IndiraLightfoot

Alnaimi: I adore how you patiently used your figurines for those Woedica titans and then Thalos, only to lure him into that trap at the end. Brilliant.

Yeah. I was one among many that wanted an easier and more clearcut transition from no combat to combat, and also a clearer case as to what is allowed to be used/cast before or after that transition occurs.

b0rsuk: I reckon, we need more disengagement-dampening stuff available to pick, but I also think movement and the flow of combat needs to be a bit freer as well (I have no obvious solution yet). The game still has this "bunch of baddies bumrushing me, but I'm done for if I move"-grid over it. I'd like to make that sift more open, as it were.

petrivanzyl: If you make a Cipher with a high CON, you won't need to rest very often at all. As soon as you learn how to use all of its cool and weird abilities (and use a reliable way of replenish that important focus), you're basically free to do almost whatever you want.

Nice to see the TCS done with a monk! Good on you! When I made my TCS, I picked Deep Pockets early, since I needed all those life-saving slots often.

Cipher, easy.

I just read the following post by Stun: Is this nothing more than mad ranting? Or is it the friggin Truth? Even before development of PoE began, Certain Developers from Obsidian were criticizing the attribute system in the IE games, accurately pointing out that those games had dump stats. They told us what we all already knew: that Every class can safely dump at least half of those stats without fear of crippling their builds. They Swore to fix this design flaw in PoE. They promised us No. More. Dump. Stats. Fast forward to 2015. And what a surprise. A broken promise. There are indeed Dump stats in this game. The situation is no different than it was in the IE games. So why should PoE get a pass here? Why shouldn't we level the same criticism and scorn towards its attribute system? And, having played PoE now for well over 100 hours, solely on Path of the Damned, and a lot of time invested in Triple Crown Solo, I reckon it's time for some hard talk on what works and do not work a far as PoE's character building freedom, attribute choices and varied solutions to combat/encounters go. There are number of issues to cover, and here are my views on them: Movement during combat is severely restricted I read this post two days ago: archangel979, on 24 Apr 2015 - 4:30 PM, said: Probably has to do with developer time needed to implement it. Like most of the missing "basic" features that IE games had. And then I pondered a bit over what I had just written about Tenuous Grasp for ciphers: IndiraLightfoot, on 24 Apr 2015 - 4:11 PM, said: And I suddenly realized this: I most likely love this character because it's one of the very few builds that more or less can move rather freely in combat, from the very start of combat to the end, in short, it can ignore engagement pretty often. Perhaps I'm not that fond of the engagement/disengagement mechanic, after all? You learn something new every day. I was actually a proponent for some kind of engagement mechanics during the beta, but perhaps not such a strong one as ended up in game, but now I'm not so very sure. it certainly needs a laxing overhaul. Although, I do love this more turn-based like style of combat (it reminds me of NWN2), I certainly can see the need for much more leniency when it comes to movement, especially in order to achieve build diversity. Are there dump stats among the attributes? I have played most classes on Path of the Damned (and all of them at lower difficulty levels), and I'm not sure there are. For instance, take CON. I built a tank druid as my main in my completionist playthrough, and I dumped it hard (3!), and it still works like a charm, since I only pick defensive items and talents etc for her. Well, she does complain about the need for sleep a lot. However, my solo PoTD build had maxed out CON, and it was really, really useful. Less resting, better durability when taking damage, etc, etc. I can honestly say that depending on your build, they all have their uses. Perception is perhaps the one I tend to dump a bit or more (unless building a tank). However, I can also quite honestly say that I feel that attributes mean too little in PoE, and that statement leads me into the next topic... Are items governing our build options too much? (On that darn Accuracy threshold) One stat is very, very important in PoE: Accuracy. And you can't adjust it via your attributes at all (you could during the beta). Some classes have high accuracy and others low. So, class choice dictates your level of accuracy. Personally, I find that a bit boring and constrained. However, it brings another problem: A few items, they can be enchanted or found, will increase your accuracy (a few spells will do that too). And all I can say is that such items make a lot of difference. It's almost as if they game has an Accuracy threshold, which we as players can't lower by any other means than items, spells and a certain type of talents: weapon foci, for instance adventurer or ruffian. And then you get +6 Accuracy on a weapon. That talent is so important that I've picked it for all my PotD-builds, and as soon as I have it bagged, the game gets easier. The same thing goes for weapons with Fine or better enchantments, they are the true level-uppers of the game. Monks using their fists, for instance, suffer hard from not being able to enchant them. And that locked in accuracy power beyond most of our grasp doesn't really sit perfectly with me, I'd rather leave some adjustment of Accuracy up to the players and their character builds (attributes) and choice of talents (we need more accuracy adjusting talents) to give us a better character build freedom. Are some item groups more important than others? Yes. Most gloves, helms and boots are not that important. Obviously, I have found a few that are very useful, but they are not necessary (disregarding some Mechanics enhancers etc). As for good armour, however, it is decently important, but not very game changing (except for a certain retaliation plate and a few lesser mails with cool abilities). Good weapons are very important, for instance see above. Rings and cloaks/necklaces are pretty glorious and very important, the same goes for a few belts. Finally, at Path of the damned, figurines rule! They are brilliant. The same goes for a few kinds of potions, scrolls and in fact beverages and dishes. Are there classes lacking in character build freedom? Well, you can make a ranger tank or whatever tank vis-à-vis a ranged damage/AoE spell dealer, but that is almost the main pick for most classes. Personally, I reckon the cipher gives me the most freedom, and Druid coming in as a good second, with Chanter third perhaps. However, the ranger class is somehow wrong and almost not needed. Their pet is worst than any figurine, and if it dies, your ranger is gimped for the remainder of the fight. The ranger class needs some kind of reworking to feel more unique and interesting, and in a sense, I reckon the wizard needs a similar overhaul. Yes, in my party, Aloth was the big damage dealer via AoE, but there are plenty of spells you'd most likely never pick, and I'd like to build another kind of wizard, I even made another grimoire for it (for Aloth), but just swapping them was a hazzle, and it didn't work out. On the viability of so-called glass cannons When you do build a tank, and pile up all sorts of defences, they have the problem of often being locked out of dealing damage, and vice versa, build a high DPS'er with low defences, and you'll get hit and killed in no time. I reckon there needs to be a better middle-ground there, where we can make a plethora of builds that can survive a bit better with low defences, but still be fun, viable options that last longer than seconds. In another thread, we discussed that the game zeroes in on low defence character and tries to kill them, even at absurd cost to the assailants. Perhaps that code need to be toned down a notch or two? My overall "fun" solution, when summarized, may sound weird, naïve and populistic, but I'd say: -Raise the importance of attributes -Relax the disengagement mechanic - let movement be more important - and this goes as options for most classes, not just one or two -Let us adjust Accuracy more and in a lot of ways (obviously not over the top) -Add more and varied talents for most classes (even replenishable resources for a few) -Add more items for all classes, and both defensive and offensive ones -Let tank builds builds have some DPS capabilities if built in a certain way -Let glass cannon builds (and ranger pets ) be a bit more durable than they are now So, now, bring on your own suggestions or simply opinions on what's working and what's not concerning this topic.

Deep as any well of souls, and that's just for starters.

No, not even during my completionist playthrough. I'll chalk it up as bugs, I'm afraid.

And you won't regret it. It is indeed a wonderful game with a great story, tonnes of stuff to do and explore and deal with. The atmosphere alone is fantastic, IMHO. I have a hard time comparing it to the CRPG classics, but I'd merrily go as far as to say that it certainly is at par with BG1 and NWN2 OC, for instance. Also, don't forget that it's only been out for a month now, so the room for fine-tuning and patching is very generous, and when those expansions and perhaps even PoE2 will land in the foreseeable future, I bet this will be a true classic, standing the test of time and all.

I reckon this is spot on, and since I have pushed the envelope and taken on the game at solo PotD, I'd say there is certainly room for a little more power to most classes in this game. It may be populistic, heh, but it is the fun route. I'd never sacrifice power for a cake walk game, though. Yeah, as you noticed, I feared that it may be too D3'y in my OP. Still, like you said, it's a much nicer approach to bring stuff up to the cipher's level. A number of people have asked: Is the cipher OP? Well, in the flexibility department, yes. It's the best. The druid, which I also very much like is varied too, but the things you can do with a cipher already from like level 3 is fantastic.

I agree that there could be a line or two in there that more openly support him. However, without spoiling anything, there are ways to support him, and in my latest playthrough, such actions even shows in the "saga" playing out as the ending, with pics and all.

The cipher class has a high-level detonation spell, so I'd love to see a class specializing in proper explosives, or perhaps some assault class of that sort, an early grenadier? Yum!

I absolutely adore them. However, my gripe is actually this: On higher difficulty levels, despite some swapping tactics, they are plain time thieves. You don't get your bang for the buck, methinks. Lastly, that pistol dual-wielding pirate Sensuki proposed, I'd still love to see that in PoE, where the mechanics allow for it. It would be fab.

I don't know about you, but that donkey-like laugh is truly contagious! I'm still smiling, ha ha ha...

Karkarov: As I grow a bit older, my cheevo-craving has grown too, not at any alarming rate, but I am enjoying the hunt for a few weird ones (like in Dishonored), or sometimes reaping them en masse (for instance, in COH2). As for Cipher, well OP is the word, perhaps, but I somehow want all classes to have that kind of power and resourcefulness at their disposal. And, finally, triple crown solo is mostly about patience, with some necessary cheese, glitches and exploits. The game was not built to be played like this, especially not at Path of the Damned. EDIT: There were a few places in the game in Act 2 and 3, where my solo character was spoken to in the plural, heh, as "we" etc.

Yeah, rangers certainly need some pizazz, so why not some cool resource.

I double post this post of mine here, since it better explains how you can solo PoE with a cipher, and it also includes another criticism of the game, which actually concerns movement and engagement - it's too hard, I reckon: Probably has to do with developer time needed to implement it. Like most of the missing "basic" features that IE games had. And then I pondered a bit over what I had just written about Tenuous Grasp for ciphers: And I suddenly realize this: I most likely love this character because it's one of the very few builds that more or less can move rather freely in combat, from the very start of combat to the end in short, it can ignore engagement pretty often. Perhaps I'm not that fond of the engagement/disengagement mechanic, after all? You learn something new every day.

I just read this post: Probably has to do with developer time needed to implement it. Like most of the missing "basic" features that IE games had. And then I pondered a bit over what I had just written about Tenuous Grasp for ciphers: And I suddenly realize this: I most likely love this character because it's one of the very few builds that more or less can move rather freely in combat, from the very start of combat to the end in short, it can ignore engagement pretty often. Perhaps I'm not that fond of the engagement/disengagement mechanic, after all? You learn something new every day. P.S. I was actually a proponent for some kind of engagement mechanics during the beta, but perhaps not such a strong one as ended up in game, but now I'm not so very sure. it certainly needs a laxing overhaul.

MReed: Most naively, I didn't connect those dots. I'm not sure cooldowns are needed, though. What I really like about the cipher is the urgency - if you don't land hits, no more soup for you!

Tigranes: A good point. It would be a bit messy keeping track of all that. Still, I guess it could work in simpler ways for fighter classes, and perhaps be more full-on for spell slingers? Hmm.

Leon: I see where you are coming from, but I love that OP aspect of the cipher! And its most important spell, which can be cast before combat - tenuous grasp - 10 Focus (cheap) - I would not have made it through triple crown solo without it, since I can control most encounters with it. I can chose to escape, I can break a flank if things go south, and I can even use it to lure off enemies one by one. So, basically, I wish for all classes to have that power and that resourcefulness in their arsenal - given how the game is built, I must add. For D&D, I very much prefer Vancian magic. EDIT: However, I fear that nerfing is more likely, which is a bit sad, since the way the cipher sits right now is perhaps Obsidian's coolest class creation in PoE right now. I'd much rather see it as the mould for how to do something fun and varied, instead of being a target lined up before a nerfing/balancing firing squad.

Nonek: Although I'm not able to do so myself, I really like how you hold in the reigns of your scoring in the vein of how scores used to work before the internetz and them bloated numbers in gamer magazine reviews. If only we could wind the hands of time backwards and reset certain things.

Ohioastro: Our stash is PoE is a godsend, and since I don't really like strongholds, I love how the one in PoE confined to a list of options that I may ignore or react upon in a casual way. And while I'm at it - personally, I really dig that all prebuffing is gone - it was such a chore. It makes sense to buff when combat ensues. However, I still see problems with how cumbersome it can be in PoE, especially given the speed of combat and how the availability of spells work.

I liked that mantle too, as well as his Memorial Stone-location, right on that very cool Heritage Hill.