Ukraine Conflict - "An empire founded by war has to maintain itself by war"

[BruceVC]

1 hour ago, Bartimaeus said:

It's so weird how having even an ounce of empathy for your enemy while still wanting them to be defeated can get you lumped right in with them to at least a couple of posters in here.

It sounds serious Barti, cant you write a script?

[Mamoulian War]

7 hours ago, Zoraptor said:

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3549443-ukrainian-forces-struck-bridge-over-dam-in-nova-kakhovka.html  ? Their source is Ukrainian Operation Command South.

Your source is using old satellite imagery, you can tell because of the lack of secondary crossings per below. Indeed, there's a notable lack of up to date imagery showing the dam bridge itself.

The small water outlet is the lock (well, presumably. Used for getting ships past the dam; shut the gates and pump water in/ out to change the level to that up/ down stream). There are two issues with hitting that. Firstly it's very narrow, certainly in comparison to the Dniepr proper. Indeed, more up to date imagery shows the Russians had bridged it at least twice. Secondly there's no river current and no up/ down stream traffic. As a permanent solution the Russians simply filled it in to make a crossing (apparently sometime in September?), so it isn't a bridge any more. Only way to get rid of that is something far more explosive than HiMARS rockets, or to hit the lock gates to generate a, uh, current (which would be functionally identical to hitting the dam proper).

Are you aware, that the Bridge over the Kakhovka Dam is in one of the red rectangles? And my image is from November the 3rd, where it was hit again, and there was a big fire exactly in the red rectangles…

If they wanted to hit the Dam they would hit another bridge, the curved one which is on the picture on the left border, under left down corner of the green rectangle, which is considered the weakest link of that road, but “surprise, surprise”, they did not hit that segment once since start of the war. Exactly for the same reason, because it is the weakest link… 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Mamoulian War

[BruceVC]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11390737/Xi-Jinping-warns-Putin-not-use-nukes-rare-rebuke-Ukraine-war.html

China has rebuked Putin with his comments  of using nukes, to quote 

"President Xi and I agree: nuclear threats are irresponsible and incendiary,' Scholz said after the meeting. 'By using nuclear weapons, Russia would be crossing a line that the community of states has drawn together "

Guess Putins threats  have become less concerning?

 

 

 

[Malcador]

6 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

It's so weird how having even an ounce of empathy for your enemy while still wanting them to be defeated can get you lumped right in with them to at least a couple of posters in here.

Propaganda is a wonderous thing

 

[Lexx]

I'm feeling bad for every soldier that gets taken out by a drone grenade. Even worse are the ones who get multiple dropped on them before they die. I think it's terrible to watch, and we're all getting desensitized from seeing this. Also, every time I see people making fun of the targets I'm cringing hard. Doesn't matter if they are russian or ukraine soldiers, it's just not a good look.

I really don't want people to die like this ... but on the other hand, russia could just f-off and finally leave, and all of this would end.

Edited November 7, 2022 by Lexx

[Malcador]

Interesting reading on the air war. Well or as it seems both sides trying to avoid getting blown out of the sky by the SAMs -https://rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/special-resources/russian-air-war-and-ukrainian-requirements-air-defence

They do mention Gripens being a good option for donation.

[kanisatha]

23 hours ago, Lexx said:

I dunno man.

Or how about this recently: https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/maddowblog/marjorie-taylor-greene-gop-wont-give-ukraine-another-penny-rcna55649

Oh right. And there are no idiot Democrats like this. Sure.

And you want to quote MSNBC and the Rachel Maddow Show? LOL. That's Democrat propaganda central.

I've already acknowledged there are idiot R's. And for every one of them there's an idiot D out there too.

[kanisatha]

The sorry situation facing Putin's 300k mobilization recruits:

https://www.yahoo.com/video/battalion-russian-conscripts-destroyed-luhansk-194504321.html

The details in this particular mobilization battalion's experience are quite shocking.

[Gfted1]

^Its crazy to me that they just scoop people off the streets, hand them an AK-47 and a set of fatigues, and dump them on the front line. I mean jeez, at least send them through some form of a truncated basic training. Conscripts will never be a match for a professional army (unless you have a Billion to bumrush with) but this is just a meatgrinder.

[Chilloutman]

well thats definition of cannon fodder. I guess Russia hopes they have more bodies than Ukraine ammunition. 

[Lexx]

55 minutes ago, kanisatha said:

And you want to quote MSNBC and the Rachel Maddow Show? LOL. That's Democrat propaganda central.

I just took the first hit I found on google. It was a widely posted news story at the time.

[Malcador]

Good thing Greene is an outlier in the GOP.

[Hurlshort]

1 hour ago, kanisatha said:

Oh right. And there are no idiot Democrats like this. Sure.

And you want to quote MSNBC and the Rachel Maddow Show? LOL. That's Democrat propaganda central.

I've already acknowledged there are idiot R's. And for every one of them there's an idiot D out there too.

It is not a 1 to 1 ratio. Maybe before Trump it was, but now it is super skewed. It doesn't help that a good chunk of moderate Republicans have been driven away from the party. My wife's family were lifelong Republicans, and now they are all independent aside from one crazy Uncle that posts conspiracy theories all the time.

[kanisatha]

8 minutes ago, Hurlshort said:

It is not a 1 to 1 ratio. Maybe before Trump it was, but now it is super skewed. It doesn't help that a good chunk of moderate Republicans have been driven away from the party. My wife's family were lifelong Republicans, and now they are all independent aside from one crazy Uncle that posts conspiracy theories all the time.

And tomorrow you're going to see millions of people who used to be D lifers walking away from the Democratic Party. The news media, being totally in the tank for the Democrats, always loves to highlight and showcase only the R crazies. But ordinary average people know all about the D crazies too, who are absolutely 1:1.

[BruceVC]

5 minutes ago, kanisatha said:

And tomorrow you're going to see millions of people who used to be D lifers walking away from the Democratic Party. The news media, being totally in the tank for the Democrats, always loves to highlight and showcase only the R crazies. But ordinary average people know all about the D crazies too, who are absolutely 1:1.

Agreed, I am expecting comprehensive GOP victories but once the midterms are over then we can analyze why and where the Democrats are going wrong 

 

[BruceVC]

1 hour ago, Gfted1 said:

^Its crazy to me that they just scoop people off the streets, hand them an AK-47 and a set of fatigues, and dump them on the front line. I mean jeez, at least send them through some form of a truncated basic training. Conscripts will never be a match for a professional army (unless you have a Billion to bumrush with) but this is just a meatgrinder.

Its true and this is the  " advantage "  about being an autocrat and controlling the country through security forces and an iron fist. Putin doesnt have to be concerned with the lives of Russians because citizens cant do anything to change the reality of his leadership and there is no free media to significantly  criticize his decisions and their  outcomes 

[Gfted1]

11 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Its true and this is the  " advantage "  about being an autocrat and controlling the country through security forces and an iron fist. Putin doesnt have to be concerned with the lives of Russians because citizens cant do anything to change the reality of his leadership and there is no free media to significantly  criticize his decisions and their  outcomes 

Right, but youd think he is concerned about winning the war. Ffs, if the article is to be believed, the professional army is back on the 3rd(!) line. Lol, what.

[majestic]

What's the difference between a fiscally responsible Republican and orcs? One's a fantasy character, and the others are the bad guys in Lord of the Rings.

Edited November 7, 2022 by majestic

[Malcador]

Just now, Gfted1 said:

Right, but youd think he is concerned about winning the war. Ffs, if the article is to be believed, the professional army is back on the 3rd(!) line. Lol, what.

Can use lower quality troops to shield better ones that need rest.  I think Ukraine used their TDF in a similar fashion, at least in intent, not as poorly as Russia seems to be using these.  And defending with them is not as bad as using them as attack.

[majestic]

Putting the best troops in the third line is a tried and true approach, but luckily the Russians did not seem to learn the 2500 year old lesson that a more flexible command strategy often stops things from going to the proverbial triarii. Res ad triarios rediit and all that.

[Gfted1]

3 minutes ago, majestic said:

Putting the best troops in the third line is a tried and true approach, but luckily the Russians did not seem to learn the 2500 year old lesson that a more flexible command strategy often stops things from going to the proverbial triarii. Res ad triarios rediit and all that.

I didnt know that. Fascinating: Triarii - Wikipedia

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

1 hour ago, Hurlshort said:

It is not a 1 to 1 ratio. Maybe before Trump it was, but now it is super skewed. It doesn't help that a good chunk of moderate Republicans have been driven away from the party. My wife's family were lifelong Republicans, and now they are all independent aside from one crazy Uncle that posts conspiracy theories all the time.

 

22 minutes ago, majestic said:

What's the difference between a fiscally responsible Republican and orcs? One's a fantasy character, and the others are the bad guys in Lord of the Rings.

Those are salient points, but AOC didn't reply to my DM respectfully asking for feet pics so both sides are equally bad.

"Deny feet, get heat" - Quentin Tarantino 

[kanisatha]

1 hour ago, Gfted1 said:

Right, but youd think he is concerned about winning the war. Ffs, if the article is to be believed, the professional army is back on the 3rd(!) line. Lol, what.

Yeah, there was another article from a couple of weeks ago I read in which they quote Russian commanders openly saying they have put the "reservists" in two lines on the west side of the river just so that they will serve as obstacles through which the Ukrainians will have to assault before they get to the "good" Russian troops.

[Zoraptor]

9 hours ago, Mamoulian War said:

Are you aware, that the Bridge over the Kakhovka Dam is in one of the red rectangles? And my image is from November the 3rd, where it was hit again, and there was a big fire exactly in the red rectangles…

0) No I'm not, because it isn't.

1) The dam/ bridge blocks/ crosses the Dniepr River, which is maybe 300m wide at that point, not 15m. The lock is 15m wide. Handy wikimapia link as illustration. Make sure to turn on the satellite imagery too as...

2) ..the tweet is from Nov 3, but..

3) ..the satellite imagery most definitely is not from Nov 3, it's bog standard Google imagery which could be anything up to literal years old. This is what it looks like on a more up to date image. Note the two extra bridges, and the infill.

[Gorth]

6 hours ago, majestic said:

Putting the best troops in the third line is a tried and true approach, but luckily the Russians did not seem to learn the 2500 year old lesson that a more flexible command strategy often stops things from going to the proverbial triarii. Res ad triarios rediit and all that.

You could argue they are actually fighting like a 500bc army at times... when generals lead from the front and peasants were expendable.