Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Part 2

[Vaeliorin]

It's really not that common.  I got slightly annoyed with level drain (which isn't super common, but there are a couple types of enemies that do it that appear occasionally) but mostly because I didn't have access to restoration yet.

What did annoy me was a random encounter with a dragon with a 20d6 breath weapon that wiped out half my party on turn 1 (to be fair, the dragon rolled really well with a 105 on 20d6 which is 50% above average.)

[Gromnir]

42 minutes ago, Setzer said:

I've been itching for a good CRPG to play. Is this worth jumping into now or should I wait a few months for them to fix the bugs like with Kingmaker?

the question is less straightforward than it might appear to be at first glance. wotr provides so many options and one suspects a great many options are working properly or if they are not, most people won't realize if a roll that should be a functional 10% boost is only providing 8%. the thing is, based on board feedback, a few mythic paths are not advancing properly due to either quest issues or mechanics problems. also, if you are unlucky or unknowing and choose a broken class, spells or feats, then no doubt a wotr gaming experience will be frustrating.

regardless, it is rare when the best advice regarding a pc game release would be other than delaying your initial purchase for a few months. there is a good chance the game will drop in price after six months or so (not always) and you most certainly will be playing a more stable product after a few robust patches have fixed many problems.

for this individual, the game is not unplayable in its current state, but such is because our expectations were for the wotr release to be a functional additional beta stage.

HA! Good Fun!

ps am already having invested dozens of hours into the game and the end of chapter two (of six total chapters) is gonna happen sometime today. am suspecting less pokey players have gotten a fair bit deeper into the game. not unplayable, but not polished by any means and there is a few bugs which could result in significant frustration depending on your character and quest choices.

[Setzer]

36 minutes ago, Gromnir said:

the question is less straightforward than it might appear to be at first glance. wotr provides so many options and one suspects a great many options are working properly or if they are not, most people won't realize if a roll that should be a functional 10% boost is only providing 8%. the thing is, based on board feedback, a few mythic paths are not advancing properly due to either quest issues or mechanics problems. also, if you are unlucky or unknowing and choose a broken class, spells or feats, then no doubt a wotr gaming experience will be frustrating.

regardless, it is rare when the best advice regarding a pc game release would be other than delaying your initial purchase for a few months. there is a good chance the game will drop in price after six months or so (not always) and you most certainly will be playing a more stable product after a few robust patches have fixed many problems.

for this individual, the game is not unplayable in its current state, but such is because our expectations were for the wotr release to be a functional additional beta stage.

HA! Good Fun!

ps am already having invested dozens of hours into the game and the end of chapter two (of six total chapters) is gonna happen sometime today. am suspecting less pokey players have gotten a fair bit deeper into the game. not unplayable, but not polished by any means and there is a few bugs which could result in significant frustration depending on your character and quest choices.

Thanks for the response! I've read that most of the bugs appear to be in the later parts of the game so maybe I'll go ahead and get it now. It will most likely take me a few months to get to that point due to my limited game time, so by then maybe most of the issues should be resolved.  I could also wait for a discount but I don't mind paying full price to help support the developers so that they can continue making these types of CRPG's in the future.

[InsaneCommander]

Mortismal Gaming (somebody posted his review in the previous thread) posted this yesterday:

Quote

Hit my first progression blocking bug (Mythic quest requiring a crusade event) in Wrath of the Righteous.....about 1/3rd of the way through the unfair difficulty run I was doing. Brutal.

 

[Raithe]

I will say I can't really see an Evil playthrough working that well. They have got a couple of interesting ideas in there for what what be evil characters (mythic path options of Devil, Demon, and Lich plus a bunch of undead related companions you could get on the Lich route..) but actual evil choices to make it dialogue and such are all shallow, don't usually blend into the rest of the story or the characters around you.  Most of the evil choices are pretty much of the "I kill you!" variety, with a handful of casual, petty cruelty for the sake of being a **** ones. 

That, and no matter what you do, most of the npcs still react as if you're the saviour of the world / chosen one.

Had one major bug so far, a companions storyline requires them to disappear, but then they were still at the army camp and could be selected to join the party. Thus the next step of their quest to find them again never kicked off properly.

[Gromnir]

almost 3:30 am pst and there is an update o' ~3.5gb. am not certain what are the fixes.

we had finished chapter two yesterday and were debating holding off on more wotr gaming until a few crusade bugs were addressed. mayhap the wait will be shorter than anticipated.

(edit)

patch notes.

a few notables fixed.

a few notables missing.

HA! Good Fun!

Edited September 10, 2021 by Gromnir

[Melusina]

too much bugs currently, I experienced a little amount of them, but still not overly happy because of them.

 

Still this is game I had been dreaming since NWN2, so it's great in my book. Crusade management is something I don't like.

[ShadySands]

On 9/9/2021 at 11:14 AM, Setzer said:

I've been itching for a good CRPG to play. Is this worth jumping into now or should I wait a few months for them to fix the bugs like with Kingmaker?

Depends how quickly you play these types of games. If you go slow and take your time or play turn based then you may be fine picking it up now because I'm most of the way through Act 3 and haven't had any real issues but otherwise I'd hold off for at least a month or so. 

The new patch fixed my auto-cast issue so I'm back at it

[uuuhhii]

10 hours ago, Melusina said:

too much bugs currently, I experienced a little amount of them, but still not overly happy because of them.

 

Still this is game I had been dreaming since NWN2, so it's great in my book. Crusade management is something I don't like.

this game is far too long and complicated

have to abandon dozens of hours of progress due to game breaking bug would be incredibly frustrating

[BruceVC]

I am always impressed by gamers who are more than willing to play games knowing their are guaranteed bugs.....I cant do that, I would find it very annoying which is why I have my " 3 month " wait till I play any game rule " 

I cant imagine  starting a game and then bugs cause me to not be able to complete it 

[bugarup]

I took a couple character around for, I think, mid chapter 1? And have thoughts:

† Tutorial dungeon is so tedious, Chateau d'Irenicus is trip to Disneyland as a five year old compared to it, I hope it gets modded out;

† Glaives are new longswords, game drops them by dozens. I thought maybe there's some demonic connection, but no, it's a favored weapon of a LG deity, paladin order and all;

† Alignments. I expected Evil = Stupid, but didn't really expect Lawful = Evil. So many "(Lawful): Die, lawbreaker!" options. Like, I'm so much not a fan of those law abiding stick-in-a-muds that I ever only play Lawful Evils, but even I think it's really unfair;

† Was struggling and not having fun on modified core difficulty, dropped to normal and suddenly the archer who I don't think landed a hit on core is exploding everything? Kinda same on the difficulty between. The most significant difference between those are weakened vs regular critical hits, and it got me thinking. Call me paranoid, but I have a suspicion the game plays with the loaded dice because it knows that mostly crit-stacking, min-maxing munchkins will play those difficulties and adjusts accordingly. That, or I had a stretch of exceptionally bad luck throughout multiple characters because everyone and their dog were constantly critting against me.

† The first chapter has a bloody hidden timer which is not the same as "this quest will fail when chapter ends" warning, oh hell no, it's f*ing hidden. So it's entirely possible to go out and explore in different order than the game wants you to and lose support for the chapter end fight and even companions.

† Companions are in average 3.6 roentgen. Paladin's likeable if unremarkable, I don't know who other than Extremely Chaotic Stupid would pick Facehugger Woman over half-Mystique archer, benched Little Miss Gets-Off-Murder as soon as I could, not because she's a creepy Creeperella McCreep but because I've no idea how to play her class, elf kid is poor man's Grieving Mother, prettyboy is Jubilost but tw*ttier, weirdo mage tries way too hard and tiefling, him I like. Kind of like male Neeshka with some mannerisms of Morte, also feels a bit like a family because of "It's all your fault!" cry when he goes down.

† Not as many bugs as I expected. Some visuals, no auto-attack selection, touch stuff refuses to work in turn-based for no apparent reason, trait mysteriously vanished (I've read that some mythic traits or feats can be dispelled with Dispel Magic, maybe same case), but nothing too horrible and there's even a positive bug, "Heal Wounds" cast getting doubled.

† The story, while cheesy, but not as much as Drakensang or D:OS levels of abomination I expected based on comments. Serviceable but uninspired and since there's unlikely "A slave obeys" moment farther in the story, I can now put the game away and wait for a year or half of bugfixin'.

 

Meh. Average fun.

[xzar_monty]

On 9/10/2021 at 3:00 PM, Melusina said:

too much bugs currently, I experienced a little amount of them, but still not overly happy because of them.

This doesn't count as a proper bug, but it crops up often enough to annoy me. Let's say you're playing a slayer. Some of the abilities you'll get are from the rogue pool, while others come from the ranger pool. These abilities are always described in terms of the main class that gets them, so even if you're a slayer dude, the description of your, say, sneak attack will read something along the lines of "The rogue will be able to..." and so on. The descriptions of my current set of skills make my character look a bit like a smorgasbord in terms of class, even if I'm playing a single class.

Bad design. I wonder why they didn't think of this.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

6 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

I wonder why they didn't think of this.

Ability text is mostly copied straight from pnp. In Kingmaker I believe this caused some confusion for an ability that was misprinted in pnp that ended up being corrected, but I forget the details. For the Slayer, in pnp the talents they share with Rogue often say "the rogue can" instead of specifying "the slayer can" or "the character can". With combat style talents it says "the slayer selects a ranger combat style". So you can blame Paizo for that.

The rest of it is probably to save time.

[xzar_monty]

Interesting. Thanks!

Saving time simply isn't a justification, in my book anyway. I mean, I could forgo error checking in my work "to save time", but that's a very serious no-no.

[ShadySands]

They probably didn't think anyone would care but I guess it's like pronouns changing in different descriptions. They probably could implement a system that automagically inserts the right class or whatever but didn't feel it was worth the investment and that's if it occurred to them at all.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

36 minutes ago, xzar_monty said:

Interesting. Thanks!

Saving time simply isn't a justification, in my book anyway. I mean, I could forgo error checking in my work "to save time", but that's a very serious no-no.

It's worse for archetypes that take abilities from other classes, because in pnp the description pretty much tells you to look it up. Which would get tedious, so the copy pasting makes more sense. Add in the complexity of multiclassing with potentially overlapping abilities, like Vivisectionist/Arcane Enforcer/Thug/Scaled Fist and you're potentially looking at a massive cluster**** in a game that is already a buggy mess.

It's still not great though. 

[uuuhhii]

after 10 years of accumulated mess of pathfinder 1e

owlcat might have more problem try to rewrite all the description rather than direct copy from book

and does anyone know how to convince greybor to retire

didn't have much dialogue to push toward either way

Edited September 13, 2021 by uuuhhii

[Gromnir]

On 9/12/2021 at 5:57 AM, BruceVC said:

I am always impressed by gamers who are more than willing to play games knowing their are guaranteed bugs.....I cant do that, I would find it very annoying which is why I have my " 3 month " wait till I play any game rule " 

I cant imagine  starting a game and then bugs cause me to not be able to complete it 

personal we got a six month wait rule, but we contributed to the kickstarter and paid for beta, so would be kinda weird if after six months o' buggy beta testing we sudden decided the game were too unstable to play.

aside, there is a new patch o' +9gb. no notes as yet.

we got a couple extreme annoying bugs (missing feats for camellia and animal companions) and am dubious this patch will fix those issues. am having one possible game stopper nobody else has mentioned at owlcat boards, so am having even less confidence our biggest problem is gonna be addressed. replayed a portion o' the game many times trying to find a workaround to what may or may not be a serious roadblock for a mythic path

Spoiler

on hope's wings quest for the angel path (am playing a sacred huntsmaster/zen archer to avoid the opness o' oracle and cleric with angel) has us rescue targona, but when we speak to her in drezen, the quest completes seeming successful but the quest log shows we failed to rescue her. 

am not wanting to play another few dozen hours only to find advancement hampered or stymied.

HA! Good Fun!

edit:https://steamcommunity.com/app/1184370/eventcomments/3044985412487813247/

pps  another bug which ain't game breaking but is unfortunate is the inability to use ranged weapons in tb mode while mounted.  is a known issue and has not been addressed the last couple patch iterations, which is hindering the usefulness o' our snapshot lann. 

on the positive side o' the ledger, am gonna assume camellia will be able to take the intimidating display hex. not sure if we need respec to fix.

Edited September 14, 2021 by Gromnir

[ShadySands]

@GromnirI just checked my completed quests and that one completed fine for me. I think I did it yesterday or the day before but I've been sick and the days are running together.

 

And below is where I'm at currently in the game

Spoiler

I just launched my attack on the Midnight Fane and my party is half way to level 15. So far other than the stuff that wasn't fully implemented I haven't seen a lot of content that wasn't in the beta, some but not a lot. Of the new stuff I think maybe Blackwater was my favorite of the new content and not just because of the DOOM reference. Recruited all the companions but Camelia is no longer with us for various reasons and I'm only taking Wendy along because I want to see if her part plays out like it did in the beta if you go with Lann first like a normal smart person.

 

Edited September 14, 2021 by ShadySands

[Gromnir]

46 minutes ago, ShadySands said:

@GromnirI just checked my completed quests and that one completed fine for me. I think I did it yesterday or the day before but I've been sick and the days are running together.

 

And below is where I'm at currently in the game

  Reveal hidden contents

I just launched my attack on the Midnight Fane and my party is half way to level 15. So far other than the stuff that wasn't fully implemented I haven't seen a lot of content that wasn't in the beta, some but not a lot. Of the new stuff I think maybe Blackwater was my favorite of the new content and not just because of the DOOM reference. Recruited all the companions but Camelia is no longer with us for various reasons and I'm only taking Wendy along because I want to see if her part plays out like it did in the beta if you go with Lann first like a normal smart person.

 

terrible part is am not knowing if our game is busted and won't know until chapter four when a certain pivotal npc is required to advance quests. maybe won't know 'til later. game says we didn't save her, but we spoke to her same as usual in drezen after attaining level four mythic for angel, so...

am level thirteen (perhaps 1/4 o' the way to fourteen) and am about to start blackwater, but have been doing crusade purposeful slow, and we already spent a day doing nothing save the aforementioned area. got at least a couple days before we make it to the end of chapter three. 

first world problems if ever there were one. we roll our eyes as folks jabber on 'bout the recent met gala-- who wore what and showed up with whom? who cares? 'course here we is getting annoyed by a pc game we knew would be bugged?

...

unfortunate, recognition o' the triviality does not decrease our frustration.

HA! Good Fun!

 

 

[uuuhhii]

anyone know where sword of valor are?

explored most of the map still couldn't find the camp

[Gromnir]

13 minutes ago, uuuhhii said:

anyone know where sword of valor are?

explored most of the map still couldn't find the camp

am not understanding the question.

retrieval o' the sword of valor is the primary goal of chapter two.  won't find it in camp.

HA! Good Fun!

[uuuhhii]

2 hours ago, Gromnir said:

am not understanding the question.

retrieval o' the sword of valor is the primary goal of chapter two.  won't find it in camp.

HA! Good Fun!

it is in a camp at chapter 5

about middle right of the map

[Gromnir]

4 hours ago, uuuhhii said:

it is in a camp at chapter 5

about middle right of the map

which is precise why the initial question were creating confusion. 

well, seems you got the answer regardless.

finished blackwater, a bunch o' crusade stuff, as well as companion quests for seelah and sosiel. leadership would appear to be the one stat am lacking insofar as the crusade is concerned. most o' the leadership options is appearing to be timed events (other than recruiting devas for 80 power a pop?) so am not quite sure what am doing wrong. 

oh well, we has purposeful allowed two demon forts to remain and enough demon armies to get us through an additional +two months o' calendar time w/o suffering morale loss. 

am nevertheless gonna wail and moan like a poopy pants toddler if our angel mythic is busted and am doing all this for naught. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

[uuuhhii]

41 minutes ago, Gromnir said:

which is precise why the initial question were creating confusion. 

well, seems you got the answer regardless.

finished blackwater, a bunch o' crusade stuff, as well as companion quests for seelah and sosiel. leadership would appear to be the one stat am lacking insofar as the crusade is concerned. most o' the leadership options is appearing to be timed events (other than recruiting devas for 80 power a pop?) so am not quite sure what am doing wrong. 

oh well, we has purposeful allowed two demon forts to remain and enough demon armies to get us through an additional +two months o' calendar time w/o suffering morale loss. 

am nevertheless gonna wail and moan like a poopy pants toddler if our angel mythic is busted and am doing all this for naught. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

heard angel late game are bugged

didn't know if it was fixed in 1.03