PK htiw klaw eriF

Care to explain? We have very different economic views. My economic views are stubbornly moderate, so we might have a bit more in common than you'd think. I know, my Obsidianstalking.txt shows you saying something along those lines.

Care to explain? We have very different economic views.

You're going to give Kain an aneurysm. I agree with him actually, but I wager my conclusion from the information my best interests are not served by private businesses is much different than his.

And they still have to pay extremely high water bills for poison

Now that's a new one to me. I guess you can lump me with the rest of the non-Americans who caught the original incident and subsequent fallout, and just use it for pop-culture snerk humour ever since. I don't think that's just non-Americans, it's one of those things a person will always be known for unfortunately. She could cure cancer and still probably be known as the woman who gave the president the blowjob heard around the world and who later cured cancer. Talking heads would even debate if the first thing was somehow related to the latter It would certainly be a more pleasant treatment than chemo or radiation.

They did before the US actually, just not manned landings. And for being so "technologically backwards", they sure managed to pioneer the stuff that makes up current space operations so clearly their science fields were doing something right. Pretty good record when their main competitor was more scientifically advanced and wealthier. And if you could have the technological advancement without totalitarian measures like those found in the Soviet Union or being pushed with the TPP. It's absolutely idiotic to think that taking influence from a state regarding a science program requires the adoption of all policies implemented by that state. If the US were to massively increase resources allocated to scientific research that would hardly require limiting free speech or implementing a surveillance of all citizens. Cuba's health care performs similarly or better than the US while costing a lower percentage of GDP than the US despite the US being much wealthier. In most circles, that would be considered "better" and indicative the US could be doing something differently. What you said to amounts to a feeling, not a fact. Go to Tumblr if you want feels to matter. Being against surveillance of citizens is idiotic now? I guess totalitarian measures are only bad when those dirty commies do it. Clearly the US government will never do anything wrong. I take it when anyone admires Thomas Jefferson and they don't want to enslave their biological children you're going to get triggered and call them hypocrites? Because clearly it's impossible to admire specific qualities or opinions without emulating something completely.

Yes, because of rapid industrialization largely funded by french loans. Just like the Soviet continuation of industrialization, it had some short-term negative consequences including a famine and terrible living conditions for workers. So pioneering space exploration is now only a "so called accomplishment" that all the other European countries were doing? I was under the impression that getting into space a pretty big deal and that the Soviets managed to do it first in everything but landing on the moon. Not really. And while all this is interesting, none of it changes the fact that Bernie Sanders has consistently opposed surveillance of American Citizens throughout his time as a legislator of the US government.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jan/25/briton-on-fighting-in-syria-i-was-terrified-the-entire-way

Not what I said. Again "one can admire specific qualities or actions without wanting to emulate something wholesale". Just like one can admire the founding fathers of the US without wanting to enslave Africans and count them as 3/5ths of a person to boost representative power. Soviets beat the US when it came to space tech when they were still rural 40 years before hand, not to mention improved the infrastructure and standard of living of what was largely a state at least 100 years behind the rest of Europe. China transitioned from a primitive agricultural society to one with modern(for the time period) power systems and industry. And Cuba still has better healthcare than the US. All things someone from 1970's might find admirable when living through stagflation with little options for healthcare. Positive. And that doesn't change the fact that Americans are turning to drugs and media to escape life. This doesn't cease to be a state that collapsed over 20 years ago did something bad.

I knew Godwin was right around the corner. Yes, and in the case of the Soviet Union and China also brought around an industrialization that benefited millions while ushering in scientific progress that outpaced the US for a time and Cuba has a medical system that outperforms the US(unless you happen to be well-off) to this day. But clearly old comrade Bernie was excited at the thought of the gulags and not any of that. He isn't wrong though, kids have turned to drugs and watch tv for hours on end to escape the drudgery of low paying jobs and crippling debts. Or has poverty been a communist plot to destrot America all along? Any rights the constitution or any other document grants can be trampled by the state as it is. A leftover hippie turned politician isn't going to change that anymore than a loud billionaire or wall street shill will, because we've been living in a cyberpunk dystopia the entire time. Nah, Israel starts a nuclear war and we get Fallout. Better work on your repair skill.

The funny thing is Bernie actually does better among the general population than Hillary according to polls, so assuming he manages to overcome the Democratic Party machine they will have helped bring in a candidate both more hostile to their interests into the presidency. Absolutely hilarious.

He didn't seem to be concerned about surveillance when he expressed admiration for brutal totalitarian regimes like the Soviet Union, China and Cuba. And yet he has consistently voted against surveillance of American Citizens throughout his legislative career. Funny, it's almost like one can admire specific qualities or actions without wanting to emulate something wholesale.

It's dead Jim.

I'm scared of Sanders because his consistent opposition to government surveillance will curtail my fetish of being spied on.

I've been on a blackout on this for months, how is it looking at the moment?

The Wall Street shills are going to nationalize anything? More likely they'll make buying something from a private entity required and put a few non-whites and stronk wymynz in positions of power. And we've had thought police(cointelpro and NSA and TPP), gulags(Guantanamo), and disappearing of people for a while now. That's just a fact of having a state ruled by powers independent of the peasants/proles/citizens. The fact is all major parties, including libertarian and green, in the US are some strain of liberal with a slavish devotion to whiteknighting for large corporations. The political process is broken and nothing can stop the machine from trampling over people to the benefit of a handful of elites who own everything. Western Democracy has been a farce for a long while and the choice of which flavor you want your elected official to be is more irrelevant than the toppings on your next pizza.

Bruce I am impressed how you can say very little with so many words. The function of austerity is to curb growth by cutting spending(usually on welfare programs) and raising taxes in order to build a surplus. Greece is currently in a depressed economy. Therefore austerity in Greece will result in less growth, less help for workers, more tax burden for citizens, in an economy that already has 20%+ unemployment. It is lunacy to believe that Greece will be able to sustainably pay off debts in this situation, rather it will see the standard of living decline while money from other EU states are funneled through Greece to pay off private entities. We have seen the effects of this already, with loans being used to pay off private banks while public airports are sold to German companies and Greek women selling themselves for cheese sandwiches because shockingly enough it's hard to find work in 20%+ unemployment. If that is austerity working, anyone who supports it is either blinded by ideology or is willing to put their own self-interest above the well-being of others to an inhuman degree.

Cleric or Chanter.

Bruce the last time you used links to support your argument they provided evidence against austerity working. Unless of course you aren't concerned with unemployment or wage stagnation, but I think it would be a hard sell to claim those don't factor into standard of living.

Weren't you and KP meant to have a debate about this? If by debate you mean Bruce telling me I'm wrong without being able to make an argument on how austerity is beneficial, then I suppose we've had it.

Of course he wants mindless consumers, this is the guy behind Microsoft after all.

Obama is merely continuing the work of global capitalism, which will see working-class westerners lose status as manufacturing and some service is moved to states where they can pay workers much less. The only candidates promoting anything different are Trump(with protectionism) and Sanders(with more workers benefits and protectionism), and even then it's small differences.

They are also man made constructs, which seemed to be your issue with "evil". "mentally instability and religious indoctrination" is a strange way of spelling "material conditions". Regardless, the same applies to "morality" and "justice" in this case, which are man made constructs that vary from person to person. If you don't believe in "evil", how can you believe in "morality" and "justice"? You aren't.

Morality, laws, governance, and justice are also man made constructs Bruce.

Well if they didn't shave they couldn't fit in the bunkers.