BruceVC

He does mention Roberta Williams in the article. Also for me Video games are already a form or art, I just don't this is widely accepted though?

It is ? Thought it was just a campaign against one woman. I wish it was that simple. If it was just about Zoe I wouldn't comment at all. For some this has been a way to undermine feminist ideals and the gender equality movement. There are many comments similar to " this just highlights what hypocrites Feminists are " or " this is why I don't support these types of equality movements" I have to be honest I am surprised you cannot see this in some of the comments and what they are really saying?

I tried to stay away but the allure was too strong when it became clear this was an attack from some on the campaign for gender equality

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/20/arts/video-games/those-underappreciated-female-video-game-pioneers.html?_r=1 Guys here is a good read. Because of all the negative publicity around the Zoe Quinn incident we don't want to loose sight of the objective of gender equality in games on all levels This article discusses what women developers have done for the industry To quote the last paragraph of the article " Video games will never be widely accepted as the art form of interactive culture if half of humanity doesn’t help to shape their future" In other words we need more female involvement and representation in gaming development, that's what I understand by this?

I have to correct you on something, the official announcement that there wont be Romance came months after the game was funded. Up to then we were still debating if Romance would be in. Most promancers, like me, assumed they would be in the game on some level I am not saying we were mislead but next time it would probably be better to just say in the beginning of the KS funding phase " there will be no Romance in PoE due to reason X or reason Y " That way there will be less consternation and no surprises for any promancer I specifically recall the word on the matter being "We will consider it," aka a resounding MAYBE, with little tidbits tossed in like "I'd have to convince Chris Avellone it's worth pursuing, and he hates writing romance." Any fan of Obsidian would know this as common knowledge. Yes, you got a resounding "maybe," but you were definitely warned and informed that's one hell of a maybe. And yes I read your post. I'm directing my comments here more at anyone in general rather than you yourself, as like you said, you don't feel mislead or anything Yes I agree the initial stance from Obsidian around Romance was not positive and I know that Chris doesn't like writing Romance. But why should you think his view on any topic be automatically considered the only valid one? I imagine the whole development team, long time Obsidian staff and forum feedback also play an important part in what features should be in a game? So I'm just emphasizing the fact that it was equivocal whether Romance would be in PoE until long after the game was funded. And that's what some promancers are objecting to

The really ironic thing and best illustration given the subject matter is that if you'd talked about the things that Manning or Snowden revealed, prior to them being revealed, chances are you'd have been labelled a conspiracy theorist- despite them being correct. But how does that change the fact that both men jeopardized the security of the USA? How does it negate the fact that any country in the world would seek to prosecute anyone who did what Snowden and Assange did around confidential information?

I have to correct you on something, the official announcement that there wont be Romance came months after the game was funded. Up to then we were still debating if Romance would be in. Most promancers, like me, assumed they would be in the game on some level I am not saying we were mislead but next time it would probably be better to just say in the beginning of the KS funding phase " there will be no Romance in PoE due to reason X or reason Y " That way there will be less consternation and no surprises for any promancer

Yip typical RPG Codex stratagem, it isn't helping the situation and is creating more misinformation

Using 'conspiracy theorist' as a pejorative is about as sure a sign as there is of having a closed limited thinking mind filled with stuff dictated to you by others (aka: brainwashed). If you actually use your mind to think, you'll realize how stupid it is use that phrase so. As for the legal things Assange might face? Hurlshot has a very simplistic and jaded view of the legal system, and is likely incorrect in regards to what would happen to Assange. What he describes is the exception, not the rule, though it is a commonly perceived misconception when it comes to criminal or other trials. Of course reinforced on the laymen by mass media such as the very talk shows he refers to. What would happen would depend to a large degree on the political environment at the time, as would what would happen to Snowden if he ended up in the U.S. again. There are definitely very powerful people that would like to get their hands on both of them and 'make them pay'. And if they did they would likely not let Assange or Snowden see a fair trial in the light of day, or even the light of day itself. Both would likely be looking at a trial unlike what most U.S. citizens are used to seeing on 'Court TV' or some other such thing. The trials would likely be more akin to what Bradley Manning or Zacarias Moussaoui faced. The chances of Assange ever making the talk show circuit in the U.S. is extremely slim; probably about as good as my chances of winning the 100+ million dollar jackpot in the Mega-millions lottery this week. But really, this is something that will depend a lot on public perception and what's going on in the world at the time it happens. Though I think it's a safe bet that neither Assange nor Snowden would have a good time if they ended up in the U.S. again as things currently are. It would likely take a pardon, which our current president and the perennial likely candidates for that office are unlikely to give, for Snowden or Assange to ever enjoy themselves freely on U.S. soil. And that's not something that is going to happen as things currently are. Though there is slow growing awakening amongst the populace that it should (in large part due to the efforts of Assange, Snowden, and others like them). You make some good points and I don't disagree with everything you are saying But from my perspective Snowden should get a much worse sentence than Assange. He was an American citizen who truly betrayed his country and the importance of "secrecy" when he worked for the NSA So if I was Snowden I would also be very worried about returning to the USA, he has good reasons. Assange was never an American citizen and due to my lack of understanding of the USA legal system its unclear to me what he could be charged for?

The only thing I care about is this event is being used by some to try to undermine the significance of the feminist movement and the importance of gender equality. I hear some comments like "you see this highlights just what hypocrites Feminists are" We need to realize what Zoe did does not reflect what the campaign for gender equality stands for. This was her personal choice to sleep around and this has basically destroyed her credibility going forward. Lets not use this to try to sling mud at the general feminist and gender equality movement

I know, I was kind of hoping to lure him out. No I've said what I need to say about this, TN is basically echoing what I feel about this matter. So I won't descend from my SJ lair to partake further in this debate

Yeah, there is a real flawed view by the local conspiracy theorists on these forums that Assange will get sent to Sweden and suddenly end up in the USA and be executed. So Assange's objections to be extradited to Sweden is based on the argument " he will be killed by the USA if gets sent to Sweden" And this rumour has been encouraged by Assange to help his case. conspiracy theorists are so easily manipulated. Unlike you, right? I, and several others I believe, have already gone over the oddities in this case. Basically the thing that legally sticks out like a sore thumb to me is the fact that the Swedes are insisting that Assange is extradited to Sweden when he hasn't yet been charged vs. asking for the local police in UK to hear him on their behalf, which is what I believe they'd normally do... Yes I am aware of that view and its not unreasonable But I am not a conspiracy theorist, my view on this matter has been based on the facts and what charges Assange should face in the USA. I just don't know if there is enough motivation for the USA to even apply for extradition once he gets to Sweden, I am saying I hope there is.

Ah, but surely the interview they formally want him for is also just a formality as well? They have, after all, interviewed him previously (then let him leave the country while, yes ironically, leaking the interview) and can/ have held interviews in other countries, in other cases. Given the somewhat... unusual treatment of his case I don't see why he should trust the system at all. While it is a rather roundabout way of doing so getting him to Sweden then not charging him but having a sweetheart extradition to the US would certainly be a legitimate fear, from his perspective. And even if he gets sent to the USA, which I support, what do you think will happen to him there? Guantanamo Bay, ....death sentence? What is the "legitimate fear " he is so worried about?

Yeah, there is a real flawed view by the local conspiracy theorists on these forums that Assange will get sent to Sweden and suddenly end up in the USA and be executed. So Assange's objections to be extradited to Sweden is based on the argument " he will be killed by the USA if gets sent to Sweden" And this rumour has been encouraged by Assange to help his case, conspiracy theorists are so easily manipulated.

I'm not sure where else I should have met them? I'm sure someone who has sailing as a hobby can tell me they have plenty of female sailing friends, yet I have none of those. I know "of" them, but I don't know any on a personal level. It's not meant to sound extraordinary, the whole point is that it's not extraordinary in the first place. There are plenty of woman gamers out there. You meet people with similar interests through shared hobbies and activities. That's how it works. That's why I don't understand why so few people here have that experience. It is not difficult to meet gamer women, no more difficult than it is to meet gamers in general. I'm sure some of you guys have been to LAN parties (at least, before they seemingly disappeared without a trace from the earth)? Gaming days at your local comic book store? Maybe local gaming or anime cons? Yarr, them be wimmin thar. It's not out of the ordinary. I met my girlfriend through a gaming message board and she just happened to live close to me so we met up. I run into them because I have shared interests. The same way I get to know my male friends. I mean, how else do you meet other people? It's not like I stand around wearing a sign saying "to me, gamer girls, to me!" or something. This is an excellent and informed post and its almost impossible to disagree with, nice one

This is another excellent endorsement for the game, these are the types of player reviews I like to read when deciding whether to purchase a game You mention the good and the bad.

Yes but the point is if there is a certain growing demographic, like adult female gamers, and they move to start playing games like RPG then there will be more emphasize on what they expect from games. So logically we should start seeing changes in game design if we haven't already, and this is a good thing

No need to apologize for something you can't help Monte. But that doesn't change the fact we should still be asking " why is there such a lack female participation on these forums and how can we change this" ? I can't be the only one who has noticed the gender disparity on these forums?

I have a packed weekend of events, this afternoon I'm going to a restaurant called Eisbein & Co to eat some good German food. Then I have a braai (barbeque ) in the early evening and then its one of my lady friends birthday celebration so I'm off to a really good club called Movida for shooters and further drinks http://www.movida.co.za/ I expect to be very hangover tomorrow

That's the outcome I hope we see, basically a migration of more adult female gamers to RPG and the more popular genres that run on PC and console. We also could really do with more input from ladies on these forums, there is an irrefutable lack of active female gamers that contribute towards topics and I imagine if more played games like PoE this would change ?

Tigranes are you sure that you weren't playing Risen 3 on easy mode? You may have enabled it by accident which would explain why combat was so easy?

Bruce has been through enough as of late, what with the whole Zoe Quinn fiasco and then AssCreed: Sausage Fest revealing the female character, only to find out she's not playable. No need to (continue to) kick a man when he's down. That's true, I'm a SJ wreck at the moment....no need to exacerbate my fragile emotional state

I don't block anyone- even gimmick accounts who commit grievous insults against the purity of dear sweet logic. If you don't have the discipline not to reply to something pointless you're either taking things far too seriously or should remove yourself from the internet for your own sanity. Or you have far too much time on your hands. Same as me, I've never blocked anyone ever. I just choose not to comment if I don't want to and I also believe if you block someone who you always disagree with you won't ever understand any dissenting opinions. And sometimes different perspectives are important to understand a big picture around a topic

Yeah because Russia would never claim to want to send aid to a region but instead send weapons....oh wait they already did this, you remember Abkhazia? I can understand the concerns from the Ukrainian government but these aid trucks do appear to be legitimate? So hopefully no one does anything to provoke Russia because the civil war is apparently not going well for the separatists and Russia is looking for any excuse to intervene militarily