated, mechanics are dated, progression is very poor, story did not really start before I left the game.

I of course had its merit at its time, it started it, but it does not offer much anymore now.

 

Never tried BG2, and that might be a mistake though.

 

So I would definitely advice PoE 2, it's a great game and has many bug fix and balance mods.

Dragon Age Origins would be the game to play first imo, it's easier to understand and the narrative is very engaging, but since you started with PoE alwready...

Dragon Age 2 is not as bad as people say it is, it's just way worse than Origins.

Tyranny is in the same vein as PoE, but with a different fighting system based on abilities with cooldown and a progression similar to Elder Scrolls, refreshing for a c-rpg imo (not as good than Pillars, suffers from lots of balancing and difficulty issues if I  remember well)

You also have DoS 1&2 although I would say they focus more on gameplay than everything else (story, world building), but the companions are great.

 

Then you have Pathfinder games, but with hard accessibility reputation I haven't tried it yet.

Also it is one of those RPG that forces the tabletop adaptation, imo it's not always for the best...

 

BG3, I hope it's as good as people say it is...

Tabletop adaptation worries me, I hope combats are still good.

[thelee]

slight thread necro, but

  

On 3/3/2024 at 2:46 AM, SenSx said:

Then you have Pathfinder games, but with hard accessibility reputation I haven't tried it yet.

Also it is one of those RPG that forces the tabletop adaptation, imo it's not always for the best...

Kingmaker and especially Wrath of the Righteous are extremely inaccessible IMO. Very relentless curve to learn the extremely complicated mechanics quickly and very punishing for suboptimal builds. Some people are really into that aspect, though. I ended up having to watch a ton of youtube build videos (despite being familiar with 3/3.5e, the PF1e ancestors) because I was getting extremely overwhelmed by the mechanics and decision points.

 

On 3/3/2024 at 2:46 AM, SenSx said:

BG3, I hope it's as good as people say it is...

Tabletop adaptation worries me, I hope combats are still good.

i only played a couple of casual 5e sessions, but imo BG3 is better thought of as an immersive sim RPG (immersive sim = think like the Prey remake which had very open mechanics and world exploration) that just happens to have a D&D 5e flavor, than a D&D 5e game. Lots of very important mechanics that are Larian specials and not D&D rules (the massive interactions with surfaces of various types, extreme verticality, interesting itemization [I don't think stuff like Lightning Charges or Arcane Acuity are D&D]). Even when they are D&D rules, Larian adapts them in a way that make them pretty special or distinct (jumping is a lot easier, the extreme verticality makes athletics a very valuable skill, etc). Combat in BG3 is legit great and is a great argument for turn-based, i don't think it could possibly work as well in RTwP. edit: put another way, if I spend an hour in a single battle in pathfinder crpgs, or classic BG, it's extremely annoying or something has gone really badly. Spending an hour in combat in Deadfire or BG3: very satisfying.

Edited March 6 by thelee

[Elric Galad]

BG1 feels way more dated than BG2 somehow. Encounter design is the most dated thing in BG1, with a lot of dumb foes and is overall quite repetitive.

 

That being said, BG1 still has a few unique perks :

- It's a low level experience. You have no money, overlevelled foes and even your weapons sometimes break. 

- You will free to explore, more than many game of the sub-genre, comparable to an Elder Scrolls. These area are reallistically depiscted as pretty empty from interesting stuff. The game is quite immersive because the city of Baldur's Gate is literally fully included which is quite rare for a city of this size in a videogame. Even the Witcher series won't let you enter most buildings. That makes a lot of these area not so interesting, but there are still surprises here and there if you search everything.

So you're more likely to reject BG1 than PoE1&2 or BG2. But I still cherish it.

[De_jesus]

On 3/6/2024 at 9:19 AM, thelee said:

slight thread necro, but

  

Kingmaker and especially Wrath of the Righteous are extremely inaccessible IMO. Very relentless curve to learn the extremely complicated mechanics quickly and very punishing for suboptimal builds. Some people are really into that aspect, though. I ended up having to watch a ton of youtube build videos (despite being familiar with 3/3.5e, the PF1e ancestors) because I was getting extremely overwhelmed by the mechanics and decision points.

A huge part of that inaccessibility is the attribute and enemy volume bloat. (Special mention, for the learning curve around how to build characters properly)

Those two things basically require that you know how to tactically address specific enemies AND pre-buff after every single rest. And there are a LOT of buffs you'll need. Casting 5-10 buffs at the start of each day for each character in your party, then marching into enemy encounter after enemy encounter after enemy encounter is a slog. Wait, not just casting but manipulating certain feats to have 24+ hours of a buff, so that you can cast buffs, rest, maintain those buffs, then cast more buffs to deal with specific encounters. The end of Act 4 or start of Act 5, I forget, just dragged on.

Not to mention dealing with "mirror image" constantly...

I love the game mechanically, but it's something you need to be prepared to sit through. Because it can be a slog and it is not user friendly.

Edited March 18 by De_jesus