Ukraine conflict - im Westen nichts Neues

[Katphood]

I belong to the most elite army in the world...

...and yet, I don't even know where I'm headed!

[Pidesco]

7 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Thats not a nice thing to suggest, I am sure @Elerond is ethnically pure blood  Finnish?

Elerond joined the forums last decade so by my standards he is a newer forum member.

[kanisatha]

44 minutes ago, HoonDing said:

There's very few news about proceedings in the south/south east near Mariupol, because the Ukrainians are getting hammered there.

Wouldn't surprise me. The Russians have been demanding Ukraine give up Mariupol for years now, so they can have complete control of the Sea of Azov. The poor Ukrainians there will be getting squeezed between Russian thrusts from the NE and the SW.

[kanisatha]

40 minutes ago, xzar_monty said:

Täällähän on ihan saatanasti suomalaisia juuri nyt.

Translation: an awful lot of Finns taking part in the conversation right now.

Actually, no wonder, given where that delightful country is situated...

Not to mention the Russians already took half of it once before. Coming back for what they didn't finish before is classic Russian behavior. Just like Ukraine and the other parts of the former USSR, I'm quite sure Putin believes there is no such thing as Finland or being Finnish and that land is all just an extension of Russia.

I fully expect claims to Alaska will be put forward very soon (not joking).

[pmp10]

And Kiev has been encircled, or at least the city's Mayor claims so.
That western aid is really unlikely to ever reach places where it's really needed. 

[xzar_monty]

47 minutes ago, kanisatha said:

Not to mention the Russians already took half of it once before.

11 per cent. But far too much, anyway, no question.

[Zoraptor]

8 hours ago, Mamoulian War said:

@Zoraptor According to Al-Jazeera, the Russian progress form the south is halted for the time being. We'll see

The problem in the south is that the Russians are- for once- saying almost nothing and aren't leaking all over VK; and the Ukrainians are saying nothing when it's going badly. We don't know if they've stopped or not, we don't know if they're clearing pockets and we don't know if they'll suddenly pop up in Dnipro' or Zaporizhie until some random cellphone coverage that can be verified turns up. For all we actually know the Ukrainians could have chased them back to the Crimea, it's just very unlikely as they'd shout that to the stars.

7 hours ago, Mamoulian War said:

Well, as you might have noticed, the first wave of Russian soldiers are consisting of inexperienced conscripts, and because of that, I kind of doubt, that even military leaders of these troops are the Russian tactical elites. These kind of mistakes seems logical, when taking this fact into consideration...

The dichotomy of the invasion is that every single Russian is either elite troops like VDV or Spetsnaz, or a rural hillbilly dragged off the farm and handed a Kalashnikov.

5 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

This is an interesting point. I wonder if it has something to do with complacency/hubris brought on by their numerically superior forces.

Partly it's just their doctrine, with an added dollop of... well, racism*, if you took Russian as a race. Or bigotry, if you prefer. All through the latter part of WW2 they'd do steamroller type offenses where they'd run over the Germans one front at a time. The balance is that in a western force has a far larger proportion of its numbers dedicated to supply and maintenance rather than actually fighting.

*compare the Liberation of France with Operation Bagration- one ran out of supplies, in France, because they moved so far so fast; the other ran out of supplies in Belarus because they were disorganised/ wanted the Warsaw Rising to fail, were using human wave tactics, depending on agenda. You don't tend to get much mentioned beyond that, like the massive difference in infrastructure between France and Belarus or the difference in the sizes of land or forces involved.

3 hours ago, kanisatha said:

Re. Kharkiv or any other major Ukrainian city, weren't we also told Kyiv was going to fall two nights ago?

By the US? Or at least anonymous administration/ military sources of the US.

2 hours ago, Sarex said:

I saw a video of a tank being destroyed in the morning titled "Ukrainian tank being destroyed", in the afternoon that same video was titled "Russian tank being destroyed". Until this situation is over and we see the end result, it's going to be very hard for us to know what is happening.

Yeah, you'd see a column of destroyed Ukrainian vehicles then a few hours later it would be reposted with Z's photoshopped onto everything. Kind of funny in the case when it wasn't even a 'Z' area. Parked up tank, obviously abandoned by the Russians. Blown up S-300, has to be Russian, obviously they'd deploy an AA system with a range of 250+km at the front lines, and only paint an ID on it after it had been destroyed so the marking was over the burns...

2 hours ago, HoonDing said:

There's very few news about proceedings in the south/south east near Mariupol, because the Ukrainians are getting hammered there.

Tokmak air base is... kinda important?

And Tokmak was captured 2 days ago.

44 minutes ago, pmp10 said:

And Kiev has been encircled, or at least the city's Mayor claims so.

If true it shows there's definitely been another lot of Hostomel like wishful thinking. Russian paradrop at Vasylkiv, but they were wiped out, and the Ukrainians shot down two transports full of paratroops too! Has there been any corroboration of that? Well not so far as I can tell, and it's the sort of thing you'd expect there to be lots of evidence presented of, the Ukrainians announced they were destroying a bridge in the face of the Russians who were wiped out hours ago, and now Russian troops have teleported from Irpin to the Dniepr in a few hours, 50 presumably well defended km. The only conclusion to be reached is that the Russians won at Vasylkiv (may not have taken the airport there though, depends on whether the fuel fire there was really caused by Russian missiles or was blown up by retreating Ukrainians).

[Sarex]

15 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

Yeah, you'd see a column of destroyed Ukrainian vehicles then a few hours later it would be reposted with Z's photoshopped onto everything. Kind of funny in the case when it wasn't even a 'Z' area. Parked up tank, obviously abandoned by the Russians. Blown up S-300, has to be Russian, obviously they'd deploy an AA system with a range of 250+km at the front lines, and only paint an ID on it after it had been destroyed so the marking was over the burns...

Oh wow, I've seen none of those. Then again I wasn't going out of my way to search for the stuff.

[Darkpriest]

Interesting PoV and why it is not as easy to say and block someone from SWIFT or sanction the whole country like Russia. 

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/pozsar-warns-another-lehman-weekend-russia-sanctions-may-trigger-central-bank-liquidity

[Malcador]

EU aid including fighter jets - I guess any leftover MiGs Poland or others have.

[Mamoulian War]

Denmark allows their volunteers to join Ukraine foreign brigade.

And Hungary denies any weapon support for Ukraine.

on the other hand Slovakia sends weapon support worth 4 millions EUR.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Mamoulian War

[Sarex]

One thing that I'm wondering, do Ukrainian soldiers know how to use the equipment they are being sent?

[pmp10]

26 minutes ago, Sarex said:

Oh wow, I've seen none of those. Then again I wasn't going out of my way to search for the stuff.

Personally I loved the one where Russians were getting their tanks stolen by gypsies.
I get that there is Ukrainian morale to consider and everyone loves to help, but the world is doing Ukrainians a disservice.

There will be one rude awakening one day that no only are they being badly beaten but are also dying for a hopeless cause.
That's how 'stab in the back' legends are born and cause issues for generations.
 

Edited February 27, 2022 by pmp10

[Mamoulian War]

1 minute ago, Sarex said:

One thing that I'm wondering, do Ukrainian soldiers know how to use the equipment they are being sent?

Lot of Eastern NATO members have still a big piles of Russian stuff in their armies, so I presume this is being sent in a first wave. And a lot of Ukrainian have been trained in western tech, during last 8 years. I bet, that Ukrainian Ministry of Defense has sent some kind of list of stuff, which they deem most useful. At least that would be the most logical way of things to do.

[Mamoulian War]

 

[Sarex]

This may sound a little...whatever... but for now it looks like the Russians are really trying to avoid civilian casualties. Then again it may only look like that, I guess we will never know for sure.

But guess in the end it doesn't matter at all, because the best way would have been not to invade after all.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Sarex

[Sarex]

9 minutes ago, Sarex said:

This may sound a little...whatever... but for now it looks like the Russians are really trying to avoid civilian casualties. Then again it may only look like that, I guess we will never know for sure.

But guess in the end it doesn't matter at all, because the best way would have been not to invade after all.

And then I read this...

https://greekcitytimes.com/2022/02/27/greece-defence-equipment-ukraine/

[Mamoulian War]

Speaking of Mariupol

 

[Sarex]

Damn... https://t.me/voyna_novost/16207

 

Seems like a Ukrainian/Russian MLRS being destroyed.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Sarex

[Malcador]

Some sort of ammo dump ?

[Sarex]

6 minutes ago, Malcador said:

Some sort of ammo dump ?

Rocket launcher.

[Darkpriest]

1 hour ago, Darkpriest said:

Interesting PoV and why it is not as easy to say and block someone from SWIFT or sanction the whole country like Russia. 

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/pozsar-warns-another-lehman-weekend-russia-sanctions-may-trigger-central-bank-liquidity

Looking like things might get ugly in the markets... 

 

[Sarex]

11 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

Looking like things might get ugly in the markets... 

 

I mean it's not like it will get worse for them by doing it and it's a middle finger to everyone else.

[InsaneCommander]

Turkey to implement pact limiting Russian warships to Black Sea.

[Zoraptor]

14 minutes ago, Sarex said:

Rocket launcher.

I'd have guessed it was a Buratino, if it was a MLRS going up. I'd be a bit skeptical though with the number of people who've been begging for footage of one of those exploding.

General consensus in the more neutral parts of reddit seems to be it that it was an ammo or chemical storage dump on the outskirts of Cherkassy, from the geolocation.